Ron Paul 2012 Containment Thread - Page 417 - Politics and Economics

Two Plus Two Forums Other Topics Politics

Ron Paul 2012 Containment Thread

...

Page 417 of 844

First

217 317 367 397 407 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 427 437 467 517 617

Last

Page 417 of 844

First

217 317 367 397 407 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 427 437 467 517 617

Last

12-29-2011 , 11:43 AM

#10401

Fermion5

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 8,381

if it goes through, when will the ad appear on 2p2? how much time do i have to decide on donation?

12-29-2011 , 11:58 AM

#10402

DMACM

banned

Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,917

I've been wanting to donate to Ron Paul. Is an ad here the most bang for your buck right now though?

12-29-2011 , 12:03 PM

#10403

The 13th 4postle

banned

Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 11,244

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMACM

I've been wanting to donate to Ron Paul. Is an ad here the most bang for your buck right now though?

I would think so. The AD would be targeted to a group of potential voters that is sympathetic to his cause of freedom and liberty and might get some poker pros to fork over some money for his campaign.

12-29-2011 , 12:07 PM

#10404

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,568

It's a good point, but you should still donate directly to Ron Paul if you can. I donated a few hundo back when I was still working, and would continue to donate if I had the money to. What little money I do have, aside from gas and food and all that, I need to put into musical equipment and stuff for my band since we're just about to start playing gigs and thinking about recording a demo or an EP.

12-29-2011 , 12:14 PM

#10405

seattlelou

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 31,584

Ron Paul's World http://campaignstops.blogs.nytimes.c...n-pauls-world/

12-29-2011 , 12:17 PM

#10406

orestto

adept

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,084

LirvA, please send me a PM with details, I can pitch in.

12-29-2011 , 12:25 PM

#10407

DVaut1

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 30,005

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMACM

I've been wanting to donate to Ron Paul. Is an ad here the most bang for your buck right now though?

Quote:

Originally Posted by The 13th 4postle

Quote:

Originally Posted by LirvA

It's a good point, but you should still donate directly to Ron Paul if you can.

Actually, and sincerely, you should just donate directly to the campaign to get the best bang for your buck. I've been vocal that I think Paul's political acumen is not great.

However, I'd let a random professional campaign manager decide (who has the complete picture and more information of where resources are best spent) to handle money to help Paul get elected before I tried to make that determination myself. The fitness of an ad on 2p2 is not relevant to my point, but as an aside, it's probably not great ROI for a lot of reasons.

Just give it directly to the campaign.

12-29-2011 , 12:34 PM

#10408

FourFins

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 698

Quote:

Originally Posted by seattlelou

Ron Paul's World http://campaignstops.blogs.nytimes.c...n-pauls-world/

Quote:

Finally, there’s Paul’s stance on the most pervasive conspiracy theory in America today, the idea that the 9/11 terrorist attacks were perpetrated not by Al Qaeda, but by the federal government or some other shadowy force. While Paul has never explicitly endorsed this claim, there is a reason so many 9/11 “truthers” flock to his campaign. In a recent YouTube video posted by a leading 9/11 conspiracy group, “We Are Change,” Paul is asked, “Why won’t you come out about the truth about 9/11?”"

LOL journalism.

Last edited by FourFins; 12-29-2011 at 12:44 PM.

12-29-2011 , 12:40 PM

#10409

LirvA

banned

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 43,568

Quote:

Originally Posted by orestto

LirvA, please send me a PM with details, I can pitch in.

Can someone please send him a private message? I'm on my cell phone about to crash and I can't message can right now.

12-29-2011 , 12:43 PM

#10410

General Tsao

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 30,575

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMACM

I've been wanting to donate to Ron Paul. Is an ad here the most bang for your buck right now though?

i really doubt it.

i totally don't understand this ad on 2+2 goal at all, no offense dudes.

12-29-2011 , 01:01 PM

#10411

Mayo

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 50,960

Quote:

Originally Posted by FourFins

LOL journalism.

