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Old 04-17-2017, 04:20 PM   #126
fuluck414
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Re: America & North Korea

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If Seoul gets obliterated China gains power in region so they really have no reason to intervene. I wouldn't want to be living in Washington state right now. Is it true that a nuclear blast could reach across whole united states?
Constructing my bomb shelter now.
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Old 04-17-2017, 06:04 PM   #127
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Re: America & North Korea

Just listening to trumps people talk about NK and I don't see how the stupid ****s don't follow through now and take military action. Similar rhetoric before US went into Iraq and it's coming to a head.

Pretty frightening tbh.
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Old 04-17-2017, 06:14 PM   #128
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Re: America & North Korea

List of groups taking advantage of Trump as the Useful Idiot to accomplish goals:

* Russia
* Republicans
* US Military
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Old 04-17-2017, 07:01 PM   #129
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Re: America & North Korea

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I've had recent IRL conversations with Trumpkins who are already setting up this serve. "This is all Kim's fault" as if his wrongness gives Trump permission to behave any way he wants and still be right regardless of the result. Scary **** for sure.
Why not. That's the way they treat interactions between police and people of color.
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Old 04-17-2017, 08:56 PM   #130
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Re: America & North Korea

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List of groups taking advantage of Trump as the Useful Idiot to accomplish goals:

* Russia
* Republicans
* US Military
* News Corp
.
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Old 04-18-2017, 12:10 AM   #131
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Re: America & North Korea

Ghoulish Investing (or Ghoulish Gambling?)

OK, let's assume you're the kind of "investor" who likes to gamble on long shots. In this context, let's also assume that an all out war (or some type of military action) breaks out between the United States and North Korea. If such a mass casualty scenario actually occurs, there will be economic "winners" and economic "losers" - in addition to all the people who will wind up losing their lives. (If North Korea is attacked and delivers on their threat of turning Seoul into "a lake of fire," the deaths and casualties could number in the millions; so a war will be a humanitarian - as well as an economic - catastrophe.)

Anytime something truly dire happens, there are (a few) astute investors who read the teal leaves correctly, get their bets in early, and profit enormously. (When the housing market crashed ten years ago, John Paulson was one of the few who placed his bets early and profited to the tune of billions.)

I don't understand how options work, but let's say you believe war between the U.S. and North Korea is more likely than less likely. How do you play your cards? In terms of equity and debt markets, who will be the big winners (and the big losers) if war breaks out?

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Old 04-18-2017, 01:21 AM   #132
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Re: America & North Korea

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If Seoul gets obliterated China gains power in region so they really have no reason to intervene. I wouldn't want to be living in Washington state right now. Is it true that a nuclear blast could reach across whole united states?
Huh? You know we bombed Nevada plenty?
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Old 04-18-2017, 01:24 AM   #133
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Re: America & North Korea

Small skirmishes are possible, but the only war with NK will be a significant nuclear first strike by Trump. The US military will absolutely not launch an invasion and let the invasion force get nuked by NK.
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Old 04-18-2017, 01:32 AM   #134
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Re: America & North Korea

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Small skirmishes are possible, but the only war with NK will be a significant nuclear first strike by Trump. The US military will absolutely not launch an invasion and let the invasion force get nuked by NK.
Even Trump knows this and that's why he said there are submarines which are more powerful than the air craft carriers nearby. One Ohio class sub has as many nuclear warheads as China and North Korea put together.

Last edited by microbet; 04-18-2017 at 01:52 AM.
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Old 04-18-2017, 01:49 AM   #135
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Re: America & North Korea

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foal_Eagle

These are the largest war games in the world and we do it every year. Supposedly defensive against NK, but we include nuclear submarines, B1 and B52 bombers.

The last practice war we had against NK was about one month ago.
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Old 04-18-2017, 02:14 PM   #136
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Re: America & North Korea

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What's going on here?

