The Tragic Death of the Democratic Party - Page 17 - Politics and Economics

jfc

You used to be a good poster, what happened? Why don't you go over to Iraq and bomb the hell out of them and steal their oil because you have more people than them too.

Come on. Explain why the US Government shouldn't be determined by American citizens with each person having equal representation?

11-12-2016 , 07:41 PM

#402

Lapidator

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Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

How about we get the idea of boycotting Wyoming and not shipping any food or imported goods or all the stuff they need to live there and then we give that up in exchange for equal representation?

This doesn't sound like compromise to me. This sounds like extortion.

Perhaps you can do better?

11-12-2016 , 07:44 PM

#403

awval999

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Heroball

Biden vs. Trump: Who you voting for?

It's much closer.

I don't honestly know off the top of my head.

But MI, PA, WI and OH are much closer as well.

11-12-2016 , 07:45 PM

#404

Huehuecoyotl

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Just need a Democratic relocation program. A couple of million this this or that purple state and violá electoral college solved

11-12-2016 , 07:45 PM

#405

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

This doesn't sound like compromise to me. This sounds like extortion.

Perhaps you can do better?

Really? You were serious? You think one group of Americans should have to trade with another to have equal representation in the federal government?

11-12-2016 , 07:45 PM

#406

Huehuecoyotl

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

I'm having a hard time deciding what is most delicious...

First up... NYT promises to return to the honest reporting of the news.

New York Times: We blew it on Trump

Then there is... you know things are bad when the DNC looks to the Tea Party for an example to follow.

Seething liberals vow revolution in Democratic Party

Perhaps this... political discrimination, Ivy League "cry-ins", and cancelled exams... "best and brightest" tho.

Scenes from the liberal meltdown

I don't think this is the demise of the Democrat Party. Seems like the cognitive dissonance will continue to assert itself.

Yea I'm fine with minorities being afraid, but white college kids will be ok

11-12-2016 , 07:50 PM

#407

sportsjefe

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Quote:

Originally Posted by awval999

It's much closer.

I don't honestly know off the top of my head.

But MI, PA, WI and OH are much closer as well.

OH was T+8. If Ohio gets closer he walks away with the other 3.

11-12-2016 , 07:50 PM

#408

Lapidator

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Quote:

Originally Posted by einbert

It's also important to remember that Trump was elected to install exactly the kind of system the Electoral College represents. It's purpose now is to take power away from black voters and give more power to white voters in swing states. Those 1 to 2 million voters who won the popular vote for Clinton matter, and we're going to continue reminding people of these voters for Trump's entire Presidency. It speaks to the general nature of our times--the argument over whether Black Lives Matter, whether pussy grabbing matters, well now we are going to argue over whether All Votes Matter. And the conversation isn't going away, I can promise you that. It's only beginning.

Quote:

Originally Posted by einbert

Another very good reason to keep bringing up the fact that Hillary won the popular vote by over a million votes: people keep saying Hillary "failed to connect with voters." She absolutely connected with voters. In fact, she connected with 1 to 2 million more voters than Donald Trump did.

But the DNC super-delegate system, tho.

Oh wait, I forgot... Bernie was fine with the outcome.

Carry on.

11-12-2016 , 07:57 PM

#409

Lapidator

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Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

Really? You were serious? You think one group of Americans should have to trade with another to have equal representation in the federal government?

Yes.

Why would rural folks join a political union with city folks if the needs of the rural folks would be overwhelmed by a few neighborhoods of the city folks?

11-12-2016 , 07:59 PM

#410

awval999

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Microbet --- please acknowledge that you at least understand the Connecticut Compromise of the Constitution of the United States.

We have a House of Representatives which is by population.

And a Senate which is equal representation by State.

It is like literally in the Constitution.

The electoral college is a combination of each. Senators + Representatives. It is a compromise of the compromise.

Your whining is like whining that the sky is blue.

