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Old 07-08-2017, 09:38 AM   #151
Huehuecoyotl
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Quote:
Originally Posted by DVaut1 View Post
14 words is sort strange, though, since like -- that's kind of a lot of words, sort of highly specific (as opposed to five, seven, eight) -- and there's not really a quip or sentence in Trump's speech that is 14 words.

As was always *my* point here (I don't know about everyone else's): there is basically ALWAYS some minimally plausible innocuous explanation for casual and coded racism. Hence the effectiveness of the Raised by Wolves Defense. Why we leap behind the Veil of Ignorance to defend it is highly strange. Take it in a more Bayesian fashion:

- Trump's speech was pretty fascist, clearly written by Miller and itself containing a bunch of white supremacist-y buzzwords and wink/nods
- Sarah Palin is a right-wing populist trying for years now to ingratiate herself to that crowd and build herself a little cottage media industry and notoriety as a defender of the angry white
- the YoungCons are basically a poor man's Breitbart, and their business model is providing right-wing racist claptrap in exchange for clicks

I mean, how *complex* is this, REALLY? Isn't it simply:

- dumb angry whites enjoy racist drivel and
- clickbaiters and media celebrities who share them want their clicks and eyeballs

That's the plan, full stop. That's the entire episode and all you need to know about the potential motivations and incentives of those involved.

That seems markedly different from assuming Hillary Clinton is covering up a child-raping crime syndicate in a pizza store.

Like your post is bad, man. And I like your posts. But this is some pretty ridiculous false equivalencies.

In sum:
- the Raised By Wolves/Feral Child Fallacy is always meant to disquiet conclusions about the truth in cases where *the truth* depends on someone's motivations which can be hard to suss out in isolation and where "well, they're just dumb and clueless?" could always serve to explain any behavior. Taken alone, it can always be true. That's why we let all this information we know about Trump's speech, the YoungCons, Palin, their business model, their audience, their history, etc. enter into the calculation before we make our conclusion. That's *sound* reasoning.
- the critics of Palin need no grand conspiracy other than Palin, clickbaiters, the right-wing ecosystem, etc. sell racism for fun and profit. That also squares and comports with what we know.

Yet again the grand liberal tradition and our search for truth allows us to believe a theory which takes all available information and reconciles with other things we know are true: Sarah Palin sells racist grievances and white people redemption stories to fellow traveler right-wingers and headlining your product with notable racist taglines is part of the business to attraction attention.
Here's another example of the "raised by wolves" routine and how the simplest reading is probably the most correct.

Quote:
For as much as parts of Trump’s speech fit comfortably in a larger tradition of presidential rhetoric, these passages are clear allusions to ideas and ideologies with wide currency on the white nationalist right.

Defenders of the Warsaw speech call this reading “hysterical,” denying any ties between Trump’s rhetoric in Poland and white nationalism. But to deny this interpretation of the speech, one has to ignore the substance of Trump’s campaign, the beliefs of his key advisers, and the context of Poland itself and its anti-immigrant, ultranationalist leadership. One has to ignore the ties between Bannon, Miller, and actual white nationalists, and disregard the active circulation of those ideas within the administration. And one has to pretend that there isn’t a larger intellectual heritage that stretches back to the early 20th century, the peak of American nativism, when white supremacist thinkers like Madison Grant and Lothrop Stoddard penned works with language that wouldn’t feel out of place in Trump’s address.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...aw_speech.html
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Old 07-08-2017, 09:39 AM   #152
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Man, huehuecoytl, stop assuming such unsavory things about Trump, you're making us look like PizzaGaters.
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Old 07-08-2017, 09:41 AM   #153
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Also I can see Palin is also going to skate by to some degree on the old "Ron Paul's newsletters were ghostwritten" defense where we argue things done in your name for your business and brand by staffers under your employ don't count unless you sign them in blood and accompany them with an affidavit ("Sarah Palin signs her own tweets with '-SP', so it wasn't her!").

Hey, but I even ham-handedly granted that was kinda interesting, maybe the most interesting thing about this. That the right-wing ecosystem of casual and coded racism is now bizarrely self-sustaining and organic, perhaps by bots and algorithms. See Microsoft's Twitter bot turning virulently racist in under a day once it was let loose on the internet. I have little doubt one plausible explanation is that the combination of bots, lazy staffers, and only one or two wink/noddy racist types having some good old fashioned white supremacist fun could turn a former Vice Presidential candidate's twitter feed into Stormfront really fast. In fact this may be precisely our future where our algorithms simply inherent what we talk about among ourselves, and for you know 40% of the country, actual human generated content contains metric **** tons of racist chain emails and jokes and memes, and so you'll simply get even more bot-generated racism spread quickly and disseminated widely in places you wouldn't expect. Totally believable.

