Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Politics political discourse

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-06-2016, 11:37 AM   #76
Elrazor
losing momentum
 
Elrazor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 8,758
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by O.A.F.K.1.1 View Post
That should be enough to cement Elrazor in the OUT camp.
Elrazor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2016, 02:48 PM   #77
davmcg
veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,002
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by chezlaw View Post
Make it just about the economy (and the lol risk of war) and there's precious little reason to stay. Cameron has been hopeless.
There are a substantial number of brexitistists who hope that the departure of the UK will cause the entire EU to collapse. They think that this will be a good thing. I suppose that brings us back to.

Quote:
So yea explicitly stating that a lot of OUT voters are thick
davmcg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2016, 06:06 PM   #78
00001
old hand
 
00001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: live you where
Posts: 1,513
Re: Brexit Referendum

Work almost nothing and win a lot.
That will not happen.
Companies now know what is real work.
00001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2016, 06:19 PM   #79
00001
old hand
 
00001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: live you where
Posts: 1,513
Re: Brexit Referendum

About the emigration. Let´s see.
Italy, France, Germany face the same problems, even my country.
Per example in the transport business (trucking), that it´s almost dead international... was killed by the greed of companies (and lack of regulation, inspection)all over the rich countries contracting people do it for half the pay (Romanians, etc).
There is a principle for "equal work, equal pay"... but that didn´t happen. All countries are to blame.
So, let´s see... if the UK now leaves the eurozone, the british people will start working in that?
For what kind of money 50 and hour?
Lol, GL with that.
00001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 06:15 AM   #80
martymc1
mcbanned
 
martymc1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 27,182
Re: Brexit Referendum

Just tried to register to vote in the referendum online, service only available in mainland UK and us 2nd class citizens must print off a form and bring it to an electoral office.

They can go **** themselves.
martymc1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 07:32 AM   #81
jalfrezi
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
jalfrezi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Long gone, long long gone
Posts: 6,506
Re: Brexit Referendum

Are you in N Ireland?
jalfrezi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 08:40 AM   #82
martymc1
mcbanned
 
martymc1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 27,182
Re: Brexit Referendum

Yep.
martymc1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 11:30 AM   #83
Zeno
Le Misanthrope
 
Zeno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Spitsbergen
Posts: 14,847
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by martymc1 View Post
Just tried to register to vote in the referendum online, service only available in mainland UK and us 2nd class citizens must print off a form and bring it to an electoral office.

They can go **** themselves.
My bold.

If you are that lazy you shouldn't be allowed to vote anyway. And since you are that lazy and have disenfranchised yourself; that is all the better.
Zeno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 12:34 PM   #84
martymc1
mcbanned
 
martymc1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 27,182
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeno View Post
My bold.

If you are that lazy you shouldn't be allowed to vote anyway. And since you are that lazy and have disenfranchised yourself; that is all the better.
Not sure you understand my post.....citizens in England, Scotland and Wales can register to vote online....citizens in Northern Ireland can also register to vote online but will then have to print off a form and return it to an electoral office. This is a problem.

And I'm not lazy, just have never felt it was worth my while taking part in electing complete ****wits to a government that does not represent me.

I'm Irish, so If you'd like to try and convince me why I should vote in each election in a British parliment then I'm all ears. Afterwards I'll give you a few reasons why I shouldn't waste my time

Last edited by martymc1; 06-07-2016 at 12:47 PM.
martymc1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 01:32 PM   #85
Zeno
Le Misanthrope
 
Zeno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Spitsbergen
Posts: 14,847
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by martymc1 View Post
Not sure you understand my post.....citizens in England, Scotland and Wales can register to vote online....citizens in Northern Ireland can also register to vote online but will then have to print off a form and return it to an electoral office. This is a problem.

And I'm not lazy, just have never felt it was worth my while taking part in electing complete ****wits to a government that does not represent me.

I'm Irish, so If you'd like to try and convince me why I should vote in each election in a British parliment then I'm all ears. Afterwards I'll give you a few reasons why I shouldn't waste my time
My Bold

I understood your post perfectly.

And no it is not a problem; unless you truly are lazy or care so little for your voting rights that an added layer of government bureaucracy causes you to snivel and whine and pout and give up your voting rights. Your own inadequacies, not those of a too easy to blame extra form, are the real problem.

To put it succinctly: grow up. Which given the rest of your post, you need to do plenty quick.
Zeno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 01:42 PM   #86
martymc1
mcbanned
 
martymc1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 27,182
Re: Brexit Referendum

I should grow up and vote.

Not very convincing.

Not going to bother debating whether an extra form (only for 2nd class citizens) is a problem or not with you.
martymc1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 01:56 PM   #87
Zeno
Le Misanthrope
 
Zeno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Spitsbergen
Posts: 14,847
Re: Brexit Referendum

Excellent. Thanks. Carry on being Irish.

Back to Brexit............
Zeno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 03:20 PM   #88
57 On Red
veteran
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 2,280
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by martymc1 View Post
Just tried to register to vote in the referendum online, service only available in mainland UK and us 2nd class citizens must print off a form and bring it to an electoral office.

They can go **** themselves.
There's a certain history of electoral fraud in Northern Ireland. ('Vote early, vote often.') You know this. You could always do what I do and just walk to the polling station and vote in the usual way. If you can't be arsed, that's your problem.
57 On Red is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 03:26 PM   #89
sixfour
should be called sevenfour
 
sixfour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fire Rod Harrington
Posts: 58,117
Re: Brexit Referendum

it's always been somewhat different there, iirc you need to actually present id when voting?
sixfour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 03:26 PM   #90
martymc1
mcbanned
 
martymc1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 27,182
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by 57 On Red View Post
There's a certain history of electoral fraud in Northern Ireland. ('Vote early, vote often.') You know this.

