The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns. - Page 5260 - Politics and Economics

LOL at thinking that M4A has even a 1% chance in 2011.

You're aware that even under the best plausible 2020 election outcomes, the Republicans will still have 47 senate seats, right? I know a lot can change, but a GOP senate majority is likely at this point.

Also does M4A even have a majority just among senate Democrats right now?

Well, let's put it more cautiously then. M4A starts with expansion of medicare. Obamacare wasn't a step towards M4A/UHC, but a blocker of it and the majority of Dems now have less of an excuse.

12-15-2018 , 03:27 PM

#131478

Clovis8

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 16,503

Just our daily reminder how messed up America is when there isn’t even majority support among the left for something that has existed in every single other western nation for decades.

For a nation that tries really hard to corner the market on idiotic political debates the M4A one really is the king.

12-15-2018 , 03:28 PM

#131479

Matty Lice

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 3,438

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clovis8

Umm the crazy armed people think making them have healthcare is a commie plot. That’s not hyperbole.

They want healthcare. They just don't want OBAMACARE. That's how stupid they are.

12-15-2018 , 03:30 PM

#131480

stuff they say

enthusiast

Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 93

Quote:

Originally Posted by realDonaldTrump

( twitter | raw text )

Its like he doesn't get he is the president and can be interviewed by any reporter on earth live on television whenever he wants. Walk into the press briefing room in your house and get someone to flip the cameras on and tell the ****ing story yourself!

12-15-2018 , 03:34 PM

#131481

mendicant loafer

adept

Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 889

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clovis8

Umm the crazy armed people think making them have healthcare is a commie plot. That’s not hyperbole.

Dom wants his pony returned.

12-15-2018 , 03:35 PM

#131482

All-In Flynn

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 10,923

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clovis8

Just our daily reminder how messed up America is when there isn’t even majority support among the left for something that has existed in every single other western nation for decades.

Ireland doesn't quite have full-blooded, free-at-the-point-of-use UHC. It's probably close enough compared to the US system, though.

12-15-2018 , 03:47 PM

#131483

uDevil

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 6,941

Maybe somebody else can do it. I don't have the heart to post this little girl's picture. Her fate was sealed November 8, 2016.

https://twitter.com/tedlieu/status/1074014329173794816

12-15-2018 , 03:49 PM

#131484

smacc25

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2014 Posts: 2,969

Quote:

Originally Posted by otatop

Entire floor at D.C. federal courthouse sealed off for mystery case

Reddit detectives pointed out that this Politico story about Mueller possibly subpoenaing Trump mentioned that oral arguments would take place on December 14th, and

At every level, this matter has commanded the immediate and close attention of the judges involved—suggesting that no ordinary witness and no ordinary issue is involved. But is it the president? The docket sheets give one final—but compelling—clue. When the witness lost the first time in the circuit court (before the quick round trip to the district court), he petitioned, unusually, for rehearing en banc—meaning the witness thought the case was so important that it merited the very unusual action of convening all 10 of the D.C. Circuit judges to review the order. That is itself telling (this witness believes the case demands very special handling), but the order disposing of the petition is even more telling: Trump’s sole appointee to that court, Gregory Katsas, recused himself.

Should be a fun Friday.

Hi peeps. Did we find the mystery person?

12-15-2018 , 04:25 PM

#131485

Huehuecoyotl

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Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 29,296

Quote:

Behind the scenes, however, the White House had been pushing Zinke to resign for weeks, administration officials said. Last month, these officials said, Zinke was told he had until the end of the year to exit or be fired.

Because when the Dems take the House they'd be investigating him like crazy... but before he left

Quote:

The secretary’s final public appearance was Thursday night at his Christmas party, which he told White House staffers he wanted to have before his dismissal. He invited lobbyists and conservative activists to his executive suite, where he posed for photos in front of a large stuffed polar bear wearing a Santa cap, according to an attendee.

Mounted animals on the wall were fitted with ornaments.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...=.921383040061

12-15-2018 , 05:04 PM

#131486

Morphismus

BBV Poker Player of 2022

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 24,581

12-15-2018 , 05:54 PM

#131487

Nicholasp27

27th level thinker

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 84,493

12-15-2018 , 06:43 PM

#131488

Clovis8

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 16,503

Should have a final panel...

And they all deserved it.

12-15-2018 , 07:34 PM

#131489

suzzer99

Save the Cheerleader, Save the World

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 100,195

Quote:

After the 2016 election, in the only meeting between Obama and then-President-elect Trump, the outgoing leader warned against the hiring of just one person: Flynn. Obama considered Flynn to be dangerous — because of his performance as head of DIA, because of his incendiary statements about Islam, and because Flynn had appeared at the Moscow event staged in 2015 by RT.

Trump ignored his predecessor’s advice and made Flynn his national security adviser. Flynn lasted 23 days. The president forced him out after The Post revealed that Flynn had lied about discussing U.S. sanctions against Russia with that country’s ambassador to the United States.