Note however Microsoft took their Tweetbot offline in a day and apologized.

Last edited by DVaut1; 07-08-2017 at 09:48 AM.
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Old 07-08-2017, 09:43 AM   #154
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by chezlaw View Post
'Extrapolates' is a top euphemism. I may use it in future instead of 'making things up'.
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Originally Posted by All-In Flynn View Post
The people who can't handle the Flyperbole and melt down and become embittered and obsessed with him are all giant pussies with a side of sore loser.
.
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Old 07-08-2017, 09:51 AM   #155
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Fly makes me smile a lot. I dont think he or others get that when I'm responding to him and the flybies doing their 'extrapolating' - try reading it with amusement on your face and your perception will change dramatically.

I confess to really struggling to understand how people take all the banter so seriously.
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Old 07-08-2017, 09:54 AM   #156
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by chezlaw View Post
Fly makes me smile a lot.

I do really struggle to understand how people take all the banter so seriously.
Uh, but like, remember how you reacted when people criticized BruceZ?

It's like 3 years later and your meltdown so memorable we're STILL talking about it bro. In fact your mission to defend his honor continues in P7 or whatever it's called.

So what the **** are you talking about, you must understand intuitively. Experience is the greatest teacher.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:02 AM   #157
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by chezlaw View Post
Fly makes me smile a lot. I dont think he or others get that when I'm responding to him and the flybies doing their 'extrapolating' - try reading it with amusement on your face and your perception will change dramatically.

I confess to really struggling to understand how people take all the banter so seriously.
Yes, you definitely sound legitimately amused and not in the least bit suffering from chronic proctalgia.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:03 AM   #158
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl View Post
Here's another example of the "raised by wolves" routine and how the simplest reading is probably the most correct.



http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...aw_speech.html
Wait, people are actually saying the speech wasn't Turner Diaries For Dummies?

Even the Palin/YoungCons is less obvious.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:04 AM   #159
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Quote:
Originally Posted by DVaut1 View Post
Uh, but like, remember how you reacted when people criticized BruceZ?

It's like 3 years later and your meltdown so memorable we're STILL talking about it bro. In fact your mission to defend his honor continues in P7 or whatever it's called.

So what the **** are you talking about, you must understand intuitively. Experience is the greatest teacher.
Occasional serious things happen on the forum. That doesn't mean most of what happens on the forum isn't.

It's not that tricky. Fly is generally very entertaining and most of the forum stuff is intrinsically amusing or ridiculous enough to provide surreal amusement (which is even better)

Quote:
Originally Posted by All-In Flynn View Post
Yes, you definitely sound legitimately amused and not in the least bit suffering from chronic proctalgia.
Well they seem more bothered by me than I am by them but I assume they're not really taking it as seriously as they sound.

There's in between stuff. What's happened to Clovis is bad but that's what people want so it's what you've got.

Last edited by chezlaw; 07-08-2017 at 10:15 AM.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:05 AM   #160
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Don't count supporting Israel as not being antisemitic. It really doesn't prove anything. Conservatives of all stripes like Israel. Those Jews are nationalists, militarist, fight Muslims, and they're not here.
It's obvious I think, but I want to clarify that I meant that from the perspective of conservatives. Certainly not all Israelis fit the description of its right wing government. There's a very large peace movement there.

Last edited by microbet; 07-08-2017 at 10:32 AM.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:06 AM   #161
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

I'm going to make one more post and then take some time away from this forum, which frankly saddens me. I'm sure many of you will stop reading at this point, fingers poised to type the inevitable "good riddance", "cya", "glad we got rid of another right-wing stooge" posts. This will also be a tldr post so please feel free to ignore.

I have been playing poker for 15 years and learned much of what I know about the game on this site. I'm not famous as a poker player, just a marginally profitable local cash grinder. I have however been deeply immersed in the poker community which has convinced me that poker players are, on average, more intelligent than the average population. This led me to the politics section of this site, in hopes of learning from intelligent people who are rational and employ logic and reason. I have learned a lot from the politics forum on this site.

