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The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns. The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: No smocking guns.

05-08-2017 , 12:39 PM
To be fair, those MOABs were already built and paid for and just sitting around gathering dust. Dropping that was one of Trump's least costly moves.
05-08-2017 , 12:46 PM
Does Trump own MOAB stock also*?

*The same way he bought 59 tomahawks worth of stock in 2015.
05-08-2017 , 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverman
In the 60s finance was like 5% of GDP. Wall Street basically issued bonds for big companies. Now finance is about 20% of GDP. And that growth has benefited exclusively a) Wall Street and b) the wealthy and powerful. The finance bro argument that their super duper awesome innovation benefits everyone is complete bull****.
401ks, index investing, lower brokerage fees and tighter spreads, and increased access to credit don't benefit the middle class?
05-08-2017 , 01:06 PM
The 43 people who might run against Trump in 2020
Quote:
Here are 43 possible candidates who could take on Trump in 2020:

Former Vice President Joe Biden: Biden, 74, said he "regretted" not running in 2016. He stoked major speculation about 2020 with a busy travel schedule but later said, "Guys, I'm not running!"

Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.): Sanders, 75, emerged as a leader on the left after his 2016 presidential run, and he's working with the Democratic National Committee to help unite the party. He wouldn't rule out a 2020 run but said in January it's "much too early" to discuss another bid.

Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.): Warren, 67, has become one of the biggest thorns in Trump's side. In an April interview, Warren said she has no plans to run in 2020 and is focused on her 2018 reelection.

Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.): Harris, 52, has been in the Senate for just four months, but the rising star is already floated as a potential contender. The former California attorney general said she's not thinking about future campaigns.

Sen. Chris Murphy (D-Conn.): The vocal gun control advocate has been another strong Trump critic. The White House reportedly asked consultants to look into Murphy, 43, and four other possible Trump challengers.

Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn.): Klobuchar, 56, is running for reelection next year, but she stoked major speculation with her plans to travel to Iowa, a crucial state on the primary schedule, this weekend.

Facebook CEO and founder Mark Zuckerberg: Zuckerberg, 32, who also co-founded an immigration advocacy organization, created some buzz when he said he'll visit all 50 states this year.

Sen. Cory Booker (D-N.J.): Booker's meteoric rise from a mayor of Newark, N.J., to U.S. senator has prompted speculation about a future run for president. While Booker, 48, won't discuss future plans, he didn't rule it out, either.

Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-N.Y.): Gillibrand, Clinton's Senate successor in 2009, earned Democratic cred by leading the Senate Democrats in votes against confirming Trump's Cabinet nominees. But Gillibrand, 50, says she's focused on her 2018 reelection campaign and recently ruled out a 2020 run.

Colorado Gov. John Hickenlooper: Hickenlooper, 65, who was on Clinton's vice presidential shortlist, has been floated. He told the Denver Post that he's not running for president.

New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo: Cuomo, 59, is running for reelection in 2018, but he hired two fundraisers from Florida, a sign that he could be considering a presidential run.

Former Maryland Gov. Martin O'Malley: O'Malley, 54, didn't gain much traction in his 2016 run, but he's already testing the waters again. A political action committee affiliated with him polled Democratic caucus voters in Iowa, and he visited New Hampshire in April.

Former Housing and Urban Development Secretary Juli n Castro: Castro, 42, was on Clinton's vice presidential shortlist. The former San Antonio mayor drew national attention for his 2012 Democratic National Convention speech.

Sen. Tim Kaine (D-Va.): Kaine, 59, grew his profile as Clinton's running mate. After the election, Kaine ruled out running for president or vice president in 2020. He's up for reelection in 2018.

Sen. Al Franken (D-Minn.): Franken, 65, emerged as a tough critic during the confirmation hearings for Trump's Cabinet picks. In an interview, he said he's not running, noting that senators generally don't fare well running for president.

Sen. Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio): Brown, 64, was on Clinton's running mate shortlist. He could face a tough reelection in 2018, though, after Trump won his state in 2016.

Former Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick: Patrick, 60, left office in 2015 and now works at Bain Capital. He's been previously floated as a presidential contender and is close with a former top Obama adviser, David Axelrod.

New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio: De Blasio, 55, is running for reelection this year. His political prospects have been buoyed by the news that he won't face charges in a federal investigation into his 2013 campaign fundraising.

