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The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns. The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns.

03-01-2017 , 02:39 PM
A majestic takedown of the media's delighted response to Trump's speech:

Quote:
He rode temporary bouts of “discipline,” celebrated by a political media that failed to raise their bar for his conduct, all the way to the White House, where his erratic and unseemly behavior continues.

On Tuesday night, in vintage fashion, Trump offered few details to back up empty promises. He alluded to courtroom convictions to create the false impression that terrorism in the U.S. is principally a consequence of weak vetting and porous borders—a false justification for his Muslim ban, which the courts have enjoined. He cited an increase in homicides in 2015 to foster the impression that violent crime is at a historic high, rather than a historic low. He outsourced to Defense Secretary James Mattis a lie about a raid he ordered in Yemen—which resulted in the death of a Navy SEAL, numerous civilians, and an eight-year-old American girl—falsely heralding it as “a highly successful raid that generated large amounts of vital intelligence.” Hours earlier, Trump had blamed his own military planners and Obama for its obvious failure. He also claimed to support NATO, which he has previously described as obsolete.

What Trump didn’t do was reprise his assault on the press corps...
03-01-2017 , 02:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Wait, now I'm pro-internment? How'd you get there?

Internment is one of the many reasons FDR was terrible for the United States.
Everyone who defends internment is on the right. They never do it out of loyalty to FDR, they do it out of their own authoritarianism and/or racism. Whether you personally always defend authoritarianism or only when it comes out of the GOP I don't know.
03-01-2017 , 02:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
Different how? I don't see how they are different insofar as us conducting war on them is a violation of international law, their sovereignty and our constitution. OBL and al-Raymi are different though.

It's not ok with me that Obama bombed or landed on many different countries outside of any international agreements or congressional approval. But, like I said, if there were ONE TIME where these laws were to be violated, it was for OBL.
I was referring to the brutal civil war currently taking place in Yemen, they're a failing state. I realize that this in of itself doesn't make it "ok" to launch raids there, but when you have targets such as the AQAP commander and two of his regional commanders hiding there, you probably think about conducting a mission to kill them.
03-01-2017 , 02:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
Everyone who defends internment is on the right. They never do it out of loyalty to FDR, they do it out of their own authoritarianism and/or racism. Whether you personally always defend authoritarianism or only when it comes out of the GOP I don't know.
When did I defend internment? Or authoritarianism?

And please, liberals have been sucking FDR dry for ages.
03-01-2017 , 02:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
And please, liberals have been sucking FDR dry for ages.
Your terrible reading comprehension here makes me doubt any of your interpretations of the articles from that monster fascism list.

IHBT, IHL.
03-01-2017 , 02:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
When did I defend internment? Or authoritarianism?

And please, liberals have been sucking FDR dry for ages.
You're defending Trump right now.

As far as FDR goes, most of my life the people you call liberals have run away from FDR. Definitely from Carter until Obama and largely including Obama Democrats were almost as afraid of being labeled an FDR Democrat as being likened to Che Guevara. But never do the Democrats from whatever wing of the party, no matter how much they praise the New Deal, never do they do anything other than condemn internment.
03-01-2017 , 02:51 PM
Thread:


https://twitter.com/JoyAnnReid/statu...00725770457090
03-01-2017 , 02:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
You're defending Trump right now.
No, I'm not. Again, you guys are super confused by me criticizing you not being the same as defending Trump. Why do you have such a hard time with it? You can all read and write...

Let's do it this way -you're now criticizing me. So, I'm going to assume you are pro war, pro drug war, pro deportation, pro asset forfeiture.

Man microbet, you really do support a lot of terrible things.
03-01-2017 , 02:54 PM
You freedom hating reactionaries should look at what the liberals want. They want Trump impeached which means a true arch-conservative as POTUS.

That should tell you something about whether people are just hating on Trump because they are partisan. Trump is way more socialist, national socialist, than Pence.
03-01-2017 , 02:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Sorry, what do you think I'm wrong about?

Fly might be correct about how I ended up thinking Zimmerman was racist, but there's not much doubt that the NBC editing bungle led other people to think Zimmerman was racist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Wait, now I'm pro-internment? How'd you get there?

Internment is one of the many reasons FDR was terrible for the United States.

Uhh no, my argument is that post was a huge spew of vomit, and it's ridiculous to throw up in a thread and ask for a response to a hundred stories, when at a glance one can see that a chunk of them aren't supportive of the fascism argument.