LOL leaving out the next paragraph, which contained Paul's response:

Quote:

Rather than answer, say, that the “9/11 Commission already investigated the attacks,” or ask the questioner what particular element of “the truth” remained unknown, Paul knowingly replied, “Because I can’t handle the controversy, I have the I.M.F., the Federal Reserve to deal with, the I.R.S. to deal with, no because I just have more, too many things on my plate. Because I just have too much to do.”

12-29-2011 , 01:26 PM

#10412

prana

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 8,513

Quote:

Originally Posted by sterlinguini

Today I'm winning hard at failing to understand what the heck people are talking about. Go to any article about Ron Paul on any corporate site. Look at the comments. Half of them are "He is a racist, sexist, blahblahblah."

I'm sorry if you guys think you've somehow solved the issue, and maybe in relation to this forums audience you can be correct to some degree, but for the public at large they are skimming the headlines and getting out of it that RP is a racist who wrote those newsletters.

Showing that his crime was negligence and not racism is still important, because negligence is a more forgivable sin than racism. Iz not so complicated, you see?

Go argue with them then? Everyone here is arguing a different point altogether but you guys keep posting Ron Paul isn't racist because he stood by a black dude photos. I'm not buying the idea that we should forgive him because it's just negligence crap either. Sorry. He knew about these things and has lied about how much he knew at least once. This whole idea of forgiving someone who profited off of racist stuff because they didn't write the stuff is pretty iffy as well imo.

12-29-2011 , 01:33 PM

#10413

Max Raker

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,738

Quote:

Originally Posted by General Tsao

i really doubt it.

i totally don't understand this ad on 2+2 goal at all, no offense dudes.

Are there no legality issues with private adds like this? One obvious reason to give to 2+2 instead of Paul directly is if you've already maxed out your contributions to paul. I believe superpacs basically allow people to do this...but they are also registered and have a different legal standing than a group of posters here pooling their money to buy an ad.

12-29-2011 , 01:35 PM

#10414

zikzak

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 22,198

Death Penalty For Gays: Ron Paul Courts The Religious Fringe In Iowa

Quote:

Paul’s Iowa chair, Drew Ivers, recently touted the endorsement of Rev. Phillip G. Kayser, a pastor at the Dominion Covenant Church in Nebraska who also draws members from Iowa, putting out a press release praising “the enlightening statements he makes on how Ron Paul’s approach to government is consistent with Christian beliefs.” But Kayser’s views on homosexuality go way beyond the bounds of typical anti-gay evangelical politics and into the violent fringe: he recently authored a paper arguing for criminalizing homosexuality and even advocated imposing the death penalty against offenders based on his reading of Biblical law.

...

Reached by phone, Kayser confirmed to TPM that he believed in reinstating Biblical punishments for homosexuals — including the death penalty...

...

Mike Heath, who became Ron Paul’s Iowa state director this fall, has spent his career on the Christian right. In Iowa, Heath has focused on outreach to the religious community in the state, where Paul has made an effort to target evangelical voters.

...

As a prominent figure in Maine, Heath slowly alienated the Christian right in the state with his extreme tactics. ... The result was that his own organization suspended him for a month.

...

From 2008-2010, Heath served as chairman of the board of Americans for Truth About Homosexuality. AFTAH is a fringe, anti-gay organization and has been listed as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center for promoting false information. For example, the organization and its founder, Peter LaBarbera, have published false reports about LGBT people, including allegations that they live shorter lives and that they are prone to pedophilia. LaBarbera disputes the SPLC’s label.

Ron Paul continuing to do his part to destroy libertarianism in the US.

Do any of you supporters ever get nostalgic for the Fall of 2011 when MSM was ignoring Paul?

12-29-2011 , 01:40 PM

#10415

bgomez89

adept

Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 972

Ron Paul wants to kill gays

12-29-2011 , 01:41 PM

#10416

spino1i

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 8,713

Quote:

Originally Posted by zikzak

Death Penalty For Gays: Ron Paul Courts The Religious Fringe In Iowa

Ron Paul continuing to do his part to destroy libertarianism in the US.

