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Old 04-26-2017, 12:15 PM   #201
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Re: America & North Korea

Here's an update of current tensions and the 100 Senator briefing: What you need to know about rising tensions on the Korean Peninsula
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Old 04-26-2017, 01:13 PM   #202
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Re: America & North Korea

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You're not paying attention then.

The problem is twofold: (1) Republicans have all the chips and the vast majority are putting party in front of country and (2) the person sitting in the Oval Office is likely a treasonous criminal who also happens to have mental health issues and who is putting company in front of country.

But other than that, nothing to see here ... move along now.
I'm just not seeing it tbh, women's march/March for science are great ideas but won't achieve a thing. Same for shouting at your reps in town halls.

Lots of things would be much more effective way of protest, maybe a call for a general strike for starters.
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Old 04-26-2017, 01:45 PM   #203
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Re: America & North Korea

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I'm just not seeing it tbh, women's march/March for science are great ideas but won't achieve a thing. Same for shouting at your reps in town halls.

Lots of things would be much more effective way of protest, maybe a call for a general strike for starters.
What can you do though on a large scale? People have families, lives, jobs, kids, etc.

Just on logistics alone, it would be hard to do anything.
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Old 04-26-2017, 04:31 PM   #204
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Re: America & North Korea

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What can you do though on a large scale? People have families, lives, jobs, kids, etc.

Just on logistics alone, it would be hard to do anything.
If Trump pushes this to war and it turns into the mess some are predicting, (i.e. enormous civilian deaths in South Korea and [possibly] thousands of flag draped coffins returning to Dover Air Force base - not to mention worldwide economic effects), I suspect voters will blame Republicans and vote against them en mass in the 2018 mid term elections. So Trump will manage not only to destroy North Korea but also the Republican Party as well.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:23 PM   #205
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Re: America & North Korea

I think the writing is on the wall at this point, and if you are living in South Korea, Japan, or U.S. islands in the Pacific, including Hawaii, you should start making contingency plans. North Korea is not going to abandon their nuclear and ballistic missile programs, and the U.S. is going to attack them at some point. Could be this year, could be next year, could be in 5 years, who knows, but the U.S. seems to have made up its mind.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:53 PM   #206
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Re: America & North Korea

Just hope they don't hit the east coast during the holidays.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:56 PM   #207
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Re: America & North Korea

I'm bad at great circle routes. Which is closer to NK, the Whitehouse or Mar-a-lago?
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Old 04-27-2017, 12:02 PM   #208
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Re: America & North Korea

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I think the writing is on the wall at this point, and if you are living in South Korea, Japan, or U.S. islands in the Pacific, including Hawaii, you should start making contingency plans. North Korea is not going to abandon their nuclear and ballistic missile programs, and the U.S. is going to attack them at some point. Could be this year, could be next year, could be in 5 years, who knows, but the U.S. seems to have made up its mind.
Meh, this is not unlike the posturing that the US did when India and Pakistan were developing their nuclear assets. Lots of tough talk but in the end once the nations have the weapons they're pretty much untouchable so nothing really happens.

If Kim really has working weapons then the whole discussion about going to war with them is moot unless the US wants to launch a nuclear first strike, and that would be pointless because then South Korea and Japan are threatened with a retaliatory strike even if the US mainland isn't. It's a bluff.
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Old 04-27-2017, 12:27 PM   #209
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Re: America & North Korea

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Meh, this is not unlike the posturing that the US did when India and Pakistan were developing their nuclear assets. Lots of tough talk but in the end once the nations have the weapons they're pretty much untouchable so nothing really happens.

If Kim really has working weapons then the whole discussion about going to war with them is moot unless the US wants to launch a nuclear first strike, and that would be pointless because then South Korea and Japan are threatened with a retaliatory strike even if the US mainland isn't. It's a bluff.
Trump though. If we think he's crazy, imagine what NK is thinking.
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Old 04-27-2017, 12:28 PM   #210
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Re: America & North Korea

The more worrisome danger with an unhinged and unpredictable Trump is not so much a pre-emptive attack on NK in my opinion. I think it's more likely that he humiliates Kim -- through bullying tweets or false military movements or the fanfare of some special Senate WH meeting or whatever -- into thinking his only out is a first strike against the US or its allies.
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Old 04-27-2017, 12:44 PM   #211
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Re: America & North Korea

Yea, the problem with Kim is he is 100% brainwashed institutionalized. With his father/grandfather, they were more cognizant of the fact they were dictators first and not actual Gods. They were obviously brainwashed too but not to the extent lil Kim is. With Kim, it seems to be the opposite.

Then again, the dude likes the NBA and Disney. So WTF do I know.
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Old 04-27-2017, 12:54 PM   #212
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Re: America & North Korea

Speaking of brainwashed, we don't often understand the full impact of the THAAD defense system here in the US. Most people only know it's controversial, and that NK and China are against it, but they don't know why. From what I've heard, the North Korean people have been brainwashed to believe that the US's deployment of THAAD was for invasion purposes and not self defense. The system was deployed yesterday or the day before, and they're saying it will be operational within days. We can probably expect some heated exchanges after that.
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:00 PM   #213
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Re: America & North Korea

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Speaking of brainwashed, we don't often understand the full impact of the THAAD defense system here in the US. Most people only know it's controversial, and that NK and China are against it, but they don't know why. From what I've heard, the North Korean people have been brainwashed to believe that the US's deployment of THAAD was for invasion purposes and not self defense. The system was deployed yesterday or the day before, and they're saying it will be operational within days. We can probably expect some heated exchanges after that.
I don't know one way or the other about intent, but missile defense systems would be an important part of supporting an invasion of NK.

