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The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns. The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns.

07-11-2017 , 08:07 AM


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...28971530829824
07-11-2017 , 08:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DVaut1
Maybe I'm cynical, but none of the Trumps are getting charged with anything. Modern American justice for rich white elites is irony, humor, and snark, not like deterring or mitigating their crimes. So pile on the snark and enjoy the show but don't get too invested in expecting these guys to get charged with crimes, you'll likely wind up disappointed.
Maybe cynical, but more accurately a realist.

The necessary evidence was need to be overwhelming, and even then Trump is in a position to make it go away / or just pardon the dude.

And the Republican party isn't going to do ****. It wouldn't even be THAT out of the mainstream since past Presidents have used pardons for their own personal gain.
07-11-2017 , 08:43 AM
Taking false credit for something that was already decided before you faked your involvement. Tweets don't come much more Trumpian than this.

07-11-2017 , 08:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by eyebooger


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...28971530829824
I feel sorry for people who have to interact with people who believe **** like this.
07-11-2017 , 08:52 AM
Just a note, they've been very careful not to in any way implicate Trump in this meeting. worse case scenario, even if Jr goes down, Trump just pardon's him

Also, everyone needs to slow down and remember, nothing matters.
07-11-2017 , 08:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by True North
Taking false credit for something that was already decided before you faked your involvement. Tweets don't come much more Trumpian than this.

Yeah, it's a done deal right? LA gets 2024 or 2028 and Paris gets the other one. All the other candidates dropped out.
07-11-2017 , 09:15 AM
Trump been tweeting that FAKE NEWS!


Fox & Friends' Walks Back Debunked Report About James Comey
07-11-2017 , 09:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillydilly
Just a note, they've been very careful not to in any way implicate Trump in this meeting. worse case scenario, even if Jr goes down, Trump just pardon's him

Also, everyone needs to slow down and remember, nothing matters.
Wrong. There are still a few things that matter, and it's our job to keep making sure those things matter the most and quickly. Saying nothing matters all day long and not taking time to educate the few willing to listen, or protest, or call your officials.

If nothing at all mattered, there wouldn't be a Trump & GOP progress gap between resistance and no resistance.

Our best play is clearly to apply tons of pressure forcing Trump to make National Security decisions to stop Russia's current and future attacks of serious and dangerously vulnerable/unprotected, as opposed to last year, which largely belongs in the hands of Muller and the FBI and commttees.

It's also important not to lose focus on the colluding President Trump has been doing THIS year. Why? Because we can't afford to get bogged down by ridiculous debates such as whether or not Russia is an enemy, or what Obama is neglecting to do now to stop Trump, while we're trying to limit ourselves to pressing stuff like what GOP is doing to keep us safe from a President who not only refuses to live up to this basic principle, but instead keeps trying to expose MORE secrets (than we're already aware of) that help Russia and hurt the United States. I'm not quite sure how Trump and his bumbling surrogates can continue to dance around issues if we limit the discussion to current examples of neglect in the face of obvious Russian attacks and no scapegoats in sight.
07-11-2017 , 09:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pyatnitski
However, Russia probably aren't enemies. It seems "enemies" is narrowly understood to apply "only to the subjects of a foreign power in a state of open hostility with us".

The possible wrinkle is that the US (along with most countries) has pretty much given up on declarations of war, so I'd imagine you couldn't just argue Russia isn't an enemy as no war has been declared. Further the US is involved in a clear war zone along with Russia, and, up until Trump's presidency openly wanted Assad gone, who Russia openly supported. I think there were no clashes between even proxy groups, however - at least those that the two powers would admit to - until the bombing of the air strip recently.

Should add I know this is all just academic, even if it could fit the law I don't think Trump Jr is getting charged with Treason.
The bolded bit bugs me. I've admittedly not studied much case law (by "much" I mean "any") on this issue but do we really have to be at war with a foreign power for them to be considered "hostile?"

What if I commit espionage on behalf of, say, Israel? They're an ally so that's not treason?
07-11-2017 , 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomdemaine
In 50 years who will be seen as a greater set of villains the nazis or 90's to 2020's republicans? The latter will have a far bigger death toll but might skate because "they weren't sure" or whatever.
I don't think they'll restrict their hate to Republicans. Some places have expressed their goals in terms of carbon emission per capita per year and I found 2 tons as one goal. We're all free to aim for that regardless of government policies.
07-11-2017 , 09:53 AM
07-11-2017 , 09:57 AM
In any event, I don't think this rises to treason because I don't see treasonous intent here, if nothing else. I mean we'll call it that because that's what it sounds like and that's how politics works but that's not what it is. It's much more simple: Trump and Family see Rusher as wide-open (for them) economically. No pesky environmental regs or labor laws or civil rights BS or anti-trust BS or human rights BS to deal with (at least nothing that gets enforced), just an opportunity to go make money in Rusher and do whatever the **** they want with impunity because you're br0s with Putin.