I'm mostly interested in seeing if you guys can be intellectually honest. On facebook, last night I was critical of Trump. On here, last night I was critical of you guys. I'm sorry the spew you posted had a ton of nonsense in it, but it did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
I mean, liberal isn't really the point....You missed it again Fly.

I FYPd for you!

16% Jewish population, compared to 2% nationally. Sorry Fly, you gonna fly I guess.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Sorry guy, that's literally the only defense to that kind of thing? Not much you can say against a completely fabricated charge of racism/bigotry.

And yeah, you can't really hate Jewish people and have Jewish friends. Sorry bout that for ya.

I've seen that same criticism levied at a white guy with a black wife who was accused of being a racist. "I'm not a racist, I have a black wife" LOL THAT'S LIKE SAYING YOU HAVE BLACK FRIENDS LOLOLOL

Sorry, folks, people who hate another race don't typically have them as friends.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
You are literally talking about circles dvaut, that's probably the best part of this.

So, it's really cool and all that those three dudes pivoted to Trump, really, fascinating, great reporting from the Post and others, probably win a Pulitzer for that I imagine. But also, 4 million people voted for GJ. That included me and literally every libertarian I know.

So, sorry if I find the claim that the two million Ron Paul supporters pivoted to Trump to be less than credible, when there was a huge jump (what, 3 million people) to the Libertarian party. You're just going to ignore the actual voting numbers and talk about three libertarian dudes?

Edit to add: Can we also focus in on the delicious irony of you finding credibility in an online poll? OMG so tasty so good. omnomnom I eat it up, yummy. Probably would have different results with landlines, mmmm omnonmonm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Wait - Ron Paul crew migrated to Trump? Sorry I haven't been here so must have missed this - how do we know that's true? GJ got four times as many votes as the 2008 libertarian candidate, why aren't we assuming that RP crew migrated to GJ? All of my libertarian friends who were woked by RP voted for GJ - but, they're the "rare" actual libertarians.

Edit: For a better comparison, look at Ron Paul's vote count in 2012, he received 2 million votes during the primary. GJ received 4 million votes in 2016 (up from 523k in 2008 and 1.3 million in 2012).
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
I didn't understand most of this, but mostly I did not read this thread except the last few pages. Sorry, but it's a long thread and I just got here.

I know I'm not really helping by being annoying. I think it's going to take some time before I'm willing to accept liberals being critical of the executive again. I really am actually thrilled to see it, but the petty side of me is currently winning. Sorry to let you down Weeeez.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
It's not bigotry either.

It is prejudiced, if he was assuming that the reporter knew the CBC because she was black, and not simply because he thought she was asking the question on their behalf. But definitely not racism, definitely not bigotry.

Sorry that I use the dictionary to define words wookie, but words do have an agreed upon meaning, and dictionaries are generally the agreed upon place to find those meanings. Liberals trying to redefine racism to include things other than what it actually means just makes it a less powerful word. Please stop making racism a less powerful word? Please stop making Trump win?

And yeah, it probably isn't a terrible idea for you guys to rule out some other possibilities before jumping to the racism accusation, seeing how much you tend to over use it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
I mean, that's one possible reason? The only thing it definitely isn't is racism. Again, racism is the idea that certain races are inherently inferior than others. Even if Trump thinks all black people know each other, that's not a racist belief, it's just blindingly stupid. But, let's go into other possible reasons why he made that comment to that reporter:

Defensive is definitely it, he probably thought the question was a plant/attack from the CBC on him.

Have you people not watched him ever before? A Jewish reporter started a question with essentially "My community KNOWS you are NOT antisemitic because of these reasons, but what can you do to stop the Antisemitism in the US" and he flipped out, told the reporter to sit down and went on about how he is not antisemitic.

The guy thinks every question is an attack on him personally.

Regardless, nothing racist about asking a black reporter if she knows people in the CBC, or even assuming that she does even if you are assuming it because she is black. That is not racism, it's not bigotry, sorry guys. If you're assuming she's genetically inferior in some way because she is black, that is racism.

Yep, they've got it all figured out. As long as the US invades Russia, and replaces Comey, they will win in 2020.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
You've got this Fly!! You guys are definitely going to defeat Trump again.

By the way, I didn't say racism was imaginary, I said liberals are imagining racism where it isn't - I know, it's a confusing concept.