Does it really take brainwashing for a North Korean to imagine that's the purpose when every year for 40 years we participate in the largest war games in the world around fighting NK and on even numbered years there's a huge practice invasion?
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:29 PM   #214
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Re: America & North Korea

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The more worrisome danger with an unhinged and unpredictable Trump is not so much a pre-emptive attack on NK in my opinion. I think it's more likely that he humiliates Kim -- through bullying tweets or false military movements or the fanfare of some special Senate WH meeting or whatever -- into thinking his only out is a first strike against the US or its allies.
North Korea isn't crazy or suicidal. They will not start a war because they are humiliated or for some other non existential reason. The only way I could see them acting first is China blocks their oil imports and chokes off their economy. The oil embargo is what got Japan to attack the U.S. first in WWII. They don't want war, but if they are backed into a corner where their regime will otherwise not survive, the leadership will convince itself that a first strike and winning a quick war could be accomplished, before the enemy can utilize all of its superior resources. We even know from spies and defectors that North Korea's war plans are basically that same scenario.

Since China will never do that though (it certainly wouldn't be in their interest), I think it's a foregone conclusion that the U.S. will attack North Korea first, probably in the next couple of years. For now, this is all bluffing and posturing and nothing is imminent. But I think the U.S. military is going to use these brinksmanship stunts as a means to slowly aggregate assets into the area, rather than send them all at once.
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:32 PM   #215
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Re: America & North Korea

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I think the writing is on the wall at this point, and if you are living in South Korea, Japan, or U.S. islands in the Pacific, including Hawaii, you should start making contingency plans.
Contingent plans like leave the island or build a bomb shelter?

You are talking about 500 million people. Where should they all go?
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Old 04-27-2017, 02:04 PM   #216
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Re: America & North Korea

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North Korea isn't crazy or suicidal. They will not start a war because they are humiliated or for some other non existential reason. The only way I could see them acting first is China blocks their oil imports and chokes off their economy. The oil embargo is what got Japan to attack the U.S. first in WWII. They don't want war, but if they are backed into a corner where their regime will otherwise not survive, the leadership will convince itself that a first strike and winning a quick war could be accomplished, before the enemy can utilize all of its superior resources. We even know from spies and defectors that North Korea's war plans are basically that same scenario.

Since China will never do that though (it certainly wouldn't be in their interest), I think it's a foregone conclusion that the U.S. will attack North Korea first, probably in the next couple of years. For now, this is all bluffing and posturing and nothing is imminent. But I think the U.S. military is going to use these brinksmanship stunts as a means to slowly aggregate assets into the area, rather than send them all at once.
Maybe humiliated was the wrong word. Threatened is more like it, yeah.
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Old 04-27-2017, 04:19 PM   #217
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Re: America & North Korea

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Contingent plans like leave the island or build a bomb shelter?

You are talking about 500 million people. Where should they all go?


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Old 04-27-2017, 04:49 PM   #218
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Re: America & North Korea

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North Korea isn't crazy or suicidal. They will not start a war because they are humiliated or for some other non existential reason. The only way I could see them acting first is China blocks their oil imports and chokes off their economy. The oil embargo is what got Japan to attack the U.S. first in WWII. They don't want war, but if they are backed into a corner where their regime will otherwise not survive, the leadership will convince itself that a first strike and winning a quick war could be accomplished, before the enemy can utilize all of its superior resources. We even know from spies and defectors that North Korea's war plans are basically that same scenario.

Since China will never do that though (it certainly wouldn't be in their interest), I think it's a foregone conclusion that the U.S. will attack North Korea first, probably in the next couple of years. For now, this is all bluffing and posturing and nothing is imminent. But I think the U.S. military is going to use these brinksmanship stunts as a means to slowly aggregate assets into the area, rather than send them all at once.
North Korea will never start a war for a non-existential reason, eh? :thinkingemoji:
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Old 04-28-2017, 05:13 PM   #219
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Re: America & North Korea

North Korea just test - fired another ballistic missile.
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Old 04-28-2017, 05:18 PM   #220
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Re: America & North Korea

Just in time for Trump to blow **** up on Day 100.
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Old 04-28-2017, 05:26 PM   #221
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Re: America & North Korea

Nobody switch THAAD's power on?
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Old 04-28-2017, 05:28 PM   #222
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Re: America & North Korea

Looks like it was a failure (the missile, not THAAD).

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Old 04-28-2017, 05:33 PM   #223
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Re: America & North Korea

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North Korea just test - fired another ballistic missile.
Cite?
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Old 04-28-2017, 05:42 PM   #224
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Re: America & North Korea

Seems it was a test of the same missile that blew up immediately a few weeks ago. Test failed, but the missile traveled ~30 miles out over the Sea of Japan.
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Old 04-28-2017, 09:39 PM   #225
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Re: America & North Korea

The THAAD and Patriot systems are impressive but bear in mind it's essentially like trying to hit a bullet with another bullet, except for the fact that both missiles are moving a hell of a lot faster than a bullet. Plus if the incoming projectiles are all nuclear tipped then you basically need a 100% success rate to avoid death.

Also, if they ever get space based weapons then forget it. Those re-enter the atmosphere at something on the order of 25,000mph and deploy as multiple re-entry vehicles, each one nuclear tipped. Hitting even one is pretty much impossible, hitting them all is ridiculous.

The whole thing is madness. Buy the little idiot off and forget about him.
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