Dallas Mavericks owner Mark Cuban: The billionaire businessman and "Shark Tank" star frequently clashed with Trump in 2016 and endorsed Clinton. Cuban, 58, has said "we will see" about whether he runs for president.

Environmental activist Tom Steyer: The billionaire donor, 59, who runs a climate change advocacy group, is considered a possible candidate for California governor in 2018.

Democratic National Committee Chairman Tom Perez: The former Labor secretary, 55, was elected head of the national party this year and is looking to rebuild after the 2016 elections.

Minnesota Gov. Mark Dayton: Dayton, 70, was recently diagnosed with prostate cancer but plans to finish out his term, which ends in 2018.

Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe: The term-limited governor will be out of office in January 2018. McAuliffe, 60, is a well-connected ally of both Bill and Hillary Clinton and a former DNC chairman.

California Lt. Gov. Gavin Newsom: Newsom, 49, launched an early 2018 bid for California governor. He's said being president seems "like the most miserable job in the world."

Facebook COO Sheryl Sandberg: Sandberg, 47, drew praise for her book "Lean In," which discusses women in the workforce, but she has said she won't run and will "continue to say no."

Starbucks CEO Howard Schultz: Schultz, 63, is stepping down from his role and will be executive chairman. He was urged by friend to run in 2016, but he endorsed Clinton.

Former first lady Michelle Obama: The former first lady proved a formidable campaigner for Clinton in 2016, but Obama, 53, and others close to her have said she won't run for elected office.

Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson: The wrestler and star of the "Fast and the Furious" film franchise has flirted with running for office. A registered Republican, Johnson, 45, spoke at the party's convention in 2000, but documentary filmmaker Michael Moore has urged him to run. One potential political ally: Warren, who has described herself as a fan of Johnson's HBO show "Ballers."

Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-Hawaii): Gabbard, 36, hasn't been afraid to buck her party. She drew scrutiny for secretly meeting with Syrian President Bashar Assad and criticizing the U.S. strike on Syria following Assad's alleged use of chemical weapons on civilians.

Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.): Ellison, 53, was a prominent Sanders supporter and was a leading contender for DNC chairman before losing to Perez. He now serves as the DNC's deputy chairman.

Rep. Sean Patrick Maloney (D-N.Y.): Maloney, 50, considered a bid to lead the House Democrats' campaign arm this cycle, but passed. He wrote Democrats' autopsy on the 2016 elections.

California Gov. Jerry Brown: Brown, whose term is up in 2018, doesn't think he'll run for office again, but wouldn't rule it out. Brown, 79, has run for president three times.

Media mogul Oprah Winfrey: Winfrey, 63, who endorsed Clinton, is frequently floated for president but has said she will "never" run.

Former Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wis.): Feingold, 64, served in the Senate from 1993 to 2011, but he lost a comeback bid in 2016. He considered a presidential run in 2008.

Former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean: Dean, 68, unsuccessfully ran for president in 2004. Dean, whose tenure as DNC chairman from 2005 to 2009 was marked by its successful "50 States Strategy," briefly ran for DNC chair this year before dropping out.

Former Vice President Al Gore: Gore, 69, who lost the 2000 presidential election after a Supreme Court decision, reemerged in politics when stumping for Clinton last year.

Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.): Warner, 62, ruled out a 2020 run: "I think that window is probably shut."

Former Sen. Jim Webb (D-Va.): Webb ran for the Democratic nomination in 2016 but dropped out after only polling in the single digits. He briefly weighed running as an independent. Since the 2016 race, Webb, 71, has pitched himself as a politician who can understand the white working-class voters who are flocking to Trump.

Los Angeles Mayor Eric Garcetti: Garcetti, 46, is considering a 2018 bid for California governor, but The New York Times reported that national donors have urged him to run for president.

Rep. Seth Moulton (D-Mass.): Moulton, an Iraq War veteran, was also mentioned in the New York Times story and privately says he's not ruling out a bid. Moulton, 38, brushed aside the story but is fundraising off of it anyway.

New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu: Landrieu, 56, called the a New York Times story about him considering a run "hysterical." He gained notoriety after defending the removal of Confederate memorials in New Orleans.

Sen. Tammy Duckworth (D-Ill.): Duckworth, 49, recently made the switch from the House to the Senate. She's an Iraq War veteran and lost both of her legs while serving as a Army helicopter pilot during the war.

