Official "Intellectual Dork Web" Fanboi Containment Thread - Page 23 - Politics and Economics

I can't stand them. They have no policy knowledge whatsoever. Its content free rants and jokes about how everything is terrible. They don't offer much that a well curated Twitter feed doesn't do better.

Interesting take. Two of them worked in the white house and seem pretty wonky.

07-03-2018 , 01:31 PM

#553

simplicitus

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,840

Trumpcast is still among the best.

PSA is good on Tuesday, when Lovett's on.

Opening arguments is now my favorite legal podcast.

Weeds is favorite podcast, then Chris Hayes, then Ezra Klein probably. I was 9/10 on Harris 18 months ago, am probably 7/10 now, maybe 6/10 after that pic, but I'll still defend him vs Fly.

Joe Rogan has been a mouth breathing idiot and a bad person every second he has been alive.

07-03-2018 , 01:45 PM

#554

Clovis8

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 16,503

I had to quit listening to trumpcast because it was so good at making my blood boil. It is very good but soooo depressing. I prefer a bit of hope, even if it’s faked.

07-03-2018 , 01:56 PM

#555

aoFrantic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 25,221

I enjoyed PSA during the election and Lovett is ok but I haven't listened in months. They've gotten somewhat exposed, cant judge which way the winds are going and are pretty good poster boys for centrist dems who have failed so much over the last decade.

07-03-2018 , 01:58 PM

#556

simplicitus

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,840

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson

Actually, I don't think the Tea Party was all that religious when you compare it to the evangelical movement of the 80's-90's. By and large it was much more concerned with racebaiting over Obama's birth certificate and BENGHAZIIIII than religion, although the Christian Right jumped on board because those people are the most credulous morons on the planet. Certainly the (((Koch))) brothers who bankrolled the Tea Party weren't all that interested in promoting Christian fundamentalism.

Really, the evangelical involvement with the Republican Party was an aberration, a trend that started in the late 70's, reached its peak in the mid-90s, and was on its way out when the New Atheists popped up. George W Bush was their swan song. If you look at the tastemakers in today's Republican party you see guys like Hannity, Laura Inghram, Dana Loesch, and etc. who are nominally Christian but almost never actually talk about Jesus. To say nothing of the alt-right guys like Milo who are positively sacrilegious. There's no Jerry Falwell or Ralph Reed anymore, no evangelical power-players in the movement. Glen Beck is the only one I can even think of and he's Mormon and a persona non grata. Maybe Mike Pence but he's really a back-bencher. It's a far cry from the Family Values party I remember as a kid.

Basically what we have now is a secular personality cult of Trumpism that occasionally throws a bone to religious right to keep them in the coalition. But they're also playing the other side by breaking bread with the irreligious alt-right.

I see what you're saying but have been reading a book, The End of White Christian America, which is focused on data and notes that the tea party was more an evangelical movement than anything else. It's really hard to separate 80s style evangelism and white identity movements, and the current olds basically live in the 80s in terms of their views.

07-03-2018 , 02:39 PM

#557

simplicitus

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,840

Quote:

Originally Posted by aoFrantic

Kinda agree with this. They are huge as a pocast, network, and show, but the Vitor and favure (?sp) are just generally smart, informed guys who know how a normal WH works. Lovett is very smart and funny and acerbic. The other two are if anything too sincere for the times and have no deep expertise.

07-03-2018 , 02:45 PM

#558

simplicitus

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,840

Through the app I use, Pocket Casts, which is great and worth buying, I get 5-10 podcasts a day and listen to my mainstays and then random others that look good.

Other goods ones, mainly mentioned already
538
On the media
Poltico nercast is good for inside baseball/politics reporting
Sometimes slate politics gabfest, but Jon Dickerson kinda sucks
Radio Atlantic because I like Alex Wagner
All the president's lawyers with Ken White (popehat)
Sometimes longform
New Yorker radio hour
The Watergate podcast Slow Burn was great

07-03-2018 , 02:51 PM

#559

aoFrantic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 25,221

Quote:

Originally Posted by simplicitus

Like I think their niche is a busier person who wants to stay informed but isn't active politically day to day. Someone who isn't always online, on twitter a lot and can get a rundown from them. They're obviously bigger than that, but they're not more useful than that.