Also, again, I know this is going to be super confusing for you guys, but criticizing liberals is not the same thing as defending Trump.

So, some big concepts here Fly, let me know if you need them explained any further. Sorry I hurt your feelings, but you guys really need to learn from how badly you screwed up. The world needs you to learn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Guys, I'm not going to respond to each of you - you're all basically saying the same thing. And no, I'm not 'offended" that you're talking about hand signals, I'm literally laughing at your conspiracy theories.

Bottom line, keep it up and liberals will get us another four years of Trump. You are to blame. I'm really sorry you're having such a hard time understanding that / coping with it, but you are so out of touch that you gave blue-collar Americans a choice between Trump and one of the worst democratic candidates possible.

It's clear that you aren't learning from the mistakes - you cannot call everything you don't like racism - maybe it makes you feel better / makes you think you have a moral high ground, but sorry kids, guy adjusting his tie isn't racism, Rand Paul isn't a white nationalist, and you know what, Trump asking the black reporter if she can set up a meeting with the CBC isn't racism either. Racism is the belief that people are inherently inferior based on their race.

You are convincing no one, you are winning no friends, you are simply looking as silly as you did in 2016, and you are going to make Trump win again. Please please please stop making Trump win. Take some responsibility for getting him elected, learn from it, and start talking about stuff a little more relevant to voters than secret hand signals, bathrooms and global warming.

Oh yeah, you're probably super shocked by that last one. Hard truth: no one cares about global warming except for you - get out of your bubble. When the factory worker who lost his job hears you talking about global warming he thinks you care more about the environment than his ability to put food on the table.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
Wait, now I'm pro-internment? How'd you get there?

Internment is one of the many reasons FDR was terrible for the United States.

Uhh no, my argument is that post was a huge spew of vomit, and it's ridiculous to throw up in a thread and ask for a response to a hundred stories, when at a glance one can see that a chunk of them aren't supportive of the fascism argument.

I'm mostly interested in seeing if you guys can be intellectually honest. On facebook, last night I was critical of Trump. On here, last night I was critical of you guys. I'm sorry the spew you posted had a ton of nonsense in it, but it did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
sorry.
Such a sorry guy.

Last edited by Oroku$aki; 03-01-2017 at 03:05 PM.
03-01-2017 , 02:58 PM
I believe the word for that is a Trump/Fascist apologist.
03-01-2017 , 02:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
No, I'm not. Again, you guys are super confused by me criticizing you not being the same as defending Trump. Why do you have such a hard time with it? You can all read and write...

Let's do it this way -you're now criticizing me. So, I'm going to assume you are pro war, pro drug war, pro deportation, pro asset forfeiture.

Man microbet, you really do support a lot of terrible things.
You look around Germany in 1942 and say "damn, those people in the White Rose should really be more objective."
03-01-2017 , 03:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oroku$aki
Such a sorry guy.
sorry.
03-01-2017 , 03:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
No, I'm not. Again, you guys are super confused by me criticizing you not being the same as defending Trump. Why do you have such a hard time with it? You can all read and write...

Let's do it this way -you're now criticizing me. So, I'm going to assume you are pro war, pro drug war, pro deportation, pro asset forfeiture.

Man microbet, you really do support a lot of terrible things.
For someone who supposedly hates Trump and the majority of his policies, you spend about 1% of the time criticizing his administration as you do Democrats / Liberal posters in this thread. You must see how disingenuous this appears right? Why should anyone believe that you don't 100% agree with his policies when you make no effort to criticize / analyze them?
03-01-2017 , 03:00 PM
Don't worry microbet, he doesn't really support fascism/racism, he just spends hours every day looking up weird insignificant details about cases so he can support George Zimmerman and Trump BY CHANCE ten times a day or so.
03-01-2017 , 03:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shpanko
As a physician who deals with people with mental illness on a daily basis I can tell you that literally 0 people with mental illness in my career have foregone mental health services for fear of losing their 2A rights or worries over being able to get a firearm. And I deal almost exclusively with those that are not seeking mental health services and get picked up by the police / EMS. You're imagining a potential problem which simply doesn't exist.
Yeah, lol lestat. I'll leave this to you as well, but I'd imagine the vast majority of your patients couldn't "easily" get an illegal firearm.
03-01-2017 , 03:05 PM
I see we're engaging So? again
03-01-2017 , 03:05 PM
Stop giving Tsao attention, y'all.
03-01-2017 , 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shpanko
For someone who supposedly hates Trump and the majority of his policies, you spend about 1% of the time criticizing his administration as you do Democrats / Liberal posters in this thread. You must see how disingenuous this appears right? Why should anyone believe that you don't 100% agree with his policies when you make no effort to criticize / analyze them?
I get it. But I mean, if we all just sit here agreeing with each other, that'd be pretty ****ing stale wouldn't it? So I'm not disagreeing with people's view on Trump, just on how liberals, and posters here, are presenting those views.

