The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns. - Page 279 - Politics and Economics

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The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns.

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02-08-2017 , 04:07 PM

#6951

zikzak

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 22,198

02-08-2017 , 04:10 PM

#6952

TheHip41

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 27,049

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPantz

Wtf does "botched" mean anyway? **** happens it's war. That's why units do after action reviews after every mission. Sometimes Intel is bad, sometimes you get dropped off on a hot LZ. There are plenty of books out there taking about when **** goes wrong. The concern is if Trump rushed this mission for whatever reason instead of letting it continue to develop.

Blaming the soldiers or SEALs in this case, who carried out the mission saying "that's why they signed up to do" is disgusting. They aren't kamikazee pilots. They are individuals who accept a certain risk as part of their job. You think this dude wanted to get killed? You think that his teammates wanted it to happen?

we already know Trump was like, Obama said we can't do this?

**** him lets do it.

and when it was successful, he would be gloating about it for months.

Obama's a pussy, look at me your leader, I know how to get **** done.

instead a soldier dies, 8 year old girl dies, he says nothing about it

02-08-2017 , 04:11 PM

#6953

ScreaminAsian

For President

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 33,333

trump's wife had planned on making $150 million by marketing fashion products while she's first lady, but now she can't because everybody thinks she used to be a prostitute

02-08-2017 , 04:12 PM

#6954

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPantz

Wtf does "botched" mean anyway? **** happens it's war. That's why units do after action reviews after every mission. Sometimes Intel is bad, sometimes you get dropped off on a hot LZ. There are plenty of books out there taking about when **** goes wrong. The concern is if Trump rushed this mission for whatever reason instead of letting it continue to develop.

Blaming the soldiers or SEALs in this case, who carried out the mission saying "that's why they signed up to do" is disgusting. They aren't kamikazee pilots. They are individuals who accept a certain risk as part of their job. You think this dude wanted to get killed? You think that his teammates wanted it to happen?

Apparently up to, and including, kamikaze missions like the one in Yemen. Dying is part of the job description for soldier imo. Do they acknowledge, or realize, that they have a death wish? I don't know. But they didn't enlist to preserve their life.

02-08-2017 , 04:13 PM

#6955

BroadwaySushy

banned

Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 3,237

Quote:

Originally Posted by dinopoker

The problems are always the same.

1. Taking out Assad by the US military require invading Syria. Putin backs Assad so you'd run the risk of the US and Russia engaging in major hostilities over a country nobody really cares about.

2. Promoting and supporting someone else to take out Assad raises the question of who? ISIS? The Kurds?

3. If the Kurds, then you run afoul of Turkey, who wants the Kurds to play nice and not get their own country.

4. If instead you support the anti-Assad rebels who are neither a) Kurds or b) ISIS, then you're faced with the problem that they, you know, can't win. So by giving them aid and weapons all you really do is get them killed more.

5. etc etc.

But they (the rebels) were winning before Russia got involved and when Obama drew his red line in the sand.

02-08-2017 , 04:16 PM

#6956

th14

old hand

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 1,460

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroadwaySushy

Meanwhile Barack Obama, who was in a position to do something that may have prevented all this happening, backed down when Assad ignored his ultimatum to not use chemical weapons on his own people.

But hell no, we can't criticize Obama for that capitulation. Let's have a dig at Trump instead.

Assad's chemical weapons destroyed without the need for invasion is a good thing.

1. Obama said the U.S. military would get involved if Syria used chemical weapons
2. Syria used chemical weapons domestically
3. John Kerry is asked by a reporter, is there anything Syria could do to avoid American military intervention, he said, yeah they could give up all their chemical weapons
4. Syria via Russia offers to give up all chemical weapons to avoid being attacked
5.

Quote:

By October 2013, without a bomb being dropped, the Bashar Assad regime had admitted having a massive chemical weapons program it had never before acknowledged, agreed to give it up and submitted to a multinational coalition that removed and destroyed the deadly trove....

