I don't it's even worth us even trying to discuss cognition at the moment.

Maybe one day.

Btw when someone says something like "all racists voted leave", they mean it in the modern sense ie not technical sense.

Even Will Self made this slip in his spat with Francois. It should be recognised that people use it as a loose shorthand to mean the vast and overwhelming majority, and it shouldn't be picked up by nits as a means for cheap rhetorical point scoring on the intertubes.

I think you very significantly underestimate how many racists (in the 'modern' sense) voted remain

Evidently not racist enough for the thought of 80 million Turks moving to the UK being enough of a concern to make them vote leave, though.

We've previously agreed that racism is a spectrum that all [idiomatically] humans are on, so it's not a question of how many racists are on each side of the Brexit divide but how far along the spectrum they are.

It's pretty clear that the population of leave voters is heavily skewed towards the segment between "moderately racist" and "very racist" .

I suppose it might have had more impact if they had thought it was anything but nonsense.

Yes I take spectrum into account as well as quantity. I think you've so overly conflated brexit with racism that you're missing far too many 'more racist' who voted to remain and 'less racists' who voted to leave.

One thing we very rarely talk about is the Romani people. The most common overt and quite extreme racism I encounter locally is towards them, and it would be far from the truth to say it was predominately from leavers. They are frequently staunch remainers AND they want to keep out some racial groups as much as possible. They would have similar views about Turkish people and Muslims if that was an EU issue.

I guess the residents of wealthy parts of Britain, even if they have well-integrated non-English communities, will always be more resistant to new waves of immigrants than more normal or poorer parts.

Growing up in the less salubrious outskirts of Hampstead, it was an in joke in my circle at the time that the wealthy Hampstead liberals proudly displaying their Vote Labour posters in their windows probably went out and voted Tory a lot of the time.

In terms of population numbers though, these are virtually edge cases.

How do you reconcile these, given that Islam is essentially 'a (particularly strong) view'?

Islamophobia is a form of the "racism/etc" as discussed above.

You consider groups holding the views of Islam to be privileged above groups holding other types of views, in that you believe it is reasonable to extrapolate stereotypes from the non-Islam views, but you consider to do so from Islam to be a sub-category of racism?

This is just another form of the "Islamophobia isn't racism because Muslims aren't a race" silly argument that is only repeated on 2+2 by Islamophobes who don't want to admit they're racist.

If you want the whiteness of a population to be diminished you are a racist.

Been a very quite easter for brexitland. Just as well as the big news is all about this place.

When(if?) P goes then there's no means of communicating so I just want to let everyone know now that I will seek to resume the brexit discussions in the Business, Finance and Investing section (BFI) - so come look there.

If it cannot be continued in BFI for some reason then I may seek another sub-forum so please pm me if you cant find the thread and need your fix.

Alternatively there's the new politics forum http://exiledpolitics.freeforums.net/

Welp

Ahhh I'll give bubble 2 a miss

Thank god for that.

You'll be in far right bubble 3 in BFI.

So brexit returns from it's Easter break and Teresa May, like this forum is still hanging in there.

The 1922 committee has met to decide on whether or not to change the rules so that another vote of no confidence can be had. They couldn't agree so no decision, further meeting this afternoon.

and on the today program there was the suggestion that May would deviate massively from Plan A by bringing the WA legislation to parliament rather than the WA. I don't even ....

Few days late.

Yeah the remain parties **** the bed so hard by splitting the ****ing vote.

I mean it is true that polls like that show remain winning 58-42. But that won't be the messaging.

Setting aside the rest in your post, what is the difference between Tommy Robinson and Boris?

Do they even have fundamentally different policy ideas or rhetorical positions?

In fact best I can tell the biggest difference is Tommy Robinson believes in what Boris opportunistically claims to believe because it gets him a bigger opportunity to seize power. I don't see this as a positive.

Going back to your first paragraph - what has Boris done that isn't far right? Not even lately, but ever? Can you even give an answer without looking up his positions on wikipedia?

Maybe interesting to compare the poll to the 2014 european election results which were:

UKIP 27%
Labour 25%
Conservative 24%
Green Party 8%
SNP 2.5%
Liberal Democrats 7%