Do any of you supporters ever get nostalgic for the Fall of 2011 when MSM was ignoring Paul?

I for one am happy that RP is waking up to the very common political strategy of pandering to the base while campaigning. He should have done this a long time ago. We know when he gets into office he's going to be a libertarian, but he has to say something to appease the base. Otherwise how does he get into office? Im not saying he has to go crazy and abandon his libertarian ideas, and I certainly wouldn't want him to change his position on Iran, but throwing a bone or two to the base every now and then isn't a bad plan.

This is what Rand did a lot better than Ron.

Last edited by spino1i; 12-29-2011 at 01:46 PM.

12-29-2011 , 01:42 PM

#10417

DVaut1

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 30,005

Quote:

“But as we have seen, while many homosexuals would be executed, the threat of capital punishment can be restorative. Biblical law would recognize as a matter of justice that even if this law could be enforced today, homosexuals could not be prosecuted for something that was done before.”

Reached by phone, Kayser confirmed to TPM that he believed in reinstating Biblical punishments for homosexuals — including the death penalty — even if he didn’t see much hope for it happening anytime soon. While he said he and Paul disagree on gay rights, noting that Paul recently voted for repealing Don’t Ask Don’t Tell, he supported the campaign because he believed Paul’s federalist take on the Constitution would allow states more latitude to implement fundamentalist law. Especially since under Kayser’s own interpretation of the Constitution there is no separation of Church and State.

“Under a Ron Paul presidency, states would be freed up to not have political correctness imposed on them, but obviously some state would follow what’s politically correct,” he said. “What he’s trying to do, whether he agrees with the Constitution’s position or not, is restrict himself to the Constitution. That is something I very much appreciate.”

How to Win Friends and Influence People with your positions on federalism. Young people are going on to hop on board this train!

12-29-2011 , 01:43 PM

#10418

zikzak

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 22,198

Quote:

Originally Posted by spino1i

Hiring a guy so extreme that he alienated the Christian right isn't pandering to the base. It's political incompetence writ large.

12-29-2011 , 01:44 PM

#10419

DVaut1

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 30,005

Hey man, Ron Paul is going to get mucho Iowa support with this pastor who wants to execute gays on his team, AND THAT'S THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS RIGHT NOW, THIS MOMENT, RIGHT HERE, THE THING HAPPENING RIGHT NOW.

12-29-2011 , 01:47 PM

#10420

spino1i

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 8,713

Quote:

Originally Posted by zikzak

Hiring a guy so extreme that he alienated the Christian right isn't pandering to the base. It's political incompetence writ large.

Yeh you might have a point, this guy might be too extreme of a religious nut

12-29-2011 , 01:53 PM

#10421

DVaut1

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 30,005

If it makes you feel any better, the ghostwritten press-release touting Kayser's endorsement has been scrubbed from the RP website.

12-29-2011 , 02:05 PM

#10422

ikestoys

banned

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 94,424

Yeah that criticism of Paul is absurdly weak

12-29-2011 , 02:25 PM

#10423

ddubois

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 7,696

Quote:

Originally Posted by jungle survivor

So he's saying he'll continue to fund unconstitutional programs several years into his Presidency?

If you listened to him talk in the debates, you'd know that he recognizes that people have come to depend on these things, and he has no plan to drop everything cold. In an ideal libertarian world, charities would take care of the sick/old/poor and not the government, but he recognizes that we can't go directly from where we are to that ideal, and his focus on spending cuts is elsewhere such that these programs can continue to be paid for. He's more pragmatic than people give him credit for.

12-29-2011 , 02:26 PM

#10424

jungle survivor

adept

Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 711

Quote:

Originally Posted by seattlelou

Ron Paul's World http://campaignstops.blogs.nytimes.c...n-pauls-world/

Quote:

The closest Paul has come in his public statements to endorsing violence against the government was during an interview in 2007, when he was asked about Ed and Elaine Brown, a New Hampshire couple who had refused to pay federal income taxes. In the summer of that year, they instigated a five-month armed standoff with United States marshals, whom Ed Brown accused of being part of a “Zionist, Illuminati, Freemason movement.” Echoing a speech he had just delivered on the House floor, Paul praised the pair as “heroic” “true patriots,” likened them to Mahatma Gandhi and Martin Luther King Jr., and compared them favorably to “zombies,” that is, those of us who “just go along” and pay income tax.