I have unfortunately noticed a significant change in this sub-forum over the past year. More an more it is simply a echo chamber where everyone tries to out scream each other and claim the label of most extreme poster. Myself included.

I have no doubt many of the disagreements I have gotten into on this site have been largely my fault because I was either flat out wrong or doing a poor job explaining my position. I have learned a lot from these debates as I find disagreement enlightening. I have no problem with being challenged when I am wrong. I thrive on it. I run a small company and have 50 employees. My staff know they are expected to challenge me and the absolutely best ones want my job. This is how the best ideas get to the top.

This being said, the last couple days I have been widely attacked on this site and defended by only one poster. I honesty cannot figure out what my crime was other than;

1) not being extreme enough; and
2) Wanting us to stand by our principals and allow for nuanced discussion.

It was not enough that I called Palin a racist, awful human and one of the worst politicians currently active. I wouldn't call her a white supremacist so this instantly made me the enemy and even a likely GOP stooge.

Even this morning people are still posting that there is no value in differentiating a racist from a white supremacist and that ALL republicans are the latter.

How is this healthy debate?

It appears the widely held opinion here is that all republicans, everyone who has ever voted republican, or even held a “republican” idea is an extreme radical and white supremacist. I'm also a likely GOP racist because I'm not extreme enough to follow the above.

Do we really think this is a position from which our side is going to win.

I’ve seen many right wing posters enter this thread and us pounce on them instantly. I HAVE JOINED IN THE LYNCHING! Look around there are no other voices here. None. Some of these were obvious trolls but are we all sure ALL of them were?

You have now successfully silenced me as well. Someone who has spent their life working with left-wing politics. Someone who has joined in the screaming and even been banned a couple times for not following my own advice. I too am now not extreme enough. I am sure some of the right wing lurkers are laughing their ass off right now and I don't blame them. I would be too if the situation were reversed.

I hate to say it because I love this forum but it is moving slowly in the direction of 4chan and /theDonald where the only point is to reinforce our hatred of the other side even if that means posting obvious nonsense. Soon we will have our own pizza-gate and nobody will notice how it happened.

I am active on a reddit forum called “Change my View” where the quality of discourse is more important than the content. I am going to look for something similar for politics because I think this forum has hurt my ability to be rational as it fed my hatred. It has made me worse as discussing these important issues, not better.

Anyway, I may still lurk and I wish you all the best but it saddens me that it really feels like our side is adopting the tenor and tactics of the alt-right more and more and it doesn't seem to be alarming enough people.

For those people on this site like Dvaut, ChrisV and Microbet who are great posters, I apologize for painting with too broad a brush. Like all communities, there are the good and the bad. It just feels like the bad is winning out right now.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:07 AM   #162
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by David Sklansky View Post
German soldiers who were OK with concentration camps were terrible people. Same with ISIS soldiers who are OK with their atrocities. Same with those who were OK with slavery in the mid 1800s or OK with men, women and colored restrooms in the 1950s (earlier dates might be excusable). Same also with those cigarette company executives who testified before congress as well as their immediate underlings, even if they were Democrats. They are all worse than any Senator.
All the factory and farm workers at the tobacco companies knew too. They sure know now. So does anyone who works at 7/11 and sells a pack.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:10 AM   #163
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Don't count supporting Israel as not being antisemitic. It really doesn't prove anything. Conservatives of all stripes like Israel. Those Jews are nationalists, militarist, fight Muslims, and they're not here.
I made this point at some point in the past few days but there IS a bit of a "racist asshat" spectrum. On the one hand are most deplorable American types who haven't thought that deeply about it, and want to see racial and religious minorities brought to heel and see them suffer as second-class citizens. Then there's the faux intellectual ethno-nationalist ******* who believes basically things like "white Christians control things here in the US and Europe, Jews go over there in Israel, Asians in the East, Africans to Africa." As you note, tons of deplorables LOVE the notion of Israel. Some are religious types who simply want Israel to exist and then be blown away to fulfill a prophecy. Others want Israel to exist because they see a state that abuses Palestinians is a valuable example; and because they think "Western Values" defenders have some sort of 'legitimate' place to demand Jews self-deport to.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:27 AM   #164
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Clovis,

Thanks for the shoutout. Fly is really the only one who yelled at you. He's yelled at me too. But, a break from this forum is probably a good idea for every single one of us. Not that I'm taking one now.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:33 AM   #165
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by Clovis8 View Post
I'm going to make one more post and then take some time away from this forum, which frankly saddens me. I'm sure many of you will stop reading at this point, fingers poised to type the inevitable "good riddance", "cya", "glad we got rid of another right-wing stooge" posts. This will also be a tldr post so please feel free to ignore.

