An Actor with 80k in W2 income and 30k in expenses lost over 28k of deductions they could take in 2017.

A truck driver with 80k in W2 income and 30k expenses(maybe they own their own cab) lost over 28k of deductions they could take in 2017.

These were above the line deductions. They lost 28k in deductions, gained 6k from the standard deductions, but lost 4k from the personal exemption.

$50k was the ballpark I was talking about.

Obviously, as folks make more money, they may be in a situation where an accountant is necessary (e.g. incorporate possibly).

The point is that many W2 employees with large unreimbursed expenses related to their job got hosed by TCJA. Many probably weren't aware of how the changes effected them and if they could do anything to help(incorporate).

hobbes ancedote makes sense if the truck driver is a W2 employee. That guy even has an accountant and wasnt aware until tax time.

I had everything by Jan 20th - admittedly I have a VERY simple bunch of stuff to get together. One employer, one pension plan, one HSA, only significant deductions are HSA, mortgage interest and taxes on house, all of which I can click and print online. No kids, no dependents except the two of us. I could probably have filed Jan 2nd if I wanted to.

MM MD

I got my last form my mortgage lender a couple days ago. Most companies are putting the W-2s online now.

Are you also a little suspicious of folk who are already celebrating how their taxes changed?

Not everyone can incorporate at their own whim. If transportation workers (e.g., truckers, flight attendants, pilots) were itemizing expenses on Schedule A, they needed the foresight to instead take the company per diem as untaxable reimbursement (assuming one was even offered to them). This is still a terrible outcome because they lose about ~$20k in gross earnings. They also can't deduct additional expenses they may have incurred like maintaining a truck. It's a sweet giveaway to owners though due to payroll and lost-wage payout reductions.

I'm familiar with when taxes go against you, btw.

Between 2007 and 2009, my property taxes went up 50% while my assessment went down 30%. Since 2007 to 2017 my property taxes are now up about 90%, and my assessment is only up about 5% over the same period.

So, my refund went up about 15%. I'd guess it's primarily because Nevada has no state income tax, and we bumped up our charitables this year.

Pleasantly surprised.

MM MD

hobbes did you ever find out if that trucker was an employee or IC?

dont have much to add but i do have a question, does anyone have a link to the time when bahbahmickey - self described professional financial advisor - demonstrated that he didnt know how a marginal tax rate works

Nah - as I noted it was just an anecdote - my understanding is that he was an IC, but not sure.

MM MD

Yeah naturally the non-stop stream of lies and misinformation that flows through that place and of course they're totally calling me out for that one. And of course, just that one time I said it was my accountant to make the story better (which I never do).

I feel like I'm Ben Stiller in Meet the Parents or something.

suzzer, just call it like it is instead of letting them semantikes you. Most likely explanation is hobbes's guy misspoke and dude is not an IC. Since you are playing a character now (lol), your state made a ruling on this in April of last year.

https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...430-story.html

So it seems totally reasonable to assume a California trucker's classification might have switched from IC to employee during 2018. Hell, I'd say there's a decent chance hobbes's guy's guy works for a California-based company given the proximity and sheer number of port truckers.

**** em, they have it coming. This is the natural and logical consequence of continuously voting against your self interests to **** over minorities you don’t like.

That’s not the point. The point is that the withholding formulas were changed to make people have bigger paychecks on the front end and less of a refund on the backend to trick them into voting republican before the election, and now they’re realizing they’ve been had. I mean, yes, people could have just done a tiny bit of arithmetic to realize that this would be the case, but republicans know that a lot of their base are kind of stupid or bad at math anyway.

Yup, and now they'll blame it on Dems. They'll call for a new round of tax cuts to help farmers but pair it with another windfall for the 1%, which will make it DOA in the House. Thus it's the Dems fault and they'll trick a lot of the same people again in 2020 in all likelihood.

When facepalm turns into faceplant

naw... just means the 'g' and 'f' keys are close together and I didn't care enough to correct the typo.

The change in the withholding formula is a feature, not a bug.

Most of the GOP elected officeholders (and pundits) I'm aware of have been saying consistently to make sure your withholdings are tuned correctly that you do not get a large refund at the end of the year, so that you are not giving the Fed.Gov an interest free loan for 12 months.

There are lots of folks who are bad at math and don't realize what they are doing when they tune their withholdings such that they have a large refund. IME, they are from all political stripes.

ETA: Why isn't it a feature of progressive policy to give the Fed.Gov more $$$ every week? Seems like it would be well received that you give the $$$ up front and the Fed.Gov gives you back your change later.

A lot of people use the refund as a forced zero interest savings plan.

A lot of folks smoke cigarettes too.

What’s MM MD?

This is a crap analogy, and I suspect you know it.

The argument for people not arranging their finances so they get a large (to them) refund held a fair amount of water when interest rates were enough that letting the feds hold onto your money cost you more than a cup of Starbucks. When the best you can hope for is a little less than 2.5% on your money, it's entirely reasonable, especially if you're not the most disciplined person in the world, to find the utility of a $3000 refund greater than getting an additional $270 or so a month, if you think you're likely to piss it away. The interest deferred on that 3K is about $70 or so (and taxable, too)

MM MD

Means nothing, don't worry about it. Unless the post concerns something medical, in which case you may choose to infer that I may know something more about the topic than someone else, or alternatively, may have a vested interest in the topic at hand that would tend to make you eye my post with suspicion. Depending.

It also seems to irk the crap out of a couple of posters that I don't get along with, so it's a feature, not a bug.

MM MD