https://www.reuters.com/article/us-e...-idUSKCN1LA0IF

Kidnapping, illegal arrest, abuse of power. His chief of staff also investigated for the same crimes.

Completely unsurprising that a scumbag like Salvini would do that.

What salvini did was not surprising at all.

What surprised me though was the civil society answer to this, and the speed with which our judges reacted. Salvini "strategy" against immigrants had a 60% approval rate in july.

It's not unusual in italy for judges to go against politicians, even when they hold positions of power. But it's very unusual for them to do so swiftly as soon as possible like they did on this occasion.

Unfortunately the italian constitution contains a provision that requires a house vote to actually arrest him so the chances of that are slim even if the special tribunal that tries him find him guilty

That actually is rather unusual re swiftness.

Not that it matters anyway as imho he won't get done anyway, what with Italy's extremely pro defendant multi tiered judicial system. Even if convicted at first instance trial he'll immediately request second level appeal & it'll very probably (indeed almost certainly) go through the courts for the next 10 years with various flip-flopping verdicts via appellate rulings before he's eventually acquitted by Cassation or else they drag it out until prescrizione/statutes expiring, depending on who he hires as a lawyer & how much funds he has at his disposal as in anonymous liquid nondescript briefcase/brown envelope style funds, cough nudge wink.

He could possibly hire the likes of Giulia Buongiorno to defend him, in which case he'll almost certainly be acquitted regardless of any facts or evidence against him, which will be explained way by Cassation in a probably manifestly illogical report.

It's how things work in Italy from what I've seen in more than once case. The judiciary isn't really interested in justice ultimately but only who can buy their Get-Out-of-jail-free Card. (or if they were Giulio Andreotti in which case an acquittal- for any crime- would be a forgone conclusion anyway). This makes any verdict be it an acquittal such as with Andreotti or conviction for say, a common criminal case like Alberto Stasi for example seem arbitrary & whimsical & therefore ultimately unsound.

I honestly mean no offence or disrespect to you opining this & my apologies for going off track, but I honestly have zero faith in the Italian judicial system, sorry. You people really do deserve so much better as I happen to believe the likes of Giovanni Falcone & Paolo Borselino are the true representatives of Italy rather than its judiciary which I consider susceptible to corruption to the point where justice or at the very least a sound verdict, is like rolling a dice.

Anyway end of rant but I confidently predict this will either be dropped or else will again drag through the courts for years until nobody cares any more, seems to happen with multi tiered courts in general & Italian courts in particular. I very much doubt if Salvini is worried.

Not sure if you followed , but Bongiorno is actually a minister of the current government right now (public administration ministry).

She is asking for biometric identification for all public employees to solve the problem of people faking their presence at work through comrades passing the ticket for them.

/

Our judiciary has some problems and yes the 3-layer system is very defective (given that the 3rd layer hears almost 40% of appeals, and 2nd layer is automatically granted to any1 who asks for it, you don't need any element to appeal).

But i think you are overstating both the credibility of our judiciary sentencing, and the amount of corruption going on.

You are correct in your assessment that our system is very pro-defendant in general (Statute of limitation not ending with beginning of trial is, i think, an unicum), BUT we have a provision which is very rare in general which is we have a chance of reformatio in peius.

That is the prosecutor even if he gets a guilty verdict, if he thinks the sentence is not big enough can appeal to get a longer sentence. He can also appeal against a not guilty verdict and i think that's very rare?

I have followed & am aware she's in politics now I was being a smart ass & mentioned her as I consider her corrupt & a mob lawyer when practicing.