China, Russia chasing US ship near Korean Peninsula

Yes, it is the Carl Vinson. Maybe an alarmist headline because it looks like they're just gathering intel. So far.
Potentially complicating for this story: The USS Carl Vinson was actually thousands of miles away around Indonesia on Saturday
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Old 04-18-2017, 02:26 PM   #137
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Re: America & North Korea

Wow, WTF @ both the Hill and the WH. Is nothing true anymore? GoT has more reliable narrators.
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Old 04-18-2017, 05:03 PM   #138
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Re: America & North Korea

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do u have anything to contribute to this thread other than being a sarcastic dick head?
That escalated quickly. I live in Washington state, somebody said they'd hate to live in Washington state.

You seem upset.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
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Old 04-18-2017, 08:41 PM   #139
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Re: America & North Korea

US armada nowhere near NK
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Old 04-18-2017, 09:15 PM   #140
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Re: America & North Korea

I thought Dennis Rodman already sorted this out?
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Old 04-18-2017, 10:31 PM   #141
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Re: America & North Korea

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are people really still on the "he (or they) doesn't really want to start a war" brigade?

They all want war. Idiots. Jesus christ.
A big part of the Russian online propaganda campaign was putting the idea out there that Hillary was more likely to start conflicts abroad. A lot of effort was put into getting people to believe Hillary was actually more dangerous than Trump. Anyone who dabbles in any right wing media online during the campaign caught at least some of it.

I know at least one guy who won't be voting for him again in 2020 over this ****, so at least that's something.
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Old 04-18-2017, 11:23 PM   #142
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Re: America & North Korea

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Small skirmishes are possible, but the only war with NK will be a significant nuclear first strike by Trump. The US military will absolutely not launch an invasion and let the invasion force get nuked by NK.
I think the U.S. will absolutely launch a first strike nuclear attack on North Korea at some point. Not out of necessity, but I think there are factions in the military, civilian government, and defense industry who are foaming at the mouth for the chance to do it.
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Old 04-18-2017, 11:29 PM   #143
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Re: America & North Korea

Why doesn't Trump just invite Kim jong-un down to Mar a lago for KFC and a chin wag?

Dennis Rodman can be the middle man.

Last edited by BroadwaySushy; 04-18-2017 at 11:34 PM.
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Old 04-19-2017, 12:58 AM   #144
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Re: America & North Korea

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Huh? You know we bombed Nevada plenty?
I could be wrong but I was under the impression that the largest nuclear blast possible using modern warheads would be orders of magnitude larger than anything seen in the past.
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Old 04-19-2017, 01:17 AM   #145
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Re: America & North Korea

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I could be wrong but I was under the impression that the largest nuclear blast possible using modern warheads would be orders of magnitude larger than anything seen in the past.
Tsar Bomba I believe is the biggest bomb ever made. In 1961 by the Ruskies. 1570 times as powerful as the Hiroshima bomb. Still, it would not sweep across the United States. 3rd degree burns 62 miles away and the thermal pulse was felt 170 miles away.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsar_Bomba

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Old 04-19-2017, 04:15 AM   #146
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Re: America & North Korea

It has been longstanding military and strategic policy that the United States will never be the first to use nuclear weapons - a policy which would seem to rule out a [nuclear] first strike against North Korea. However, Trump was also [allegedly] "quoted" during the 2016 election campaign as asking military advisors (during a supposed discussion of national security issues) why we have nuclear weapons if we never intend to use them? (Apparently our President doesn't get that the primary "use" of nuclear weapons is as a deterrent to war - the threat of using such weapons [hopefully] prevents war from ever breaking out in the first place ...)

If Trump decides to "take out" North Korea's military capability, (assuming he doesn't actually order the use of nukes), it will require a massive (coordinated) attack using conventional munitions and weapons. North Korea has thousands of artillery pieces embedded in the DMZ all targeted on Seoul, the capital of South Korea. To prevent Kim Jong Un from turning Seoul into a "lake of fire," all of those artillery emplacements will have to be destroyed. Our spy satellites know where most of Kim's artillery is located - and can thus be pinpointed and destroyed by Tomahawk cruise missiles - but some of those artillery pieces are hidden with their precise whereabouts unknown. If a conventional attack targeting the artillery emplacements in the DMZ commences, there can be no guarantee that all of the North Korean weapons will be destroyed ... There would almost certainly be some amount of death and destruction that would rain down on Seoul. How much (how many dead and wounded?) is anybody's guess.