Washington Gov. Jay Inslee: The two-term governor was a congressman for more than a decade. Inslee, 66, played a role in his state's lawsuit against Trump's travel ban.
05-08-2017 , 01:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Our House
43 people who might run for the change to run against Trump

how bad will the dems screw up the process then?
05-08-2017 , 01:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Our House
Just to show how everything Trump proclaims trickles down to his supporters and state run Fox media: Judge Jeanine was doing her "Street Justice" segment 2 weeks ago. She asked people on the streets of NYC who they would rather run into in a dark alley - Kim Jong-un, someone from ISIS, or Putin. She even emphasized the P in Putin like "Pffft-utin" to, you know, lead the question a bit. Fox's intentions are obvious to anyone with half a brain. That said, Trumpkins are really scared of ISIS.
Some random guy from ISIS is the correct response, though. Who's more likely to kill you in an alley in NYC? The leader of a country, who is apparently on an official state visit and got lost down this alley, or some random dude from ISIS who is likely either on a terrorist mission or fleeing the feds?

Great question, Fox News. Way to lead the discourse to the highest levels!
05-08-2017 , 01:15 PM
Spicey starting the BS-a-thon...
05-08-2017 , 01:15 PM
If we survive Trump, the books are going to be INCREDIBLE:

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/artic...-trump-doesn-t

Quote:
Other White House officials however tell me this is not the sentiment the president has expressed recently in private. Trump was livid, according to three White House officials, after reading in the Wall Street Journal that McMaster had called his South Korean counterpart to assure him that the president's threat to make that country pay for a new missile defense system was not official policy. These officials say Trump screamed at McMaster on a phone call, accusing him of undercutting efforts to get South Korea to pay its fair share.

This was not an isolated incident. Trump has complained in front of McMaster in intelligence briefings about "the general undermining my policy," according to two White House officials. The president has given McMaster less face time. McMaster's requests to brief the president before some press interviews have been declined. Over the weekend, McMaster did not accompany Trump to meet with Australia's prime minister; the outgoing deputy national security adviser, K.T. McFarland, attended instead.
05-08-2017 , 01:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by uDevil
We can only hope Obama didn't warn Trump not to start WW3.
Obama should have gone reverse psychology and told Trump to start WW3 knowing that he would do the opposite of what he recommends out of spite.
05-08-2017 , 01:19 PM
No Spicey, we don't look forward to your WH readout of phone calls...we look forward to the one from the OTHER country.
05-08-2017 , 01:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuserounder
Some random guy from ISIS is the correct response, though. Who's more likely to kill you in an alley in NYC? The leader of a country, who is apparently on an official state visit and got lost down this alley, or some random dude from ISIS who is likely either on a terrorist mission or fleeing the feds?

Great question, Fox News. Way to lead the discourse to the highest levels!
hmmm given Fox News' gun-totting demographic, I thought that the Fox viewer was the one doing the killing?
05-08-2017 , 01:32 PM
Reporter 1: Flynn this
Spice: Obama this
Reporter 2: Flynn that
Spice: Obama that
Reporter 5: Flynn the other thing
Spice: Obama the other thing

Me: Oh **** all Melissa!
05-08-2017 , 01:36 PM
After they say Trump STILL has Muslim ban crap on his website Spicy had to have just thought in his head: "you have got to be ****ing kidding me here!"
05-08-2017 , 01:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raradevils
43 people who might run for the change to run against Trump

how bad will the dems screw up the process then?
There are plenty of landmines on that list in the current climate. Morally, I hate to root against a candidate because of the alt-right, but I think nominating some of those folks will play right into Trump's rhetoric and energize the alt-right base that he might lose otherwise because they feel betrayed. Murphy would be a disaster at the national level (How much extra money from the NRA is he worth? How big of a bump does he create in turnout among NRA members?).

There are some good names on there, but the ones with the best combination of credentials, recognition, and stances are too old (Bernie, Warren, Biden). Bernie and Biden would both be great to run against Trump. They can relate to rust belt voters, they can connect to the average voter WAY better than most politicians - both come from average/poor backgrounds. It's just a shame they're both as old as they are.

Overall the list is a joke, given that the Rock is on it as a registered Republican.. and his RNC speech was about 2 minutes saying get out and vote, if ya smellelelel, etc, etc. He was literally in character.