Seriously, you guys just want to circle jerk and self-confirm? That's something you actually like to do / something you think is a good use of your time?

Kool, put me on ignore and go back to agreeing with each other. That's like the whole point of forums, right, a place to agree with one another. Keep presenting your positions the way you are, keep losing elections, keep thinking Bernie Sanders is going to save the country on his hundredth birthday, you've all got this!
03-01-2017 , 03:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
I get it. But I mean, if we all just sit here agreeing with each other, that'd be pretty ****ing stale wouldn't it? So I'm not disagreeing with people's view on Trump, just on how liberals, and posters here, are presenting those views.

Seriously, you guys just want to circle jerk and self-confirm? That's something you actually like to do / something you think is a good use of your time?

Kool, put me on ignore and go back to agreeing with each other. That's like the whole point of forums, right, a place to agree with one another. Keep presenting your positions the way you are, keep losing elections, keep thinking Bernie Sanders is going to save the country on his hundredth birthday, you've all got this!
You are free to spend your time being critical of whatever your want. But be prepared to be identified as someone in support of the Trump administration when you focus all your energy on debunking 1/10th of a post pointing out the dangers of Trump action / republican action instead of the autocratic regime that you purportedly despise.
03-01-2017 , 03:17 PM
Sounds like things at the State Department are going swimmingly. The whole article is pretty bleak.

Quote:
“This is probably what it felt like to be a British foreign service officer after World War II, when you realize, no, the sun actually does set on your empire,” said the mid-level officer. “America is over. And being part of that, when it’s happening for no reason, is traumatic.”
https://www.theatlantic.com/internat...utm_source=twb
03-01-2017 , 03:17 PM
All the talk about Trump's business interests in Russia, connections between his campaign staff and Russia, Flynn, Russian meddling in the election, and the charitable views toward Russia held by some of cabinet members, is likely to push Trump in the direction of normalizing the way he talks about, and acts towards, Putin/Russia. By normalizing, I mean moving in the general direction of US political orthodoxy.

If left to his own devices, I have no doubt that Trump would embrace an irrationally close relationship with Putin/Russia, which likely would be disastrous.

This is a long way of saying that Trump's persecutors may be saving Trump's bacon on Russia, even if he is too thick to appreciate it.
03-01-2017 , 03:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson
Stop giving Tsao attention, y'all.
yeah, I mean it can be fun to toy with people who are clearly morons, but now it's just cluttering up the thread and is irritating because we can't ignore everyone
03-01-2017 , 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shpanko
You are free to spend your time being critical of whatever your want. But be prepared to be identified as someone in support of the Trump administration when you focus all your energy on debunking 1/10th of a post pointing out the dangers of Trump action / republican action instead of the autocratic regime that you purportedly despise.
If people here want to keep posting inaccurately, kool! I'll also start making up things about people who disagree with me, it'll be a swell convo, I'm sure!
03-01-2017 , 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
The red text here doesn't show Trump is a fascist...Do you want us to go through each and every link here to figure out which ones are real and which aren't applicable like the red text stories?
You are really bad at logic, like horribad at it. Many of the things you highlighted are indeed evidence that Trump is a fascist. Are they dispositive on their own? Obviously not as you selected for that criteria. But their inclusion as supporting evidence in the "fascist case" does not mean the case is weak. You being in town the night your wife was murdered does mean that you killed her, no ****, but I need to include this piece of evidence in my case. Same for the KKK endorsing a white nationalist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by General Tsao
I'm mostly interested in seeing if you guys can be intellectually honest. On facebook, last night I was critical of Trump. On here, last night I was critical of you guys. I'm sorry the spew you posted had a ton of nonsense in it, but it did.
Nah, this just makes you a TROLL. A libertarian's response to that post is either a thumbs up, or that is way too many words to make an obvious case, Trump is a obviously a fascist for reasons X, Y, and Z.

      
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