I really think this clan is too ****ing stupid to even think on a level required for treason.
07-11-2017 , 09:57 AM
god these big game "hunting" photos make me so ****ing enraged

these dudes are such tiny dick ****ing losers, i'd love to just beat the **** out of them
07-11-2017 , 10:01 AM
DVaut,

I know you are a fan of pro wrestling as a metaphor for politics, so I thought you should know that there apparently is a heel wrestler on some circuit in Appalachia that wrestles under the name of Progressive Liberal. He wears HRC T-shirts during promos, yells at the crowd for voting against its economic interest, and tells them that their jobs are never coming back. His finishing move is the "Liberal Agenda."

No ****. This is a real thing.

http://deadspin.com/the-progressive-...a-d-1796773388
07-11-2017 , 10:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by +rep_lol
god these big game "hunting" photos make me so ****ing enraged

these dudes are such tiny dick ****ing losers, i'd love to just beat the **** out of them
What is the story behind that picture?
07-11-2017 , 10:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rococo
What is the story behind that picture?
He shot an elephant for fun.
07-11-2017 , 10:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rococo
DVaut,

I know you are a fan of pro wrestling as a metaphor for politics, so I thought you should know that there apparently is a heel wrestler on some circuit in Appalachia that wrestles under the name of Progressive Liberal. He wears HRC T-shirts during promos, yells at the crowd for voting against its economic interest, and tells them that their jobs are never coming back. His finishing move is the "Liberal Agenda."

No ****. This is a real thing.

http://deadspin.com/the-progressive-...a-d-1796773388
Your pony took a chair shot.
07-11-2017 , 10:09 AM
I'm actually glad I somehow didn't know about these pic till now.

Even if they weren't part of a fascist family who threatens the life of everyone in this planet, I'd want them physically harmed just for that.
07-11-2017 , 10:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rococo
DVaut,

I know you are a fan of pro wrestling as a metaphor for politics, so I thought you should know that there apparently is a heel wrestler on some circuit in Appalachia that wrestles under the name of Progressive Liberal. He wears HRC T-shirts during promos, yells at the crowd for voting against its economic interest, and tells them that their jobs are never coming back. His finishing move is the "Liberal Agenda."

No ****. This is a real thing.

http://deadspin.com/the-progressive-...a-d-1796773388
Not for nothing, but "Progressive Liberal to be 2020 Democratic presidential nominee" is trading at 34 on Predictit. Still value there imo.
07-11-2017 , 10:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Namath12
The bolded bit bugs me. I've admittedly not studied much case law (by "much" I mean "any") on this issue but do we really have to be at war with a foreign power for them to be considered "hostile?"

What if I commit espionage on behalf of, say, Israel? They're an ally so that's not treason?
There's two parts to the definition of treason, the stuff about 'adhering to an enemy' is the second, the first is about simply 'levying war' against the US. You only have to do one of them, so I imagine that first definition would cover cases where 'treasonous' acts are carried out in collaborating with non enemies. I don't think that applies here, if Russia isn't an enemy then getting information about Hilary Clinton or advancing its interests in general isn't warring with the US.

I think it's the case that, given Treason is rarely actually prosecuted, it's just an open question as to how an 'enemy' is legally understood now formal declarations of war are largely a thing of the past.
07-11-2017 , 10:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
He shot an elephant for fun.
I figured out that much. Where? Is that even legal? Was this one of those deals where someone puts an animal in an enclosed space and you walk up and shoot it.

I think I saw a Louis Theroux documentary on something like that.

I don't understand how anyone who has seen an elephant could have any desire to shoot an elephant.
07-11-2017 , 10:13 AM
07-11-2017 , 10:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
He shot an elephant for fun.
It was coming right for him
07-11-2017 , 10:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson
Your pony took a chair shot.
Oh sorry. I haven't kept up that closely with this thread over the last week or so.
07-11-2017 , 10:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pyatnitski
There's two parts to the definition of treason, the stuff about 'adhering to an enemy' is the second, the first is about simply 'levying war' against the US. You only have to do one of them, so I imagine that first definition would cover cases where 'treasonous' acts are carried out in collaborating with non enemies. I don't think that applies here, if Russia isn't an enemy then getting information about Hilary Clinton or advancing its interests in general isn't warring with the US.

I think it's the case that, given Treason is rarely actually prosecuted, it's just an open question as to how an 'enemy' is legally understood now formal declarations of war are largely a thing of the past.
The issue is the are collaborating with Russia, during the presidential campaign, to negotiate this:

We help you win the election
You get sanctions removed


The sanctions were put in place by the president of the united states, so the sanctions are the official line of the USA at the time of the meeting

Trump Jr and Co. are meeting with Russians, with the intent of getting help to win the election. to subvert official US policy in respects to russia

Thats treason

      
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