Also, I'm surprised Joe Kennedy didn't even make the list.
05-08-2017 , 01:39 PM
Don't forget:

Facebook CEO and founder Mark Zuckerberg: Zuckerberg, 32, who also co-founded an immigration advocacy organization, created some buzz when he said he'll visit all 50 states this year.
05-08-2017 , 01:42 PM
Grunching like 150 posts or so but in case it hasn't been talked about, the current debate, being framed as it is, about end of life and rationing healthcare is a huge, huge win for drug and insurance companies. The #1 question we should be asking and coming up with an answer for right now is: why is everything in the US so damn expensive? Why do we pay so much for drugs, why does an ER visit bill for thousands of dollars and a birth in the hospital over 10 grand? Once we get that in line we can figure everything else out but until that point our system will continue to be woefully inefficient.

Edit: my pony needs to be taken off life support

Last edited by Jiggymike; 05-08-2017 at 01:52 PM.
05-08-2017 , 01:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Our House
Don't forget:

Facebook CEO and founder Mark Zuckerberg: Zuckerberg, 32, who also co-founded an immigration advocacy organization, created some buzz when he said he'll visit all 50 states this year.
Don't like I could handle another President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho.
05-08-2017 , 01:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiggymike
Grunching like 150 posts or so but in case it hasn't been talked about, the current debate, being framed as it is, about end of life and rationing healthcare is a huge, huge win for drug and insurance companies. The #1 question we should be asking and coming up with an answer for right now is: why is everything in the US so damn expensive? Why do we pay so much for drugs, why does an ER visit bill for thousands of dollars and a birth in the hospital over 10 grand? Once we get that in line we can figure everything else out but until that point our system will continue to be woefully inefficient.
It is pretty nuts when you think about it.

I was talking to a cab driver in Estonia who had to get a kidney transplant. Tried to get it in Tallinn (the capital) but they didn't have the facility. Got transported to the best hospital in Estonia which is located 2 hours away by car from the capital, got the kidney transplant done and was in the hospital for 3 weeks afterwards for follow-up treatment.

Cost?

Spoiler:
1250€ ($1,366)
05-08-2017 , 02:13 PM
"Does the President feel that healthcare is a right or a product?"

Good question. Easy to understand, direct, and Trump has been all over the place on the issue. This should help narrow it down. C'mon Spicey...

"The President has been clear on this."

Nope. Fail.
05-08-2017 , 02:52 PM
earlier today i was watching an interview with neil degrasse tyson and he was talking about how the united states has the chance to be a world leader going into the future on so many fronts, yet due to our leadership's denial of science and stubborn embrace of dying industries like coal, we're falling behind and letting other countries take the lead. it's pretty sad to think about it, especially when considering that this path is the actual vision of both trump and his supporters.
05-08-2017 , 02:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperUberBob
I was talking to a cab driver in Estonia who had to get a kidney transplant. Tried to get it in Tallinn (the capital) but they didn't have the facility. Got transported to the best hospital in Estonia which is located 2 hours away by car from the capital, got the kidney transplant done and was in the hospital for 3 weeks afterwards for follow-up treatment.
Sir, how can you possibly expect a not-yet-great-again America to compete financially with a powerhouse like Estonia? Please try a more reasonable comparison.
05-08-2017 , 03:14 PM
I'm no lawyer but it sounds to me like the judges in the travel ban case are tearing the government a new one.
05-08-2017 , 03:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperUberBob
It is pretty nuts when you think about it.

I was talking to a cab driver in Estonia who had to get a kidney transplant. Tried to get it in Tallinn (the capital) but they didn't have the facility. Got transported to the best hospital in Estonia which is located 2 hours away by car from the capital, got the kidney transplant done and was in the hospital for 3 weeks afterwards for follow-up treatment.

Cost?

Spoiler:
1250€ ($1,366)


Do you know, what the only thing that surprises me about that story is?
Spoiler:
That you can drive away from any place in Estonia for two hours without crossing a border.
05-08-2017 , 03:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raradevils
43 people who might run for the change to run against Trump

how bad will the dems screw up the process then?
Since you are the party taking personal responsibility, please make sure you run a GOP candidate that could beat Trump in the primary. You know, since the 18 you ran in 2016 couldn't do it.

But go on, tell us more how that's the Dems fault*.

* Bonus points for when you point out you aren't Republican.
05-08-2017 , 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalledDownLight
401ks, index investing, lower brokerage fees and tighter spreads, and increased access to credit don't benefit the middle class?
None of this had **** to do with Wall Street. Bogle detests Wall Street. LOL access to credit, 2009 loved that ****

      
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