You could always do what I do and just walk to the polling station and vote in the usual way. If you can't be arsed, that's your problem.
Correct lol but this isn't why we can't register online.

I would have just walked to the polling station this one time if only I could register online like the rest of the UK.
martymc1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2016, 04:56 PM   #91
S.K
Toffees >> Jellybeans
 
S.K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 8,677
Re: Brexit Referendum

Not a good showing by big Nige very poor.
Slightly better from Camoron than his sky showing but he is still getting exposed by an audience loaded with ammo

These debates are interesting
S.K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 02:03 AM   #92
Elrazor
losing momentum
 
Elrazor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 8,758
Re: Brexit Referendum

Farage is awful in debates. He looked nervous and kept relying on stock answers.

Big win for Dave, albeit an easy one.
Elrazor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:07 AM   #93
CityBoy2006
banned
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 84
Re: Brexit Referendum

Farage surprisingly ****. Generally does well in terms of public speaking but looked anxious as has been said.

Simply put; the immigration dilemma is this:

- We want the circular migration that 20 year old Polish plumbers who come here and work cheaply for 25 years whilst costing nothing to educate and head back home before they're a drain on the health service give us.

- We're in a spot of bother because 330k net migration each year is unsustainable and we do need to limit the flow somehow.

Not difficult to really address this in a debate setting but Farage was bricking it for some reason.
CityBoy2006 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:12 AM   #94
daca
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: get by
Posts: 8,107
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by CityBoy2006 View Post
- We're in a spot of bother because 330k net migration each year is unsustainable and we do need to limit the flow somehow.
why is 330k net immigration unsustainable? as long as the economic aspect of it is somewhat sound it seems perfectly sustainable.
daca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:27 AM   #95
Elrazor
losing momentum
 
Elrazor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 8,758
Re: Brexit Referendum

It's unsustainable as public services are already stretched. The 20 year old plumbers who came here over the last 10 years are starting to squeeze kids out, and they do require a GP, dentist, school place, etc - not to mention somewhere to live.

Plus, I'm not sure immigration per se is a problem, just that we have no control over over who comes. So the people coming from the EU tend to be low or unskilled, or at least those are the jobs they are filling.

IMO we need control of immigration to make sure people coming in are filling roles we want filling, not to necessarily lower immigration. I think this is where Farage missed an open goal last night to appeal to wider voters, not just tub thumping Britain Firsters.
Elrazor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:29 AM   #96
CityBoy2006
banned
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 84
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by daca View Post
why is 330k net immigration unsustainable? as long as the economic aspect of it is somewhat sound it seems perfectly sustainable.
Because they all flock to London and the South East which are already hugely overcrowded and we literally can't build enough homes/schools/hospitals (don't forget we've got a non-contributory, free-at-the-point-of-care NHS).

Plus the majority are overwhelmingly either low-skilled or work in skilled but nonetheless working-class level jobs which depresses wages and working conditions.

You can't on the one hand say 'migrants do the jobs we Brits don't want to do' (which translates as 'will work for less and tolerate poorer conditions', because let's face it, anyone would be more than willing to clean a toilet for a living if you paid them enough) and then on the other hand pretend it has no downward effect on wages/conditions.

Circular migration is great for everyone but if the absolute numbers get out of hand then the poorer people in society begin to suffer.

Good article on the subject here: http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/what-workin...ration-1561735
CityBoy2006 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:48 AM   #97
O.A.F.K.1.1
Ted Patrick
 
O.A.F.K.1.1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Deep Coma
Posts: 20,838
Re: Brexit Referendum

Immigrants have been a massive fiscal benefit.

http://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-artic...EU-immigration
Quote:
“Responding to comments on our earlier report on this topic published last year, we performed extensive sensitivity analysis, which does not alter our main conclusions: immigration to the UK since 2000 has been of substantial net fiscal benefit, with immigrants contributing more than they have received in benefits and transfers. This is true for immigrants from Central and Eastern Europe as well as the rest of the EU.

“When we additionally consider that immigrants bring their own educational qualifications whose costs are borne by other countries and that they contribute to financing fixed public services such as defence, these contributions are even larger.
O.A.F.K.1.1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:51 AM   #98
Elrazor
losing momentum
 
Elrazor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 8,758
Re: Brexit Referendum

I don't think any rational person could or would argue otherwise.
Elrazor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 05:56 AM   #99
CityBoy2006
banned
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 84
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by O.A.F.K.1.1 View Post
Immigrants have been a massive fiscal benefit.

http://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-artic...EU-immigration
And in their current numbers, have had a crippling effect on the wages/housing/school places/hospital availability of the working class.

Obviously they have an economic benefit in terms of overall GDP. No-one has ever disputed that.

But there are large swathes of the population who don't see their quality of life improve as a result of the benefits of immigration whilst suffering from the negatives. Immigration is a net benefit but that doesn't mean its a benefit for every individual person in the UK.
CityBoy2006 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-08-2016, 06:08 AM   #100
daca
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: get by
Posts: 8,107
Re: Brexit Referendum

Quote:
Originally Posted by CityBoy2006 View Post
Because they all flock to London and the South East which are already hugely overcrowded and we literally can't build enough homes/schools/hospitals (don't forget we've got a non-contributory, free-at-the-point-of-care NHS).
if only some of them were builders that could help build those houses. or nurses and doctors. that extra tax money will even pay for it too.
Quote:
Plus the majority are overwhelmingly either low-skilled or work in skilled but nonetheless working-class level jobs which depresses wages and working conditions.
there's no reason to think they lower wages or working conditions for people already in the uk. they're complements as much as they're supplements.
daca is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive
 
 
Poker Players - Streaming Live Online