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Russia's +EV Investment In Trump Russia's +EV Investment In Trump

03-21-2018 , 03:25 AM
How many non-neutral Trump administration actions can you think of off-hand? I'm drawing somewhat of a blank and forgetting loads of them myself, so hopefully the forum can help compose a master list.

We all know Trump looks compromised by Russia, and we know this list will be hella lopsided. It would be interesting to see exactly how compromised he really is (or isn't - maybe he just ran super bad at coin tosses, who knows?).

Here's a start. Refine if necessary:

Pro-Russia
DO NOT CONGRATULATE
Supported Brexit
Zero badmouthing Putin or Russia
Tried to eliminate Ukraine sanctions week 1 in office
Imposed new trade tariffs (?)
Purposely didn't reaffirm Article 5 of NATO
Leaked classified intel during Oval Office meeting
"You think we're so innocent? We got a lot of killers too."
Failed to impose sanctions for 2016 election interference
Withdrew from Paris Climate Accord (?)
Changed Ukraine GOP platform language during convention
"They saved us payroll money" after Russia expelled US diplomats

Anti-Russia


(?) means I think it affects Russia, but I'm not sure. There's also the general ripping apart of Democracy, which helps Russia's agenda, but becomes too numerous to keep track of at times.
03-21-2018 , 09:40 PM
I remember 2 more pros. The first is thanks to today's news about Mueller's cooperating witness.

1) Siding with Saudi Arabia and UAE against Qatar last year when Russia had that massive fake news campaign about terrorism and they clearly preferred Trump's position. This isn't all that direct though, considering both Trump and Kushner had strong financial reasons to go against Qatar as well.
2) Allowing 2018 and 2020 election tampering.
03-22-2018 , 10:00 AM
Russia isn't really doing much that is +EV.

Compared to their natural wealth and enormous resources, their economic growth has been very low.
They're heavily mired in every conflict they have entered in the last 20 years.
They're playing an extremely wobbly foreign relations game, betting on very unstable entities that will leave very unpredictable power vacuums when key persons die
They have enormous problems with corruption and inefficiency
Pro-Russia nationalism will hit them hard down the line when outlying regions muster their own nationalism
They're at odds with most major players on the international economic arena
Their top dog is stable, but the government and bureaucracy he leads is not

There is very little that is competent about Russia's policies. They are certainly direct and have heavy impact, but they're not really achieving anything worthwhile. The bet on Trump is just another line of shortsighted idiocy that will eventually bite them in the rear.

It's an incompetent government led more by image than actual results. It's a bit like wearing a large shirt mask your obesity. It might gain you some positives, but at the end of the day that big stairwell is going to be just as bothersome.
03-23-2018 , 07:36 AM
TD,

Even if Russia makes poor, -EV foreign policy decisions, it doesn't change the fact that they've been quite successful in disrupting US Democracy the last few years. Trump is clearly an attack against the country, and Russia seems to have cultivated a winning hand by helping to install him as POTUS. It's not limited to Trump either. They seem to have some sort of control over other American politicians, as well as organizations, news & social media coverage, and even events that they've caused or influenced with the help of both witting and unwitting US citizens.

From what I understand, Russia invested/spent around $200 million on the 2016 election efforts alone. I'm not sure what other costs were incurred, but that's fairly cheap considering what they got in return so far. Nobody had any items to add to the list in the OP yet, but I'm certain there's a hell of a lot I overlooked. That's just political policy on it's own - ignoring other benefits oligarchs have gained from money laundering, real estate purchases, the stock market, oil & gas profits, etc. etc. And remember that Putin gets a piece from each oligarch; up to 50% according to Magnitsky's lawyer Bill Browder.