I have been playing poker for 15 years and learned much of what I know about the game on this site. I'm not famous as a poker player, just a marginally profitable local cash grinder. I have however been deeply immersed in the poker community which has convinced me that poker players are, on average, more intelligent than the average population. This led me to the politics section of this site, in hopes of learning from intelligent people who are rational and employ logic and reason. I have learned a lot from the politics forum on this site.

I have unfortunately noticed a significant change in this sub-forum over the past year. More an more it is simply a echo chamber where everyone tries to out scream each other and claim the label of most extreme poster. Myself included.

I have no doubt many of the disagreements I have gotten into on this site have been largely my fault because I was either flat out wrong or doing a poor job explaining my position. I have learned a lot from these debates as I find disagreement enlightening. I have no problem with being challenged when I am wrong. I thrive on it. I run a small company and have 50 employees. My staff know they are expected to challenge me and the absolutely best ones want my job. This is how the best ideas get to the top.

This being said, the last couple days I have been widely attacked on this site and defended by only one poster. I honesty cannot figure out what my crime was other than;

1) not being extreme enough; and
2) Wanting us to stand by our principals and allow for nuanced discussion.

It was not enough that I called Palin a racist, awful human and one of the worst politicians currently active. I wouldn't call her a white supremacist so this instantly made me the enemy and even a likely GOP stooge.

Even this morning people are still posting that there is no value in differentiating a racist from a white supremacist and that ALL republicans are the latter.

How is this healthy debate?

It appears the widely held opinion here is that all republicans, everyone who has ever voted republican, or even held a “republican” idea is an extreme radical and white supremacist. I'm also a likely GOP racist because I'm not extreme enough to follow the above.

Do we really think this is a position from which our side is going to win.

I’ve seen many right wing posters enter this thread and us pounce on them instantly. I HAVE JOINED IN THE LYNCHING! Look around there are no other voices here. None. Some of these were obvious trolls but are we all sure ALL of them were?

You have now successfully silenced me as well. Someone who has spent their life working with left-wing politics. Someone who has joined in the screaming and even been banned a couple times for not following my own advice. I too am now not extreme enough. I am sure some of the right wing lurkers are laughing their ass off right now and I don't blame them. I would be too if the situation were reversed.

I hate to say it because I love this forum but it is moving slowly in the direction of 4chan and /theDonald where the only point is to reinforce our hatred of the other side even if that means posting obvious nonsense. Soon we will have our own pizza-gate and nobody will notice how it happened.

I am active on a reddit forum called “Change my View” where the quality of discourse is more important than the content. I am going to look for something similar for politics because I think this forum has hurt my ability to be rational as it fed my hatred. It has made me worse as discussing these important issues, not better.

Anyway, I may still lurk and I wish you all the best but it saddens me that it really feels like our side is adopting the tenor and tactics of the alt-right more and more and it doesn't seem to be alarming enough people.

For those people on this site like Dvaut, ChrisV and Microbet who are great posters, I apologize for painting with too broad a brush. Like all communities, there are the good and the bad. It just feels like the bad is winning out right now.
This is a thread about Trump so I'm not going to keep going into it but there were plenty of threads about the Tea Party if you search.

This convo reminds me of a Rolling Stone article by Matt Taibbi about Palin Tea Party rallies.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...party-20100928

His theory is that they are either racist or too dumb and self absorbed to be aware of the racism of their actions.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:37 AM   #166
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Damn, I edited that post responding to ChrisV when I meant to quote myself, it's too late to change it and now it's kind of orphaned.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:37 AM   #167
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Quote:
Originally Posted by Our House View Post
Rehashing as usual, but is it true that if Trump somehow succeeds at squashing just 2 things, Mueller's investigation and fair elections, it's game over for America with no turning back?

I'm much more worried today than I was yesterday.
Federal elections are ran by the individual States.

So to stop "fair elections" (whatever that means) it more than just passing one bill at the federal level.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:43 AM   #168
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

I hesitate to wade into this war between Clovis and Fly, and I've been mostly off line for a few days, but here is my two cents.

