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Jeff Bezos Is Now Worth Over 0 Billion Jeff Bezos Is Now Worth Over 0 Billion

10-18-2018 , 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Alex. View Post
Funny how the resident communists have admitted that they don't use Amazon or see much benefit to it. Kind of how everyone mocked Steve Jobs for the uselessness of iPads when they first came out. It's a basic acknowledgement that in their version of society none of these things would likely exist. A perfect illustration of how terrible central planners are in predicting the preferences of the population, and how the market along with bold, entrepreneurial leadership is necessary for innovation.
We can innovate and design bold new technologies without exploitative CEOs sucking up all the wealth we are producing. This was proven time and time again in the USSR which produced rapid developments in technology and even beat the United States into space. In fact there will be more innovation, not less, once this much better arrangement is achieved.
10-18-2018 , 01:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
Hmm, I think Communism is more of a post-scarcity theory. Marx was just off by more than a hundred years. The extreme of the Donner Party does pretty much impose some kind of communism (anarcho or not), but capitalism needs scarcity and it's the potential end of scarcity or at least desperate scarcity which threatens the whole system.
It could, but it could also lead to more fulfilling or rewarding jobs. Personally, I'd rather build a robot to clean toilets than clean toilets.
10-18-2018 , 02:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by John21
It could, but it could also lead to more fulfilling or rewarding jobs. Personally, I'd rather build a robot to clean toilets than clean toilets.
I don't think capitalism does that. Before long everything except perhaps writing poetry will be better done by robots and no one will need you. When no one needs you, you are effed if you're not seated when the music stops and in this game there are 7 billion people playing and maybe ten million chairs.
10-18-2018 , 02:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by einbert
Still noone has answered my question: how can we avoid catastrophic global warming without dismantling capitalism? Just 100 companies are responsible for 71% of global emissions, and if we don't act in the next few years, we are literally doomed to extinction.

We have 12 years to limit climate change catastrophe, warns UN
https://www.theguardian.com/environm...mark-un-report
8 billion people on this planet want to eat and live a life that will be better than the life they currently have today. This will repeat itself tomorrow, and the day after that infinitely.

Capitalism fuels that demand. Communism doesn't.
10-18-2018 , 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalledDownLight
Option 1 seems like the fairest way to me given that you're much more likely to start 3+3 (and thus lose the $1) than start 2+2 (and thus make $19). The likelihood of starting the company on the losing end so far outweighs starting the beneficiary that lopsided returns in the instances of owning the survivor are merited.

In reality there is much more often a 3+3, 4+4, 5+5, ..., 20+20 and those companies lose $18 combined and 2+2 accrues $19 from their losses. It still evolves into a winner(s) take most situation, but only because there are a lot of other players who take losses on the way. When 2+2 chose to enter that market they knew there was a decent risk they were just 7+7 or 18+18 and would lose it all so they wouldn't have much incentive to enter the market unless they either stand to reap the gain when they are 2+2 or have their losses reimbursed when they are 7+7 or 18+18.

...

Hot damn now that sounds efficient!
10-18-2018 , 02:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tien
8 billion people on this planet want to eat and live a life that will be better than the life they currently have today. This will repeat itself tomorrow, and the day after that infinitely.

Capitalism fuels that demand. Communism doesn't.

WAT IN THE MOTHER **** ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT
10-18-2018 , 02:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by microbet
I don't think capitalism does that. Before long everything except perhaps writing poetry will be better done by robots and no one will need you. When no one needs you, you are effed if you're not seated when the music stops and in this game there are 7 billion people playing and maybe ten million chairs.
Probably 90% of the occupations we have today were inconceivable to people 200 years ago. So while it's inconceivable to me today what people will be doing with themselves in the future due to continued technological advancement, I don't see why the same trend won't continue.
10-18-2018 , 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by John21
It’s not so much increasing the investment capital pool, but more to make it less costly to shift capital from lower performing investments to higher ones. Faced with rising payroll costs, study after study has shown that businesses automate with labor-saving machinery to maintain their margins. So forcing businesses to raise their minimum wage would create demand for increased automation which would increase demand for capital in that sector. The last thing we'd want to due if we raise the minimum wage would be to create a bottleneck to automation, because raising minimum wage would displace workers and we need jobs in the automation sector to compensate.
Why it's almost like somebody could PLAN at least part of the ECONOMY to solve these problems!
10-18-2018 , 02:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by John21
Probably 90% of the occupations we have today were inconceivable to people 200 years ago. So while it's inconceivable to me today what people will be doing with themselves in the future due to continued technological advancement, I don't see why the same trend won't continue.
Driving an UBER while simultaneously making DoorDash deliveries and setting up your dog walking gig on NextDoor.com in a vain attempt to repay your student loans, make your car payment and keep it running well enough to satisfy the capitalists who are very careful not to be construed as your employer and maybe getting by if you add in carvertise.com would indeed have been inconceivable 200 years ago.

Also, most jobs are https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bull****_Jobs.
10-18-2018 , 02:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by einbert
We can innovate and design bold new technologies without exploitative CEOs sucking up all the wealth we are producing. This was proven time and time again in the USSR which produced rapid developments in technology and even beat the United States into space. In fact there will be more innovation, not less, once this much better arrangement is achieved.
No Einbert, you don't understand. Laika only orbited the Earth because a bunch of companies like SpaceDogInc and DogzNSpace existed and their COMPETITION spurred on INNOVATION.
10-18-2018 , 02:44 PM
RIP COSMONAUT


10-18-2018 , 02:48 PM
this is now the



appreciation thread
10-18-2018 , 05:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6ix
I ordered things online before Amazon existed.