11-12-2016 , 08:07 PM

#411

Paul D

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Do you not get that he doesn't think the Constitution is some holy document?

He stated something to that effect.

11-12-2016 , 08:11 PM

#412

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

Yes.

Why would rural folks join a political union with city folks if the needs of the rural folks would be overwhelmed by a few neighborhoods of the city folks?

There are more rural people in California than any other state.

Equal representation for every American in the American government. It's pretty simple.

11-12-2016 , 08:12 PM

#413

einbert

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

But the DNC super-delegate system, tho.

Oh wait, I forgot... Bernie was fine with the outcome.

Carry on.

You have two bad things...you don't do nothing, you change both of them. That's not a defense of the Electoral College, you're basically agreeing with my point here.

11-12-2016 , 08:19 PM

#414

Lapidator

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Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

There are more rural people in California than any other state.

Equal representation for every American in the American government. It's pretty simple.

Ok. Well, that's not how our system works.

But luckily for you, the system can be changed. I suggest if you feel this strongly about it, you look into supporting a movement to amend the Constitution to remove the structure of representation.

Let us know when you get the legislatures of 33 states to agree. I'm guessing you'll get... 10... but that shouldn't stop you from trying.

Perhaps you'll get 12 or 13 if you come up with a good compromise offer.

You are familiar with compromise right? That's that thing where you give up something, in order to get something?

11-12-2016 , 08:23 PM

#415

Lapidator

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Quote:

Originally Posted by einbert

You have two bad things...you don't do nothing, you change both of them. That's not a defense of the Electoral College, you're basically agreeing with my point here.

I do not concede that the EC is a bad thing. I think it is a brilliant compromise agreed to by people who were orders of magnitude smarter then I.

I also think its lol-tastic that the "Democratic" Party is in its official structure non-democratic. Its bewildering that the rank and file members of the Democrat Party are not aghast at the situation.

The gnashing of teeth over the EC by the folks who buried the popular candidate in their own party.

11-12-2016 , 08:28 PM

#416

Paul D

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

The gnashing of teeth over the EC by the folks who buried the popular candidate in their own party.

You shouldn't say stuff like that lol

Spoiler:

11-12-2016 , 08:36 PM

#417

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul D

Do you not get that he doesn't think the Constitution is some holy document?

He stated something to that effect.

Yeah. I understand that it's hard to change and it should be hard to change. If I had my druthers though, that's a change I'd make.

11-12-2016 , 08:38 PM

#418

microbet

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I'm SMPing this whole argument totally outside of what happened this election.

11-12-2016 , 08:41 PM

#419

microbet

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

I do not concede that the EC is a bad thing. I think it is a brilliant compromise agreed to by people who were orders of magnitude smarter then I.

They were good at fractions, like three divided by five.

11-12-2016 , 08:41 PM

#420

Paul D

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I can see both sides of the coin and don't put much thought into it because it won't happen in my lifetime.

11-12-2016 , 08:45 PM

#421

microbet

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And like I said in a previous post, it's my 1 1-billionth of a say of who gets in the senate instead of my 1 200-millionth. I'm not getting too worked up about it.

Besides, I've lived in small states before and I may live in one again after my kids fly the coop. Then I'll own the senate.

11-12-2016 , 08:51 PM

#422

zikzak

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Heroball

Biden vs. Trump: Who you voting for?

It wouldn't matter. He would weep with joy no matter who won.

11-12-2016 , 08:57 PM

#423

will1530

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Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 5,773

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapidator

It doesn't take a constitutional amendment to effectively nullify the electoral college. It technically could be done with just the biggest 13 or so states. They won't all agree to band together and ensure the popular vote winner is the EC winner, but they do have that power as granted by the constitution

11-12-2016 , 09:01 PM

#424

Tien

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I see both sides of argument for popular vote and electoral college.

As a cannuck can anyone explain to me if there is any good behind the super delegate system? It seems to messed up when before primaries even began Clinton had them all locked up.