I think there is some nuance here, but it is not a nuance that I care about when deciding whether Sarah Palin is a blight on humanity.

People like Sarah Palin willingly spend time in the media cesspool of the alt-right. They read and laugh at the memes, slogans, and clickbait articles. They meet, greet and want support from the sorts of idiots that are responsible for those memes, slogans and articles, most of whom are racists and a smaller subset of whom are actually affiliated with white supremacist organizations.

Over time, the language of the alt-right meme armies more and more becomes the language of people like Palin. Sometimes, she uses coded phrases like "14 words" without a clear sense of how the phrase crept into her lexicon or the origin of the phrase. Maybe it was something she picked up from an alt-right clickbait that "destroyed" the libtards. She doesn't really care if the origin of the term is racist or whatever, because caring about such things is for oversensitive libtards. (As an aside, the white supremacist meaning of the phrase is somewhat obscure among the general public. I just asked my wife whether she had ever heard that phrase, and she said no.)

Other times, she knowingly uses phrases that she knows have a double meaning (like "14 words") to provoke those same libtards and win the affection of the alt-right meme armies.

I don't know which category this particular use of "14 words" falls into. And I don't care. One of the reasons I don't care is because Sarah Palin herself doesn't care if phrases like 14 words have origins in white supremacy. And if she doesn't care about something like that, then she can float away on the same iceberg with the white supremacists as far as I'm concerned. The distinction between a white supremacist, and someone who doesn't care if she is adopting the language of white supremacists, is too subtle to be of much concern.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:10 AM   #169
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

I can't figure out why you guys find Fly so entertaining or fear him so much. He just yells a lot and make bad iterations of DVaut's posts, with frequent logical mistakes added on top.

This is a predominantly "left-wing" sub forum (or at least the American version of leftist). I don't get what so important about Fly that make you guys think he's somewhat tolerable.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:14 AM   #170
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

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Originally Posted by simplicitus View Post
Fly is very good at spotting racism
Sort of like a guy who calls every river is a "very good" bluff catcher.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:18 AM   #171
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Dunking on trolls and mouth breathers seems to be the great pastime of this subforum. I enjoy it sometimes, but there are some persistent asshats that I wish everyone would just ignore.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:19 AM   #172
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ive View Post
Also, a true thing: If you notice Fly caught a temp-b then rest assured a thread somewhere got good.
Truth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clovis8 View Post
I'm going to make one more post and then take some time away from this forum, which frankly saddens me. I'm sure many of you will stop reading at this point, fingers poised to type the inevitable "good riddance", "cya", "glad we got rid of another right-wing stooge" posts. This will also be a tldr post so please feel free to ignore.

I have been playing poker for 15 years and learned much of what I know about the game on this site. I'm not famous as a poker player, just a marginally profitable local cash grinder. I have however been deeply immersed in the poker community which has convinced me that poker players are, on average, more intelligent than the average population. This led me to the politics section of this site, in hopes of learning from intelligent people who are rational and employ logic and reason. I have learned a lot from the politics forum on this site.

I have unfortunately noticed a significant change in this sub-forum over the past year. More an more it is simply a echo chamber where everyone tries to out scream each other and claim the label of most extreme poster. Myself included.

I have no doubt many of the disagreements I have gotten into on this site have been largely my fault because I was either flat out wrong or doing a poor job explaining my position. I have learned a lot from these debates as I find disagreement enlightening. I have no problem with being challenged when I am wrong. I thrive on it. I run a small company and have 50 employees. My staff know they are expected to challenge me and the absolutely best ones want my job. This is how the best ideas get to the top.

This being said, the last couple days I have been widely attacked on this site and defended by only one poster. I honesty cannot figure out what my crime was other than;

1) not being extreme enough; and
2) Wanting us to stand by our principals and allow for nuanced discussion.

It was not enough that I called Palin a racist, awful human and one of the worst politicians currently active. I wouldn't call her a white supremacist so this instantly made me the enemy and even a likely GOP stooge.

Even this morning people are still posting that there is no value in differentiating a racist from a white supremacist and that ALL republicans are the latter.

How is this healthy debate?

It appears the widely held opinion here is that all republicans, everyone who has ever voted republican, or even held a “republican” idea is an extreme radical and white supremacist. I'm also a likely GOP racist because I'm not extreme enough to follow the above.