I don't think I am overstating the corruption at all & if anything I'm understating it, just look at the Maxi trial reversals via Corrado "The Sentence Killer"Carnavale.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrado_Carnevale. Reinstated as a judge & all after his trial conviction was of course reversed by his mates in Cassation. Then again as a certain Legitimate Businessman once said:

^^Salvatore "Toto" Riina aka La Bestia aka 'u curtu, undisputed boss of La Cosa Nostra/ Sicilian Mafia. Good mates with Salvo Lima as was Carnavale actually. (Lima came down with a slight case of assassination btw).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salvatore_Lima

Not to mention Il Mostro Di Firenze, the Narducci affair, Amanda Knox & Raffaele Sollecito's laughable acquittal in the face of overwhelming evidence. Then there's the whimsy. Look at Stasi's conviction- acquitted at both first instance trial & second level appeal he'd be a free man in other countries right after trial acquittal. Even the proseceutor asked Cassation for a non custodial sentence due to the evidence not being sufficient (after they reversed the trial & appellate acquittals) & they gave him a custodial sentence anyway. To clarify I think Stasi is very possibly & even probably factually guilty from what I read. But no way was he convicted legally beyond a reasonable doubt by virtue of his acquittals. As I said flip flopping verdicts. But I don't think I have overstated the corruption actually, Italy is essentially a Mafia Republic imo & I say that after studying the issue, not in a flippant light or hyperbolic sense. It's the Eu's dirty little secret & several academic/scholarly books are rather candid about this state of affairs actually

Such provisions mean nothing, sorry & again no offence/disrespect meant by this as it's a considered as opposed to baseless opinion. Cassation isn't allowed to examine a case on its merits for example as that's already been done by the lower courts. Yet Cassation do it anyway whenever they please. So such provisions are meaningless & again Salvini has nothing to worry about imho especially since Bongiorno's in the government. She seems to have the magic touch when it comes to $urpri$e acquittals against all odds almost as if something murky happened behind the $cenes in the background...

So again such provisions are worthless as they're blatantly violated with impunity whenever it suits.

When I see real change in Italy's judiciary & not its seeming determination to currently ensure people who are in fact guilty AF don't go to prison (or else like Stasi do & just because), when I don't see corrupt as hell judges like our friend Corrado getting reinstated by his Cassation chums or mob lawyers like Giulia Bongiorno actually getting into government (like her mentor Andreotti which you simply couldn't make up), when I don't see prosecutors like Giovanni Falcone suspecting the actual PM like Andreotti having a bomb planted at a safe house before said prosecutor & his successor are later brutally murdered along with their wife & bodyguards within weeks of each other, when I see justice & answers for the likes of Pia Rontini (whose father dropped dead of a heart attack in the questura penniless having spent his savings trying to find his daughter's murderer), and all the other victims of Il Mostro Di Firenze, when I see prosecutors not being accompanied everywhere by armed bodyguards or being outright betrayed by their own government, then I'll change my opinion of the Italian judiciary/Government & its inherent corruption.

Such a day is possible whenever the Italian people say basta, that their fallen heroes such as Falcone & Borselino weren't for nothing & didn't die in vain. But until that day comes I'll have to regrettably stand by my comments, regrettably because I have a huge respect and warmth for Italy & its people. As I said you deserve better.

Cheers.

And to clarify yes the prosecution & defence can appeal a verdict in Italy to Cassation but Cassation's ruling can't be appealed but can in some circumstances be overturned, by the President of Italy I think.

President can give amnesty to an individual (although that doesn't become a non guilty sentence).

Cassazione's sentences can be "remedied" . Link in italian

https://www.laleggepertutti.it/14931...lla-cassazione

I had thought that the President could actually overturn a Cassation verdict/ruling in certain circumstances, but would need to go over things & re-check again.

I know the sentence itself can be remedied & don't have an issue with this per se. It's the actual grounds other things are "remedied" on though such as rulings. Some rulings have contradicted previous Cassation rulings on the same case or have been blatantly manifestly illogical & biased to the point where corruption is the only plausible answer. If Cassation can examine evidence yet again for example after the lower courts already established the facts & if Cassation can change the findings of fact by the trial/appellate courts then that renders a multi tiered judiciary futile & defeats the whole purpose of it. So I can't have any faith in such an arbitrary system which routinely violates its own procedure whenever it feels like it, & usually to let the clearly guilty go free, sorry.

We'll just have to agree to disagree mate cheers.

Article 87, paragraph 11 of the italian constitution

Può concedere grazia [174 c.p.; 681 c.p.p.] (5) e commutare le pene.

"can give pardon (i guess that's the translation? anyway it's an amnesty) and change sentences"