07-03-2018 , 03:01 PM

#560

goofyballer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 70,719

Quote:

Originally Posted by markbris1

So if someone wanted to listen to politics or otherwise intellectual podcasts, is there anything that 2p2 recommends?

idk how no one has mentioned

Chapo Trap House: some very funny DSA types who are equal opportunity bashers of Republicans and centrist/MSNBC-type Democrats

Pod Save The People, with DeRay Mckesson: focuses on social justice issues, usually gives a different perspective than you'd find elsewhere (in the sense that, after hearing their take on something, you're usually like "wow that seems so obvious and yet I've not heard any of the white people who dominate the media landscape say anything like that")

Majority 54, with Jason Kander: weekly deep dives on specific topics, usually with interesting interviews w/ people involved in political activism on that subject

07-03-2018 , 03:20 PM

#561

champstark

aka starkwired

Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 14,838

Quote:

Originally Posted by aoFrantic

pretty much exactly my take as well--they also suffer with the fact that the show can be behind the news cycle and that live shows are terrible

07-03-2018 , 03:41 PM

#562

ANONN123

Guest

Posts: n/a

I quit PSA for others (Citations Needed) but still listen to Pod Save the World and genuinely enjoy it - it's Foreign Relations focused.

Also started to download Ezra's podcast since his spat with SH; only listened to one so far but thought it was pretty good.

+1 to Majority 54 as a solid podcast as well

I've been listening to Intelligence Matters (former dep dir of CIA) but may quit it soon - occasionally gets deep on issues but when he interviews politicians it's garbage

07-03-2018 , 03:45 PM

#563

Trolly McTrollson

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 36,790

I Don’t Even Own a Television is fun.

07-03-2018 , 04:11 PM

#564

ANONN123

Guest

Posts: n/a

Seems like a good discussion but I'd rather not open this thread to have it, so I made a new thread

07-03-2018 , 06:55 PM

#565

vaya

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 15,156

Quote:

Originally Posted by vaya

I think there genuinely exists a cross section of people for whom the aggressive Christianity of the tea party truly is a turn off but nonetheless are down with endless bombing of the middle east, reduction of the welfare state to zero, etc. Right wing ideology is so well funded in this country that they can afford to support the political equivalent of Fresca, call it "new atheism" or whatever, and rope in a few extra people even though the majority would find it distasteful.

Which is to say that just because someone uses atheism as a permission structure to arrive at waging war on Muslims it doesn't mean arguing the finer points of Islam is going to change their mind.

07-03-2018 , 06:58 PM

#566

vaya

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 15,156

Quote:

Originally Posted by aoFrantic

Yeah, this. I listen to chapo and occasionally Lovett's podcast. I'm not sure there's much more out there that's worthwhile.

07-03-2018 , 08:17 PM

#567

Huehuecoyotl

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 29,257

If anyone's curious The Baffler did a dive in Murray's origins

https://thebaffler.com/salvos/the-wh...odian-schrader

Cliffs is his initial worldview was that everyone was the same and the poor were poor because they were incitivized to do things that made them poor so to help them out we needed to disassemble the welfare state. By doing so the obstacles to being poor would be removed and millions would be lifted out of poverty.

He then got in a white supremacist intellectual group who wanted to put an intellectual gloss on their idea that minorities were inferior and that that difference was permanent.

Murray became converted and came up with the idea that because the divide in intelligence can never be overcome we should cut benifits to the cognitive failures and have benign neglect, basically put the poor on reservations.

Quote:

At the end of*The Bell Curve, Murray and Herrnstein signaled the coming possibility of a “high-tech and more lavish version of the Indian reservation for some substantial minority of the nation’s population, while the rest of America tries to go about its business.” This is effectively what he describes in his shoulder-shrugging outline of “social apartheid”—no regret, just cruel necessity. His mirage of small-town America comes with consequences for substantive equality beyond the undermined welfare state: the citizens marooned on the left-hand tail of the bell curve will remain locked up so the rest of us can pursue happiness. This is what “facing up to inequality” looks like in his reality—and it’s also why Charles Murray’s epiphanies are the country’s nightmares.

