The Presidency of Donald J. Trump: Harm to Ongoing Matter - Page 505 - Politics and Economics

Soto said the bill will be supported by Rep. Don Young (R-Alaska), former chairman of the House Natural Resources Committee that oversees Puerto Rico issues, as well as other House Republicans. Republican Sens. Marco Rubio and Rick Scott of Florida, home to thousands of Puerto Rico expats, have previously expressed support for statehood if that is what Puerto Rico chooses.

03-28-2019 , 01:07 PM

#12602

otatop

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 12,721

If they win big in 2020 Dems should push hard for Puerto Rico and D.C. statehood and think about updating the Reapportionment Act of 1929 to give states better representation in the House.

03-28-2019 , 01:16 PM

#12603

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 74,252

Schiff was presented with a letter signed by 8 Repubs from his committee (that he chairs), demanding that he resign the chairmanship.

His response:

03-28-2019 , 01:19 PM

#12604

otatop

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 12,721

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Truant

I mean he is an idiot but they have shirts and signs and all of that, he has to be aware. A conspiracy where he is a ****ing superhero? It’s probajly his favorite thing. It may not be specific to the Q bull****, but it is clearly his MO to claim he has info to imply **** that isn’t true. He has been doing it forever.

I just meant that I can't imagine him not sneaking in Q phrases to get his base super amped if he knew what they were.

WaPo with some examples of Trump lies:

03-28-2019 , 01:22 PM

#12605

Mark Ross

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 318

Quote:

Originally Posted by Namath12

Georgie Conway has been firing shats from the bell tower all morning, most at Trump, but then there's this

Is he not aware of Ben Shapiro's involvement with Breitbart?

I guess making a career out of minimizing racial issues and referring to Arabs as piles of sewage isn't alt right enough for fat Georgie.

03-28-2019 , 01:35 PM

#12606

markksman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,921

Quote:

Originally Posted by realDonaldTrump

( twitter | raw text )

Which caused #DevinNunesisanIdiot to trend on Twitter last night.

03-28-2019 , 01:38 PM

#12607

markksman

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,921

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson

I had a Romanian roommate once, he was chill.

Did he pave driveways and tar roofs?

03-28-2019 , 01:41 PM

#12608

Trolly McTrollson

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 36,688

Quote:

Originally Posted by otatop

I just meant that I can't imagine him not sneaking in Q phrases to get his base super amped if he knew what they were.

WaPo with some examples of Trump lies:

All those accounting crimes just so he could bid on the Buffalo Bills? smh

03-28-2019 , 02:41 PM

#12609

Nicholasp27

27th level thinker

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 83,058

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominic

Schiff was presented with a letter signed by 8 Repubs from his committee (that he chairs), demanding that he resign the chairmanship.

His response:

This video should be how everyone is thinking about and talking about the Russia stuff

I don’t know how keed, inso, awval can hand-wave that stuff away but I know this video won’t change their mind; would take something more like $51/week to change awval’s mind and I’m not sure anything could get through to keed and inso as they seem to be true believers rather than worried about a little bit of money

03-28-2019 , 02:44 PM

#12610

wheatrich

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 21,239

Selling nuke technology to the guys who hijacked 9-11 planes to trigger the libs

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1R82MG

03-28-2019 , 02:57 PM

#12611

cuserounder

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,217

Quote:

Originally Posted by SenorKeeed

Our current system, where the rich exploit the undocumented immigrants is immoral, yes. I agree that a generous but regulated guest worker program is a good possible solution to the status quo, but I don't think that it should be anyone who shows up at our border wanting to come in. We would want to control the numbers and check the backgrounds of those who come. But I do think that the more generous the welfare state is the more problematic the guest worker situation is; if there is no path to citizenship you're creating a permanent underclass with little to no chance for social mobility, if the path to citizenship is too quick you risk overwhelming the welfare state with a flood of low skill workers from the poorest countries who would quite rationally try to come to improve their lives.

The only people in elected office nationally talking about completely open borders with no restrictions are Republicans claiming the Democrats want that. Democrats overall support more legal immigration, not just letting anyone in without so much as checking on who they are.

So your argument is that a generous welfare state would be unfair to guest workers, thus we should not let them in at all in the first place? Or just not have any welfare state at all? Ah, yes, the classic Republican argument technique: we can't do ANYTHING until we know EVERYTHING... We can't do ANYTHING if we don't know the solution will be perfectly fair for EVERYONE.

God forbid we make solid incremental improvements and adjust and adapt along the way to improve them... Because it's not like the GOP is using this line of argument to say that we need to go farther and do more right off the bat to make things better, they're using the argument to argue against doing anything at all.

It's disingenuous, as usual.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tgiggity

+1, keep up the good posts

Thanks!

03-28-2019 , 03:24 PM

#12612

gregorio

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 39,313

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Sklansky

You are trying to wiggle out of what I am actually asking. Change my question to 75% of very smart totally non racist people who are willing to agree that there are more benefits than just GDP. The only thing you have to overcome is their ability to recognize fallacies. Can you get them to agree you are almost certainly right?

(Note: I agree that it is totally unfair that Americans think that they have a right to live in a much richer country when it is almost total luck that they are here. Some have the small argument that their great grandparents went to war so they would have that luck but its very weak. My only problem with your assertion is that you said it as if it was a fact even though even a lot of liberals would disagree. To do that you must have arguments that get past the best argument evaluaters. At least you do here. If you want to couch a gut feeling as an obvious fact you need to go to Mike Caro's website.)