According to U.S. estimates, at more than 1,300 metric tons spread out over as many as 45 sites in a country about twice the size of Virginia, Syria’s arsenal of chemical weapons in 2013 was the world’s third-largest. It was 10 times greater than the CIA’s (erroneous) 2002 estimate of Iraq’s chemical weapons stash, and 50 times larger than the arsenal Libya declared it had in late 2011.

02-08-2017 , 04:21 PM

#6957

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

Quote:

Originally Posted by dinopoker

I assumed they could get him without boots on the ground, thought they could drone his ass anytime. Maybe they would need some day of jackal type plan to get him.

Quote:

2. Promoting and supporting someone else to take out Assad raises the question of who? ISIS? The Kurds?

The Kurds. They're alright.

Quote:

3. If the Kurds, then you run afoul of Turkey, who wants the Kurds to play nice and not get their own country.

Fk Turkey. Kurds should get their way.

Quote:

4. If instead you support the anti-Assad rebels who are neither a) Kurds or b) ISIS, then you're faced with the problem that they, you know, can't win. So by giving them aid and weapons all you really do is get them killed more.

5. etc etc.

If you're right then...hmmmm. Assad is the most sane choice? **** that. Cut the head off the snake and see what happens. It's only proper that he goes down hard. I'd hope the fallout is better than the status quo, but if not, I don't care, these hornets had to be released.

02-08-2017 , 04:22 PM

#6958

iron81

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 17,730

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPantz

Wtf does "botched" mean anyway? **** happens it's war.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iron81

Target of the Yemen raid escaped and us predictably proud of himself. https://www.google.com/amp/amp.timei...hms-tmobile-us

...

02-08-2017 , 04:22 PM

#6959

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroadwaySushy

But they (the rebels) were winning before Russia got involved and when Obama drew his red line in the sand.

That's great, but once again, Obama's in the past. Stick to the present/future please.

02-08-2017 , 04:24 PM

#6960

epcfast

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 2,535

Spicer (noun) - a user of synthetic cannabinoids

02-08-2017 , 04:28 PM

#6961

BroadwaySushy

banned

Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 3,237

Quote:

Originally Posted by th14

If they were all destroyed how come he's been using them recently?

02-08-2017 , 04:32 PM

#6962

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

If you're right then obv they weren't all destroyed. You may as well cite Assad's recent use to back up your claim (which is not far fetched.)

02-08-2017 , 04:34 PM

#6963

57 On Red

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 6,223

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPantz

Blaming the soldiers or SEALs in this case, who carried out the mission saying "that's why they signed up to do" is disgusting. They aren't kamikazee pilots. They are individuals who accept a certain risk as part of their job. You think this dude wanted to get killed? You think that his teammates wanted it to happen?

Since Navy SEALS have lately been photographed flying a Trump flag from one of their vehicles while on duty, which is the behaviour of paramilitary and not military personnel, Navy SEALS can just take the lumps as far as I'm concerned.

02-08-2017 , 04:34 PM

#6964

dinopoker

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,437

Please don't come in here and make sense. Sushy wanted bombs to be dropped!

Spoiler:

02-08-2017 , 04:35 PM

#6965

iron81

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 17,730

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroadwaySushy

If they were all destroyed how come he's been using them recently?

He made more? Your info is wrong?

02-08-2017 , 04:37 PM

#6966

dinopoker

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,437

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oroku$aki

I assumed they could get him without boots on the ground, thought they could drone his ass anytime. Maybe they would need some day of jackal type plan to get him.

The Kurds. They're alright.

Fk Turkey. Kurds should get their way.

If you're right then...hmmmm. Assad is the most sane choice? **** that. Cut the head off the snake and see what happens. It's only proper that he goes down hard. I'd hope the fallout is better than the status quo, but if not, I don't care, these hornets had to be released.