Forum Trumpkins are more than welcome to suggest any and all anti-Russia actions Trump has taken. I just don't see anything substantial. Huckabitch tried to make a case from the podium about 2 weeks ago that Trump's been way tougher on Russia than any previous presidents. I obviously don't see it. Her biggest selling point was increased military spending, which she claimed "Russia can't be happy about." A load of bunk intended to impress her audience of one and a bunch of naive deplorables.
03-24-2018 , 10:22 AM
Hello Comrade!
03-24-2018 , 10:52 AM
I used to hate Putin for whatever reason but man is this guy legit. The Russian peoples got saved by the collar when he succeeded Eltsine, and apparently they realise it.
03-26-2018 , 10:09 AM
Utterly shocking update: The Trump admin takes an anti-Russia action. New (numbered) list...

Pro-Russia
1. DO NOT CONGRATULATE
2. Supported Brexit
3. Zero badmouthing Putin or Russia
4. Tried to eliminate Ukraine sanctions week 1 in office
5. Imposed new trade tariffs (?)
6. Purposely didn't reaffirm Article 5 of NATO
7. Leaked classified intel during Oval Office meeting
8. "You think we're so innocent? We got a lot of killers too."
9. Failed to impose sanctions for 2016 election interference
10. Withdrew from Paris Climate Accord (?)
11. Changed Ukraine GOP platform language during convention
12. "They saved us payroll money" after Russia expelled US diplomats
13. Sided against Qatar
14. Refused to protect 2018/2020 elections

Anti-Russia
1. Expels 60 Russians due to UK poisoning
03-26-2018 , 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Our House
TD,

Even if Russia makes poor, -EV foreign policy decisions, it doesn't change the fact that they've been quite successful in disrupting US Democracy the last few years. Trump is clearly an attack against the country, and Russia seems to have cultivated a winning hand by helping to install him as POTUS. It's not limited to Trump either. They seem to have some sort of control over other American politicians, as well as organizations, news & social media coverage, and even events that they've caused or influenced with the help of both witting and unwitting US citizens.

From what I understand, Russia invested/spent around $200 million on the 2016 election efforts alone. I'm not sure what other costs were incurred, but that's fairly cheap considering what they got in return so far. Nobody had any items to add to the list in the OP yet, but I'm certain there's a hell of a lot I overlooked. That's just political policy on it's own - ignoring other benefits oligarchs have gained from money laundering, real estate purchases, the stock market, oil & gas profits, etc. etc. And remember that Putin gets a piece from each oligarch; up to 50% according to Magnitsky's lawyer Bill Browder.

Forum Trumpkins are more than welcome to suggest any and all anti-Russia actions Trump has taken. I just don't see anything substantial. Huckabitch tried to make a case from the podium about 2 weeks ago that Trump's been way tougher on Russia than any previous presidents. I obviously don't see it. Her biggest selling point was increased military spending, which she claimed "Russia can't be happy about." A load of bunk intended to impress her audience of one and a bunch of naive deplorables.
Holy smokes, surprised Putin hasn't ended up whacked at those prices. Oligarchs must believe their lives in Russia are better with the devil they know.
03-26-2018 , 08:53 PM
03-26-2018 , 09:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Our House
Utterly shocking update: The Trump admin takes an anti-Russia action. New (numbered) list...

Pro-Russia
1. DO NOT CONGRATULATE
2. Supported Brexit
3. Zero badmouthing Putin or Russia
4. Tried to eliminate Ukraine sanctions week 1 in office
5. Imposed new trade tariffs (?)
6. Purposely didn't reaffirm Article 5 of NATO
7. Leaked classified intel during Oval Office meeting
8. "You think we're so innocent? We got a lot of killers too."
9. Failed to impose sanctions for 2016 election interference
10. Withdrew from Paris Climate Accord (?)
11. Changed Ukraine GOP platform language during convention
12. "They saved us payroll money" after Russia expelled US diplomats
13. Sided against Qatar
14. Refused to protect 2018/2020 elections

Anti-Russia
1. Expels 60 Russians due to UK poisoning
You must have loved Reagan since he had the opposite stance on most of those issues.
03-27-2018 , 05:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praetor1an
You must have loved Reagan since he had the opposite stance on most of those issues.
It's basically all we talked about at my elementary school.

Also, Russia not helping to elect Reagan made it less of an issue.

      
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