If you are actually interested in the benefits of more open borders and not just trolling, here's a good article by someone who has a PhD in economics from Harvard (undergrad from California Institute of Technology) that's been cited 475 times. Cliffs are that more research needs to be done, but still, the benefit seems promising.

Quote:

What is the greatest single class of distortions in the global economy? One contender for this title is the tightly binding constraints on emigration from poor countries.... How large are the economic losses caused by barriers to emigration? Research on this question has been distinguished by its rarity and obscurity, but the few estimates we have should make economists’ jaws hit their desks.

When it comes to policies that restrict emigration, there appear to be trillion-dollar bills on the sidewalk. The gains to eliminating those barriers amount to large fractions of world GDP—one or two orders of magnitude larger than the gains from dropping all remaining restrictions on international flows of and capital.

https://pubs.aeaweb.org/doi/pdf/10.1257/jep.25.3.83

03-28-2019 , 03:24 PM

#12613

Paul D

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 14,689

03-28-2019 , 03:42 PM

#12614

realDonaldTrump

WITCH HUNT!

Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 2,921

( twitter | raw text )

03-28-2019 , 03:45 PM

#12615

Huehuecoyotl

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 29,257

It's like some poor machine learning attempt at language

03-28-2019 , 03:48 PM

#12616

MrWookie

Don't Call Me Meredith

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 94,159

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Ross

I guess making a career out of minimizing racial issues and referring to Arabs as piles of sewage isn't alt right enough for fat Georgie.

George Conway is not an ally, and he's definitely of the conservative school of thought that the only people you can call racists are people who self-identify as racists. Shapiro doesn't identify as racist, so he can say all manner of racist things and you daren't call him racist.

03-28-2019 , 03:52 PM

#12617

realDonaldTrump

WITCH HUNT!

Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 2,921

( twitter | raw text )

03-28-2019 , 03:55 PM

#12618

ScreaminAsian

For President

Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 33,333

lol

03-28-2019 , 04:01 PM

#12619

SenorKeeed

mew mew mew

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 37,478

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicholasp27

Not sure what I'm hand waving away. The question isn't are these things "OK". There's lots of things about the Trump presidency that aren't "OK". The question is were the things that Schiff listed criminal. And if Barr's summary of Mueller's report can be believed then an extensive investigation was not able to establish the criminality of the acts that Schiff listed. And so, all right, Don Jr met with some Russians? If it can't be shown that he broke any laws when doing so then who cares? Let's charge some folks with conspiring with the Russians or move on. Same thing goes for all the other items on Schiff's list. If it can't be proven that the things he thinks "aren't OK" are actually criminal acts then it's time to move on to other issues and put this two and a half year investigation behind us.

03-28-2019 , 04:07 PM

#12620

Paul D

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 14,689

HEY GAIZ. DONT EVEN TALK ABOUT THINGS YOU CANT PROVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111!!!!

I MEAN BARR A TRUMP APOINTEE IS TOTALLY APPROPRIATE PERZON TO DECIDE THA MATTER

BTW I LOVE GG AND TOTALLY AM NOT COCERN TROLLING

03-28-2019 , 04:08 PM

#12621

Effen

CRAB

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 24,004

lots of things are totally not ok and im totally not good with them but also stop talking about them immediately

A+, totally not hand waving

03-28-2019 , 04:08 PM

#12622

LFS

emo gaylord

Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 21,865

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl

It's like some poor machine learning attempt at language

deductibility ridiculously high

03-28-2019 , 04:17 PM

#12623

SenorKeeed

mew mew mew

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 37,478

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuserounder

And microbet and that other dude, who I was replying to when I said I didn't think that totally open borders jive with a more generous welfare state? Which I know is a position that microbet also holds? I mean you seem to acknowledge that holding both positions at once creates some challenging policy issues.

Quote:

So your argument is that a generous welfare state would be unfair to guest workers, thus we should not let them in at all in the first place? Or just not have any welfare state at all? Ah, yes, the classic Republican argument technique: we can't do ANYTHING until we know EVERYTHING... We can't do ANYTHING if we don't know the solution will be perfectly fair for EVERYONE.

God forbid we make solid incremental improvements and adjust and adapt along the way to improve them... Because it's not like the GOP is using this line of argument to say that we need to go farther and do more right off the bat to make things better, they're using the argument to argue against doing anything at all.

It's disingenuous, as usual.

I mean yeah, the position you're hallucinating I am arguing for is highly disingenuous, good job sniffing that out. My actual position is imo less disingenuous -- I think we should have a generous but limited guest worker program with some path to citizenship, increase somewhat the burden on employers to make sure that the folks they're hiring are actually here legally, and implement a one time amnesty that would put everyone working illegally currently into the guest worker program. And I support Medicare for all, probably even for guest workers who under the reformed system would pay payroll taxes. The tricky part would be regulating the number of guest workers -- really my only point is that you can't just let anyone in the country who shows up at the border. Which is only a point brought up by microbet, that other guy I was responding to and Republicans arguing in bad faith about imagined political opponent's positions. But **** man, it's not my fault we had two dudes arguing for totally open borders itt. Bring it up with them!

03-28-2019 , 04:24 PM

#12624

SenorKeeed

mew mew mew

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 37,478

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul D

Quote:

Originally Posted by Effen

lots of things are totally not ok and im totally not good with them but also stop talking about them immediately

A+, totally not hand waving

you guys can talk about whatever you like. Have at it, keep talking about Don meeting with Russians till 2023 for all I care. Nicholas asked how I could hand wave away these points, and I answered. It's not hand waving, it's about what can be proven to be criminal acts. Which to me seems a fairly reasonable standard for judging the outcome of a criminal investigation? But what do I know.