Important thread on "civility":

You should be aware that we frequently get posters in this forum who claim to be fair-minded independents and that they turn out to be committed conservatives in disguise approximately 95% of the time. Given that you are a street preacher, everyone here is assessing the chance that you are an exception to this as extremely low.

Loaded questions are soft arguments, they are suggestions. An example of an unloaded question would be something like "Do you think this Waters thing is good or bad for the Dems politically?". Yours is loaded.

If you are in fact a legit poster I suggest less questions, more posting what you think, and zero responding to people who attack you.

Cmon with the incivility nonsense. Do I need to remind you all what DVaut1 taught us about the utility of rudeness? Of reinforcing important social norms that have been eroding rapidly before our very eyes?

Hi, ChrisV. I do not claim to be a "fair-minded independent". I am basically a libertarian. I distrust both major parties.

Not sure how the wording of my question was "loaded". I worded it the way I did because it seems that most of the posters around here are progressives. Thanks for the advice though; in the future I will be mindful of not asking loaded questions.

Thank you for your input. I will consider your advice.

While we're on the "95% of the time" kick, almost all of people in my experience who claim the bolded seem WAY too eager to check the Republican box over the Democratic box.

Sure they say they don't like the overly religious, anti-drug, anti-civil liberties stances of the GOP, but they always fall in the direction of tax cuts come voting time.

That is my experience as well. Probably the vast majority of libertarians vote Republican when not voting Libertarian. I myself in the past have either voted Libertarian or Republican in every presidential election that I have voted in. I don't plan on voting either Republican or Democrat ever again. (I have in the past supported Democratic candidates in a small handful of House and local elections.)

The guy protests at abortion clinics. He wants government so small it will fit inside women's bodies.

iron being so scared by the Sanders thing that he went immediately to accusing microbet of wanting to finish off Scalise like

1) micro had even hinted at something like that

and

2) It's not objectively true that America without Steve Scalise would be a better place than one with with him.

is why I'm so confident in my future Trump voter reader. He was ****ing EAGER to embarrass that lefty by accusing him of having principles.

Libertarians are Republicans in denial.

Calling yourself a Libertarian is also a sufficient shield against insults and offense from less informed people even if you believe the same as Republicans.

Yes, I have protested at abortion mills, but I have never trespassed on their property. I am exercising my legal right to free speech, and the women can exercise her legal right to have the abortion.


I tend to me a minimalist when it comes to government. However, I do believe that a government should be big enough to protect the unborn from being slaughtered. But since abortion is legal here in the U.S., my personal focus is on persuasion, not on trying to change the law. (I leave it to others to work on changing the laws of the land regarding abortion.)

addendum: Please respond in the Abortion thread. Don't want to derail this thread.

There are some significant differences between Republicans and Libertarians. I'd say there's is a bigger difference between Republicans and Libertarians than between Republicans and Democrats.

the rare case where the slippery slope argument actually makes sense. If you can hold people accountable in public for representing a deranged and despicable man like Trump, what's next? Publicly shaming folks who supported wars, pervasive surveillance, and unfettered support for American oligarchs? Chuck says no!

No.

Republicans and Democrats are unified in their quest to take your money and tell you what to do. Libertarians want you to keep your money and run your life as you see fit as long as you're not infringing on the liberties of other people.

Forgot to mention that Republicans and Democrats are also unified in their quest to keep us in perpetual war.

That’s just a different way of saying you’re on the side of people with money. Just like the Republicans.

I'm on the side of people who desire liberty and don't want somebody else telling them how to run their lives.

Most libertarians that I've known didn't have a lot of money.

They are stupid.

Libertarians care about the liberty of the factory owner to dump whatever toxic **** he wants in the river, but not so much about the liberty of the people living downstream who get cancer or the people working in his factory in brutal, unsafe conditions.

Speaking for myself, I'd probably favor stricter environmental laws than exist today. I have a right to clean air and clean water, and some corporation doesn't have a right to pollute air and water that belongs to everybody. Liberty includes the right to breathe clean air and drink clean water.

Since I don't think you even know who these people are, for you to say they're stupid would seem to make you kinda stoopid.

I thought you said you were quitting the forum. Why are you still here?

I basically said that I would quit this forum if the folks around here thought that the forum would be better served by my not participating in it any more. I haven't been voted off yet, so I'm still here on the island.

Well let me be the first to formally cast my vote in favor of your exit.

Thank you for voting, and don't forget to pick up your "I Voted" sticker on your way out.