Turkey is an important ally to curb Russia as they are the key to the southern part of that country. And Russia, unlike ISIS, really IS the biggest threat to the USA right now.

Plus, an alliance between Russia and Turkey leads to Russian navy ships cruising around the Mediterranean any time they like.

02-08-2017 , 04:38 PM

#6967

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

Quote:

Originally Posted by iron81

He made more? Your info is wrong?

This, or Assad had some old stock hidden somewhere. Either way, the topic of chemical weapons feels like a derail that leads to arguable mistakes made by Obama.

02-08-2017 , 04:42 PM

#6968

amoeba

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 20,431

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oroku$aki

I assumed they could get him without boots on the ground, thought they could drone his ass anytime. Maybe they would need some day of jackal type plan to get him.

The Kurds. They're alright.

Fk Turkey. Kurds should get their way.

If you're right then...hmmmm. Assad is the most sane choice? **** that. Cut the head off the snake and see what happens. It's only proper that he goes down hard. I'd hope the fallout is better than the status quo, but if not, I don't care, these hornets had to be released.

Why do you assume Assad is head of snake?

Why are you advocating for the assassination of a leader who has support from the majority of his country?

Assad is scum but there are lots of scum out there and the west's record of regime change has not been great.

02-08-2017 , 04:46 PM

#6969

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

Quote:

Originally Posted by dinopoker

Ok, so we need Turkey, but the Kurds deserve their own country. Life sure is complicated. Syria is a country "nobody really cares about", so we either take Assad out and **** up the middle east/world, or let him remain in power and **** up the middle east/world. Actually, Assad should be sent to the Hague and charged with crimes against humanity, death is too easy an out for him. Let him spend a few decades in prison first.

If it could be calculated that it's roughly 50/50 that things turn out better without Assad, I'd snap take that. 50/50 and Assad gets his just deserts.

02-08-2017 , 04:49 PM

#6970

dinopoker

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 9,437

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oroku$aki

Sounds good. When the invasion of Syria starts we'll make sure you're one of the first ones on the beach.

02-08-2017 , 04:51 PM

#6971

th14

old hand

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 1,460

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroadwaySushy

If they were all destroyed how come he's been using them recently?

He's still using chlorine gas because chlorine, due to it's legitimate industrial uses, isn't a prohibited material. Chlorine gas is bad but much less toxic than the sarin he gave up.

02-08-2017 , 04:53 PM

#6972

BroadwaySushy

banned

Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 3,237

http://time.com/4492670/syria-chemic...-assad-regime/

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oroku$aki

If you're right then obv they weren't all destroyed. You may as well cite Assad's recent use to back up your claim (which is not far fetched.)

Last edited by BroadwaySushy; 02-08-2017 at 05:01 PM.

02-08-2017 , 04:55 PM

#6973

Oroku$aki

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 7,063

Quote:

Originally Posted by amoeba

Why do you assume Assad is head of snake?

Because I do. Because I've read that he's bad, and that he's the leader.

Quote:

Why are you advocating for the assassination of a leader who has support from the majority of his country?

Because A) I don't know for a fact that he has support from the majority, and B) I don't care if he does. Because it makes me feel good. Because he crossed people and countries more powerful than him, and he of all people should understand that might makes right.

02-08-2017 , 04:55 PM

#6974

Paul D

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 14,689

Extract the Syria crap imo

02-08-2017 , 05:06 PM

#6975

uDevil

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 6,941

Quote:

Originally Posted by m_reed05

A hahaha Intel CEO in oval office to do one of the stupid Trump dog and pony shows about investment and jobs in US. They ask for questions, and the CEO has to reluctantly admit they've been working on the factory for "several years."

TBF, this kind of thing tends to be on again off again. And a state of the art fab is a big gamble. Here, they want to implement smaller features (7nm) and bigger wafers (450 mm) at the same time. My guess is the $7B estimate is way too low. Well, unless they can get Trump to do the job.

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