The United States proved that our military has the capability to "take out" an adversary back in March of 2003 when we launched a "shock and awe" campaign against Saddam Hussein. Saddam Hussein was clearly willing to take (and absorb) an attack. The wild card in this situation is Kim Jong Un. He's already an ultra-paranoid dictator. If he becomes convinced that Trump actually intends to take him out, he may not wait around (like Saddam did) to be attacked. Attacking first will certainly mean he's a dead man, but with all this bellicose talk from Trump, Un may come to the conclusion that he's probably dead anyway; so he might as well "go first" and make any military action by the United States as costly as possible. From Kim Jong Un's perspective, the calculus probably goes something like: "If I don't use 'em, I'll lose 'em - along with my head - so I may as well strike first."

Absent a last minute diplomatic breakthrough, I sense that we're about to see war. Trump and Kim Jong Un both seem to have their feet set in concrete. Backing down (by either one of them) would represent a serious loss of face. A recent NYT article described this confrontation as a "slow motion Cuban Missile Crisis." That "crisis" went on for 13 days with the final resolution not certain until literally the last day.

Last edited by Alan C. Lawhon; 04-19-2017 at 04:25 AM.
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Old 04-19-2017, 04:47 AM   #147
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Re: America & North Korea

A little while back, before Trump decided that he wanted to increase military spending by like 60 billion, wasn't he complaining about being in 2nd place to Russia with nukes? IIRC, he even used that comment to justify the proposed budget. "Russia has 7000 and we only have 6980...waaaah...what's the sense of having them if we can't use them?" Every other past President and leader looking toward disarmament forever and along comes this jerkoff. Is that what you were referring to Alan?
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Old 04-19-2017, 05:17 AM   #148
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Re: America & North Korea

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A little while back, before Trump decided that he wanted to increase military spending by like 60 billion, wasn't he complaining about being in 2nd place to Russia with nukes? IIRC, he even used that comment to justify the proposed budget. "Russia has 7000 and we only have 6980...waaaah...what's the sense of having them if we can't use them?" Every other past President and leader looking toward disarmament forever and along comes this jerkoff. Is that what you were referring to Alan?
No, the point I was trying to make is that any war that breaks out on the Korean peninsula - be it "nuclear" or otherwise - is going to be much more costly than some people may be thinking. If war actually breaks out, the United States will certainly prevail - North Korea's "nuclear threat" will be neutralized. But it won't be an "easy" (or costless) victory.

There's another danger with these kind of confrontations - the danger of escalation (due to miscalculation) that gets out of hand. North Korea has allies, specifically China. Xi Jinping, China's President, has been very clear with President Trump that China prefers that this impasse be settled through negotiation. If it gets down to brass tacks, there's no guarantee that China won't side with North Korea. If it becomes a three-way standoff, nobody can predict how this might turn out. Once bombs start exploding, this could get really ugly.

Last edited by Alan C. Lawhon; 04-19-2017 at 05:26 AM.
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Old 04-19-2017, 10:17 AM   #149
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Re: America & North Korea

Alan,

Trump has no shame and cannot really lose face in his own mind. He could bomb or back down and be sure that he was right or just not care.
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Old 04-19-2017, 10:18 AM   #150
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Re: America & North Korea

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Tsar Bomba I believe is the biggest bomb ever made. In 1961 by the Ruskies. 1570 times as powerful as the Hiroshima bomb. Still, it would not sweep across the United States. 3rd degree burns 62 miles away and the thermal pulse was felt 170 miles away.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsar_Bomba

its pretty lol how just utterly careless the soviet union was. just completely reckless to test such a bomb. crazy thing from the wiki is that they decided against the 100 megaton version and this thing was only 57. idiots coulda ended the world just from a stupid test.
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