Does that make my point any clearer?
I'm not sure what your point is, but so did I. Then Amazon came along and offered a faster, cheaper, more reliable and more robust service, and I started using them instead. You're free to use whatever company you want for whatever reason you want, but the apparent lack of understanding for why people like Amazon just makes you seem out of touch with reality and is certainly not helpful for winning friends to your cause.

Quote:
Originally Posted by einbert
We can innovate and design bold new technologies without exploitative CEOs sucking up all the wealth we are producing. This was proven time and time again in the USSR which produced rapid developments in technology and even beat the United States into space. In fact there will be more innovation, not less, once this much better arrangement is achieved.
I too remember how the USSR won the cold war through their economic and technological superiority.

I too recall how the majority of innovations over the last two centuries have come from socialist countries.
10-18-2018 , 05:44 PM
Hey Alex, what OS does most of the web run on these days?
10-18-2018 , 07:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Alex.
I'm not sure what your point is, but so did I. Then Amazon came along and offered a faster, cheaper, more reliable and more robust service, and I started using them instead. ...

...
When I order something from https://www.sweetwater.com they put candy in the box (SWEETwater get it lol) so I find this claim less than compelling.
10-18-2018 , 07:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomdemaine
Thought experiment:

Lets say there are 3 message boards 1+1, 2+2 and 3+3 on these boards are 5 posters. A&B currently post back and forth on 1+1 and quite enjoy it. They value their interaction at $5 each so 1+1 makes $10. Similarly for 2+2, they make $5 each off C&D then there is Mrs E. She posts alone on 3+3 and values her experience at $1 because she doesn't get to talk to anyone else.

E decides to move her posting to 2+2. Smart move. Because they've got someone new to talk to with a fresh perspective now C&D value their experience at $10 and E is loving having new people to talk to so values her experience at $10 also. Now nothing tangible has changed, those boards and their owners did nothing different or special. E hasn't changed her posting style in any way, she just decided to move and that generated 10+10+10 - 5+5+1 = $19 of extra value of out thin air.

Question: How should that extra value be divided up?

The owner of 2+2 should get it all?
E should get it all?
It should be divided equally between ABCD and E?

Status Quoer's are arguing for option 1. But why? Because the happen to own the servers E randomly migrated to?
Tom,

Surpluses due to network effects are already shared among all participants. Neither message boards nor Facebook has raised prices on you as a result of their success. In your example, assuming the site continues charging $5, C D and E will receive $5 of surplus value each, and 2+2 will have an extra $5 in revenue. Seems fair all around.

Similarly, consumers have gained quite a bit of value from 90% of their friends being on Facebook compared to 10%, and from Amazon successfully developing mass-distribution centers all over the country.
10-18-2018 , 07:58 PM
Wait, more important than candy,

Quote:
Originally Posted by .Alex.
... You're free to use whatever company you want for whatever reason you want, but the apparent lack of understanding for why people like Amazon just makes you seem out of touch with reality and is certainly not helpful for winning friends to your cause.


...

is that I don't know where you're getting this from. If Bezos transferred all his warehouse employees 5 shares of AMZN tomorrow for doing such a swell job and because sharing is nice, what does that have to do with you and Mrs. .Alex. and .Alex. Jr. and whomever else liking Amazon as a service?
10-18-2018 , 09:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6ix
So, is it weird that I've never ordered anything from Amazon, ever? Maybe if I did I'd grasp the hero worship.
This is the original post that I referenced. Not using a service and then attributing people's appreciation for the company to hero worship of the owner. It's like the Musk thing where you guys assume some kind of hard-on for the dude when in reality we just love the idea of electric cars and space travel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 6ix
When I order something from https://www.sweetwater.com they put candy in the box (SWEETwater get it lol) so I find this claim less than compelling.
There being many other awesome, successful companies that deliver products is a pretty good argument for Amazon not needing to be dismantled no?
10-18-2018 , 09:12 PM
Hey Alex, it's Linux, Linux is what most of the internet runs on and it was created by a socialist!
10-18-2018 , 10:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerowo
Hey Alex, it's Linux, Linux is what most of the internet runs on and it was created by a socialist!
Huh?
10-18-2018 , 10:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by John21
It’s not so much increasing the investment capital pool, but more to make it less costly to shift capital from lower performing investments to higher ones. Faced with rising payroll costs, study after study has shown that businesses automate with labor-saving machinery to maintain their margins. So forcing businesses to raise their minimum wage would create demand for increased automation which would increase demand for capital in that sector. The last thing we'd want to due if we raise the minimum wage would be to create a bottleneck to automation, because raising minimum wage would displace workers and we need jobs in the automation sector to compensate.
I get the minimal wage increase but that's because I believe that job market had been so slack for so long that it's an actual problem and raising the minimum wage can help with. I don't feel like high capital gains taxes has been a problem for investors and so lowering them isn't going to unlock a lot of gains.
10-18-2018 , 11:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl
I get the minimal wage increase but that's because I believe that job market had been so slack for so long that it's an actual problem and raising the minimum wage can help with.
My reason is simply to increase productivity in low-wage sectors. It's that or the beatings will continue....
10-18-2018 , 11:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by John21
Huh?
It's a call back to a question Alex ignored.
10-18-2018 , 11:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerowo
It's a call back to a question Alex ignored.
I got that. It's the socialist claim I'm questioning. He's from Finland and now a U.S. citizen, not that the latter is relevant.
10-18-2018 , 11:58 PM
Finland is mostly socialist and produced Linus, I'm giving them credit for his politics. His giving it away as well as the FOSS movement in general is always going to be a counter argument to people not doing hard things without a profit motive.

      
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