07-03-2018 , 10:42 PM

#568

FlyWf

It's the other way

Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 58,097

Quote:

Originally Posted by aflametotheground

Fly: You mention me, i would say that i dont particularly want to touch this topic on race, its a bit too nasty for my liking. The guy who wrote the book choses to dive into something that most ppl would shy away from.

Is the thing that people would shy away from that black people are stupider than other people, a thing you believe is definitely true?

It's ****ing incredible how bad you people are at dodging questions. I mean, try ****ing lying? It can't be that hard.

07-03-2018 , 10:52 PM

#569

DodgerIrish

Fraudulent Zodiac

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 28,191

All it takes is being exposed to some super smart people from all demos to get over that notion pretty quickly. From there, think of all the dumb white people you see on Cops (or your own life) and realize anything else is some kind of selection bias that may be understandable, but can be overcome with logic pretty easily.

I see the dumbest mother****ers throwing logic as a justification for the opposite though. They're so self-satisfied being B- intellects impressing derpers with what they really want to hear via their stamp of approval. Also-rans become noteworthy by jumping sides.

You see all these dudes fall into their defense mechanisms (Clovis I'm looking at you) and become self-confessing Dunning-Kruger archetypes. It's like looking at someone else argue with my mom.

07-03-2018 , 11:37 PM

#570

+rep_lol

banned

Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 14,900

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyWf

Anyway after my brief absence(sorry Clovis, tattle harder next time!) I thought I'd get this back onto the subject and close the trap here on Murray and Harris.

Charles Murray believes black people are inherently, genetically, innately stupider than white people. He believes government has ignored this difference to the enormous detriment of society, it's a public policy crisis.

Harris agrees with him. That's why Clovis dodged all my questions, but dudeoflife wasn't on the same page as Clovis(since Clovis learned about this from 2p2 posters while dudeoflife exclusively learned about it from Harris), so he admitted that he also believes it is BEYOND DISPUTE that the science says black people are dumb and Harris still counts as a leftwinger because he wishes that wasn't the case.

But let's go back to "the quote" that Clovis refused to answer any questions about. I'll post it again.

Emphasis mine. Sam Harris strongly believes that black people are dumber than whites and believes calling that racist is an outrage, he gets PASSIONATE about that. Just like Clovis and dudeoflife get PASSIONATE about Sam Harris.

And again, because everything always rhymes, while Clovis was wise enough to try to distance Harris from Murray(this failed because Clovis can't read) and so he invented a fictional Harris who was much less friendly with Murray, dudeoflife and aflametotheground are repeating that with the ****ing Intellectual Dark Web "party"*. Harris is gonna be a full bore Nazi by 2020, guys, you need to read between the lines on this **** or you'll get left behind.

*It's a small thing but telling of just how unpleasant all those dorks are that Shapiro would use "party" to describe half a dozen people getting dinner together. Man, that's dinner, eating with your friends is pretty normal for people who have friends.

notice how the harris dickriders are all up itt after this post but not a single one will dare acknowledge it

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clovis8

Those people are simply intellectually weak. I would guess I spend 20 hours a week listening to left wing media and 1.5 hours listening to left wing media that has right wing voices sometimes. I would call this a very tiny hole in my bubble. If you think that is somehow a bad thing you need to put any kind of hole in your bubble.

yea whatever goat****er

07-04-2018 , 02:33 AM

#571

Clovis8

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 16,503

Quote:

Originally Posted by +rep_lol

yea whatever goat****er

Still haven’t figured out punctuation. Keep at it little buddy. You and Trump will get it someday.

07-04-2018 , 04:09 AM

#572

aflametotheground

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,851

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyWf

I dont think im dodging anything. I think people generally would shy away from producing rankings like this regardless of who is at the bottom, and i dont put any faith into murrays results being accurate.

Theres a new book on mindfulness where the two authors have gone through 6000 peer reviewed research articles on the topic and they have pulled out 60 of them that holds up to a high standard. It demonstrates that its difficult to extract reliable knowledge from the world.