12-15-2018 , 07:53 PM

#131490

Trolly McTrollson

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Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 37,773

Ugh, between that cartoon and the "Michael Flynn's transformation" thinkpiece, can we immediately stop this narrative that decent people came to the Trump White House and were corrupted by his influence? These guys were all grifty dirtbags well before they signed on. And no, having a few stars on your lapel doesn't automatically mean you aren't a sleazy dip****. Mike Flynn is right now arguing that he didn't know it was wrong to lie to the feds even as he's pretending to show contrition in his plea deal.

12-15-2018 , 07:55 PM

#131491

suzzer99

Save the Cheerleader, Save the World

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 100,195

The article says Flynn became a partisan dirtbag starting around 2012 at least.

Quote:

Previously viewed by many as a crackerjack field commander but not executive material, Flynn was quickly moved to a top position in Washington. In 2012, the Obama White House nominated him to run the DIA.

Things did not go well, nearly from the start.

A DIA officer who regularly attended meetings with Flynn said the top brass welcomed him because “he was a legend to us, coming in as the shake-up artist.”

But soon after Flynn’s arrival, the officer said, “he started doing weird things, like bring his unsecured BlackBerry into the secure space, and he became unabashed about his beliefs. In meetings, he sounded like he was reading Breitbart and Alex Jones and random bloggers, alt-right stuff, and he’d just say, ‘Well, I heard this . . .’ ”

“We saw a serious cognitive erosion,” another agency staffer said, “like he couldn’t inhibit himself from saying things, like the filters were off.”

“He lost control of the building very quickly,” Benjamin said.

Some officials began to call his forays into speculative or conspiratorial thinking “Flynn facts.” When he decided to go to Moscow in 2013 to speak to officers at Russia’s military intelligence agency, some top advisers told their boss the move was naive, even dangerous. Flynn insisted that the battle against Islamist terrorism made it urgent to seek common ground with the Russians.

A senior DIA staffer said several people “tried to push Flynn away from that stuff in a very cordial, diplomatic way, to move him away from his extreme ideas about not talking to Iran and about Islam. He’d just say, ‘Well, you’re wrong.’ We talked all the time among ourselves about what was going on in his head. Like, was it PTSD, or was this who he was all along and now he finally had the authority to say it?”

By 2014, Flynn’s bosses had had enough. They cut his tenure short and pushed him out.

12-15-2018 , 07:59 PM

#131492

microbet

Solar Powered

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 57,077

West Wing Centrist Very Serious People Liberals can't accept that highly decorated 12 star generals who know how to wear suits could have been dumb scumbags in the first place.

12-15-2018 , 07:59 PM

#131493

Trolly McTrollson

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 37,773

Quote:

Originally Posted by suzzer99

The article says Flynn became a partisan dirtbag starting around 2012 at least.

The only thing that changed was he stopped flying under the radar. OK, the filters went down but he was fundamentally the same person.

What's that recurring Dvaut rant about how Fox News isn't actually the proximate reason grandpa's a racist? Same thing applies here in spades: Fox & Friends didn't magically brainwash a three-star general into becoming a LOCK HER UP taintstain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by microbet

West Wing Centrist Very Serious People Liberals can't accept that highly decorated 12 star generals who know how to wear suits could have been scumbags in the first place.

Oh man, the left is very very complicit in the fetishization of people who've served in the military.

tl;dr

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clovis8

And they all deserved it.

12-15-2018 , 08:04 PM

#131494

fxwacgesvrhdtf

Guest

Posts: n/a

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson

I'm not at all 100% confident Roberts just won't go YOLO on this and overturn it.

For what possible reason? If he wanted to kill Obamacare, he could have done it several years ago.

12-15-2018 , 08:29 PM

#131495

David Sklansky

Administrator

Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 17,205

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty Lice

Do judges on the SC ever reverse themselves?

Are people who are saying that Roberts won't "reverse" himself saying that because:

1. Had the law been as it is now he would have voted the same way (Obamacare is constitutional) as he did when the law was different. Thus he has no reason to change his vote.

or

2. Even though he would have voted with the conservatives back then and found Obamacare, as it is now, unconstitutional, he will find reasons to not stick to what he would have voted then.

12-15-2018 , 08:49 PM

#131496

TheHip41

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 27,049

No one cares

12-15-2018 , 08:56 PM

#131497

dth123451

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Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 15,502

12-15-2018 , 09:18 PM

#131498

Trolly McTrollson

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Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 37,773

When Kellys finally leaves the White House, we're going to see a bunch of sober thinkpieces about how he was a fine upstanding general who just sort of fell in with a bad crowd in the Trump cabinet and I want you guys to be ready to see through that bull****.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jman220

For what possible reason? If he wanted to kill Obamacare, he could have done it several years ago.

I have no idea, but I'm sure not happy that the fate of the ACA rests on a Republican nominee's respect for norms and precedent.

12-15-2018 , 09:29 PM

#131499

suzzer99

Save the Cheerleader, Save the World

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 100,195

My point in posting that btw was about how Trump basically did the opposite of Obama's advice - when Obama specifically warned him about only one person - Flynn.

But go on with whatever you're railing about.

Just so I understand - when in your mind did Flynn go bad? Did RW media have anything to do with it or was he just a right wing nutjob from birth?