Great article about how broken we are as a country re:guns. Sorry if it's been posted before.

http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2012/12/15/our-moloch/

Who has a right to own a gun and who doesn't ? Like say someone wants a gun for self defense purposes. I'm sure there will be answers essentially stating that your average citizen that wants to do that is inept. Not the point though. If the answer is that people should demonstrate proficiency in using a gun to defend themselves in order to get a gun, ok then. Laws can be passed that make it more difficult to own a gun for sure. However, laws that make it more and more difficult will eventually be challenged in the court system in my view. My understanding is that there is an extensive amount of legal precedents established regarding the 2nd Amendment. So what I think is that making it impossible to own a gun legally is a fools errand given the 2nd Amendment and the established legal precedents.

Who is on record in this forum for repealing the 2nd Amendment and confiscation of all guns?

Me.

Me too. I would outlaw anything other than a hunting rifle (and that would be only one very specific, regulated type).

The NRA is a terrorist organization and should be shut down. If it continues to promulgate death and hate speech, put all of its members in jail.

adios is on record in this forum for advocating for more mass shootings and more dead kids lol

Based on my feels alone, 6.2 seems really high. I think I've only met one gun owner lifetime in the UK.

GFY

adios,

Why are you jumping straight into counting angels when we don't even agree that the pin exists? Where is the line? How do we interpret the 2nd? What about self defence. These are questions for people who agree there is a problem. Do you agree there is a problem? Basically all the rest is pointless unless you agree to the basic premises.

There are far more guns in the USA than any other reasonably civilised country.

The consequence of more guns is more shootings, more dead families, more dead children.

Until you agree with those facts there is 0 point arguing anything else.

There's also the subjective opinion that fewer dead children is a goal that is worth the "downside" of fewer guns. That's not a fact but if you don't agree then similarly there's very little point discussing anything else.

Once you agree to the above we can discuss strategy, line drawing, precedent etc.

Farmers tho. And posh hunting t**ts.

https://mobile.twitter.com/buzzfeedn...=244+272699400

This is what somebody with a heart looks like. On the flip side, the same day this happens, we get Adios arguing "we can't stop this 100% so there is not point in doing anything. Ho hum, oh well. Let's put another 17 on the ****ing scoreboard."

Adios gladly supports an American terrorist organization.

If the choice is gun ownership laws as they are now or repealing then 2nd then i go with repeal and its not even close.

Unfortunately that will never happen so why not just start with getting rid of the AR15 which seems to be used in every one of these shootings.

This just made me realise the only person I know who owns a gun is my friends 9 year old nephew lol (lives on a farm ldo).

Don't we do this every time there's a shooting? The resident reactionary brings up the second amendment means gee golly there's nothing that can be done, but also asks who's in favor of full confiscation. This gets spun into being shocked and scandalized at the imagined jack booted future where liberals in helicopters fly in and take peoples' guns without regard to life and liberty. *cue liberal stormtroopers*. Then the realization comes that it turns out that doing anything but keeping the status quo means a bleak future where freedom has been abolished so in reality its the people who want to do something about guns who are the real monsters.

I'm sure. My guess though is that that 6.2 is even more concentrated on a small group of gun owners than the stats for US citizens.

And fwiw the gun owner I knew is no longer a gun owner. His house got robbed, the shotgun nicked, and the ensuing ****storm from the police over a stolen gun put him off for life.

Outlaw everything except muzzleloaders

You want to hunt, go get a muzzleloader. You want to protect your family, get some locks and pepper spray.

There is no marginal benefit to allowing anything above muzzleloaders


FWIW I hunt with rifles and shotguns several times a year. They are unnecessary

me

Think I may have said this before, but I live in a small town (20k pop) outside of metro Orlando. We have more gun shops (3) than grocery stores (2) in this town.

Also you can find at least one gun show somewhere along the I4 corridor pretty much every weekend of the year

I'm not really interested in repealing 2A but it definitely needs some updating, clarification and should probably be dialed back somewhat.

It's funny how hunters in the UK are mostly posh twits but hunters in the US are mostly rednecks and Trumpy Midwesterners.

I think a really interesting idea would be to purge all gun ccw permit databases and have everyone re-apply, then purge the databases again annually of people who did not demonstrate that they were using firearms responsibly during the previous 12 months.

I mean look at all the bonus freedom applying this logic to voting has provided our fine citizens

this has to be the most outrageous thing i've read about this yet-

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.553951c582c2

the absurdity of this is just like, too much to process. i can't. i just can't.

move over "Chicago " ,. Guns in back of pick up trucks in rural high schools in the 70's is the new talking point.

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It's almost like what we are currently doing isn't working.