Do we really think this is a position from which our side is going to win.

I’ve seen many right wing posters enter this thread and us pounce on them instantly. I HAVE JOINED IN THE LYNCHING! Look around there are no other voices here. None. Some of these were obvious trolls but are we all sure ALL of them were?

You have now successfully silenced me as well. Someone who has spent their life working with left-wing politics. Someone who has joined in the screaming and even been banned a couple times for not following my own advice. I too am now not extreme enough. I am sure some of the right wing lurkers are laughing their ass off right now and I don't blame them. I would be too if the situation were reversed.

I hate to say it because I love this forum but it is moving slowly in the direction of 4chan and /theDonald where the only point is to reinforce our hatred of the other side even if that means posting obvious nonsense. Soon we will have our own pizza-gate and nobody will notice how it happened.

I am active on a reddit forum called “Change my View” where the quality of discourse is more important than the content. I am going to look for something similar for politics because I think this forum has hurt my ability to be rational as it fed my hatred. It has made me worse as discussing these important issues, not better.

Anyway, I may still lurk and I wish you all the best but it saddens me that it really feels like our side is adopting the tenor and tactics of the alt-right more and more and it doesn't seem to be alarming enough people.

For those people on this site like Dvaut, ChrisV and Microbet who are great posters, I apologize for painting with too broad a brush. Like all communities, there are the good and the bad. It just feels like the bad is winning out right now.
You made this post because you're a big baby who can't handle an L.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:19 AM   #173
KellyRae
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet View Post
Clovis,

Thanks for the shoutout. Fly is really the only one who yelled at you. He's yelled at me too. But, a break from this forum is probably a good idea for every single one of us. Not that I'm taking one now.
Yelling may not have been the best term, but it wasn't just Fly.

Last edited by KellyRae; 07-08-2017 at 11:34 AM.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:26 AM   #174
DVaut1
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Since we're on another round of "let's litigate Fly" and I've been referenced a few times as "one of the good ones" or whatever, I feel fit to comment here.

I'll just this as a jumping off point:

Quote:
Originally Posted by All-In Flynn View Post
The people who can't handle the Flyperbole and melt down and become embittered and obsessed with him are all giant pussies with a side of sore loser.
True story I believe deeply: part of Fly's deep offenses to white guys on the internet is entirely cultural. ~Most white guys or at least a certain class of them are perfectly happy to offend others in ways that they can bet they won't be subjected to. Or laugh along with it, or embrace it as schtick. Cruelness and derision is everywhere. Just look around. Much of it done justifiably or under the guise of humor, of entertainment. Lots of civil discourse is frankly boring.

But very rarely are white guys the subject of the cruelty or the butt of the joke. That is, part of white guy privilege in America is the unspoken conceit that we treat each other (white guys) with respect. With civility. That is rarely afforded to women and racial minorities. Or the poor. Or other losers. They can be the subject of jokes, derision, be subject to pedantic explanations, a complete lack of empathy.

You can sense tons of white guy offense isn't that Fly's abrasive style is OBJECTIVELY offensive. If it was, plenty of you would be absolutely aghast, simply despondent at the state of the world. It's only CONTEXTUALLY offensive. The great offense of white guys on the internet is that they never expect to be treated like that. Because the world is full of Fly's. I am quite convinced in the right context, many of you embrace the Fly persona. I'm quite sure I do. It's common. Life is boring, and we get entertainment by mocking and being trangressive with those different from us. It's common!

That is to say, you should be a little shocked that people react to Fly with what is entirely common human behavior. Like they are special, precious flowers given the enormous amounts of anger, cruelty, and apathy in the world. The amount of people who are entertained by heaping all of that on others. But once you come to terms with the fact tons of white guys ARE treaed exactly like special, precious flowers for all of their lives by their Moms, maybe their Dads, by their love interests (if they have them), by their teachers, society at large, etc. then I suppose some of the surprise goes away.

So if I'm supposed to be "the good one" and the voice of reason here, then people who get super bothered by Fly should read what I say above and take it very seriously because I mean it and believe it deeply.

Last edited by DVaut1; 07-08-2017 at 11:32 AM.
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Old 07-08-2017, 11:29 AM   #175
Yuv
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Re: The Presidency of Donald J. Trump

Either that, or he's a bad poster who makes bad arguments and swears a lot. You know, one of those two theories.
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