Religious kooks that owed more than $3m in taxes and instead decided to change their names and call themselves sovereign citizens with no obligation to pay the federal government. They barricaded themselves in their home with firearms and told the officers they would rather die than obey legal authority.

Just like Gandhi and and MLK Jr.

Elaine Brown was quoted as saying:

Quote:

The only law book we now recognize is the Bible. The only way we're coming out of our home is either as free man and free woman or in body bags.

Edward Brown was also quoted

Quote:

Once you've used the lawful word, you've done it the absolute proper way, and they still come at you, they are now attacking the Creator himself or itself,… You kill them. That is exactly what the Ten Commandments tell you to do.

oh wow this is exactly like Ron Paul

Quote:

In early June 2007 Brown claimed that the law enforcement officials surrounding his properties were part of a "Zionist, Illuminati, Freemason movement," and that the federal government had no jurisdiction in New Hampshire.[22] Referring to the warrants and court orders against him, Brown said "This is just paper… This is fiction. The entire American government is fiction. We created it, didn't we?"[22] The New Hampshire Union Leader also reported that "the Browns believe the IRS and the federal income tax are part of a deliberate plot perpetrated by Freemasons to control the American people and eventually the world."

Quote:

After the arrests, law enforcement personnel began searching the home and found weapons, ammunition, explosive devices and booby traps.[16] Law enforcement officials found twenty "suspected pipe bombs," nine "destructive devices," bags of high explosives hanging in the trees, smoke grenades, materials for partially constructed nail bombs, two .50-caliber rifles, 18 other guns, and over 60,000 rounds of ammunition.[46]

Just like Gandhi and and MLK Jr.

12-29-2011 , 02:32 PM

#10425

SL__72

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 16,499

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mayo

LOL leaving out the next paragraph, which contained Paul's response:

Mayo,

Dissecting a single interview on a subject he has spoken about many times is silly. For example:

Quote:

Reason: What did you mean when you told the Scholars that "the [9/11] investigation is an investigation in which there were government cover-ups"?

Paul: I do think there were cover-ups, and I think it was mainly to cover up who was blamed, who's inept. See, they had the information. The FBI had an agent who was very much aware of the terrorists getting flight lessons but obviously not training to be pilots. He reported it 70 times or whatever and it was totally ignored. We were spending $40 billion a year on intelligence. It wasn't a lack of money or a lack of intelligence, it was a lack of the ability to put the intelligence together. Even the administration had been forewarned that something was coming, the CIA had been forewarned. So it was a cover up of who to blame. I see it more that way.

Reason: The position of the Student Scholars is that 9/11 was executed by the U.S. government. Do you agree or disagree with that?

Paul: I'd say there's no evidence of that.

Reason: So what did you mean when you told Student Scholars you'd be open to a new 9/11 investigation?

Paul: Well, I think the more we know about what we went on is good. But I don't think there's any evidence of [an inside job] and I don't believe that. The blame goes to bad policy. And a lot of times bad policy is well-motivated. The people who believe in a one world government are well motivated, but they disagree with me.

http://reason.com/blog/2007/05/22/ro...-and-eric-dond

His (already controversial) position on 9/11 is that one of the main motivations of the attack was US foreign policy.

Crazy noted right-wing conspiritard Noam Chomsky call's Paul's 9/11 position "completely Uncontroversial:"

Quote:

Originally Posted by DVaut1

Quote:

Originally Posted by DVaut1

If it makes you feel any better, the ghostwritten press-release touting Kayser's endorsement has been scrubbed from the RP website.

Doesn't this amount to failing to properly vet an endorsement before bragging about it?

Last edited by SL__72; 12-29-2011 at 02:44 PM.