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Old 04-14-2017, 07:30 PM   #51
BroadwaySushy
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Re: America & North Korea

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Originally Posted by Onlydo2days View Post
To be fair, if Trump is able to legit handle this **** without much damage he is gonna look like a boss. Last 3 prez did nothing and then he handles it within 3 months?
He will still get attacked and criticized by the left. You can guarantee that.

Last edited by BroadwaySushy; 04-14-2017 at 07:36 PM.
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Old 04-14-2017, 09:14 PM   #52
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Re: America & North Korea

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He will still get attacked and criticized by the left. You can guarantee that.
There is zero chance of taking out North Korea without millions of allied casualties, so the poster who said he regretted asking the question is spot on, while this post of yours is nonsense.
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Old 04-14-2017, 09:20 PM   #53
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Re: America & North Korea

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Originally Posted by JPantz View Post
What is the policy, justification, etc, that says we are allowed to say who and who can not have nuclear weapons, especially when we have hundreds. This is one thing that's always irked me about US foreign policy.
We're stronger than them so we can do what we want. That's the justification.
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Old 04-14-2017, 10:06 PM   #54
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Re: America & North Korea

Just a reminder:

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Old 04-14-2017, 10:11 PM   #55
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Re: America & North Korea

Who needs ambassadors when you can have nuclear apocalypse?
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Old 04-15-2017, 01:33 AM   #56
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Re: America & North Korea

the time for diplomacy is over
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Old 04-15-2017, 01:56 AM   #57
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Re: America & North Korea

Weird thing about this is how detached your average American is from it. Think most people are just used to the US having their way with middle eastern countries in combat and no shared sacrifice being involved in these missions.

If **** really popped off with NK/japan/SK/US it could really potentially change our lives forever. And yet people aren't exactly on edge about it.

Checked Japan news on Google and apparently there is a "potato chip crisis" which NYT and WaPo have both picked up. Guess it might just be a bad week.

Last edited by Onlydo2days; 04-15-2017 at 02:05 AM.
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:04 AM   #58
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Re: America & North Korea

They'll all be too busy on their twitter feeds to see the bombs coming anyway.
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:14 AM   #59
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Re: America & North Korea

Like how is the nikkei down only .49% in the last trading session.

I guess if the world ends it won't really matter what the final price it closed at is, but umm, there is a little volatility in that region right now.

It just feels like nobody expects anything bad to happen because the world has been a relatively safe place for the last 70 years and they can't fathom a nuke bloodbath.
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:19 AM   #60
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Re: America & North Korea

Well, my alcohol consumption has gone up recently if that is any indication.
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:22 AM   #61
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Re: America & North Korea

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Originally Posted by Onlydo2days View Post
Like how is the nikkei down only .49% in the last trading session.

I guess if the world ends it won't really matter what the final price it closed at is, but umm, there is a little volatility in that region right now.

It just feels like nobody expects anything bad to happen because the world has been a relatively safe place for the last 70 years and they can't fathom a nuke bloodbath.
The risk of huge catastrophic events tends to be underrated in markets... I think that was one of the takeaways from The Big Short.
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Old 04-15-2017, 08:56 AM   #62
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Re: America & North Korea

North Korea showcasing a few new ICBM's

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Old 04-15-2017, 10:31 AM   #63
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Old 04-15-2017, 10:43 AM   #64
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Re: America & North Korea

"The number of missiles and the capability on display here is quite disturbing."

That's how every other country looks at the U.S. every day.
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Old 04-15-2017, 11:25 AM   #65
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Re: America & North Korea

same fake missles, different year.
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:48 PM   #66
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Re: America & North Korea

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Originally Posted by Onlydo2days View Post
Like how is the nikkei down only .49% in the last trading session.
North Korea has been more bark than biye for a long time. Issuing threats us utterly standard.
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Old 04-15-2017, 03:36 PM   #67
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Re: America & North Korea

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North Korea has been more bark than biye for a long time. Issuing threats us utterly standard.
I've lost count of the times POTUS states 'we'll solve North Korea' (sending a few rusty warships their way) and NK retaliates with 'all out nuclear war will be met with all out nuclear war'

Standard
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Old 04-15-2017, 03:56 PM   #68
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Re: America & North Korea

Have To Make A Deal

From the perspective of the United States, the options with respect to North Korea are bad - and worse. That's why no U.S. President (going back to at least Clinton) has dealt with the problem of North Korea and nuclear weapons - they've all preferred to pass the buck on to their successor. Now, with NK right on the brink of having deliverable nuclear weapons, the time for passing the buck is over.

From the perspective of Kim Jung Un and dictators around the world, they're vividly aware of what happens to leaders the United States doesn't like. They wind up hanging at the end of a rope (Saddam Hussein) or dragged out of a drain pipe and beaten to death (Muammar Khaddafi) or killed on the steps of the Presidential Palace (Salvador Allende) in a CIA-sponsored coup. Dictators, especially paranoid repressive dictators, know that the only real protection against being deposed and/or murdered by the United States is the possession of deliverable nuclear weapons. The "bomb" is the great equalizer. Once you have the ability to literally destroy another country - wipe it off the face of the earth - that "other country" thinks twice before trying to eliminate you. (Surrounded by enemies, the nation of Israel has managed to survive in no small part due to the nuclear arsenal they possess. Nuclear weapons = security.)

So, given these facts, it would appear that we're at an impasse. Kim Jung Un is determined to develop a nuclear weapons capability as he sees that as his only true guarantee of survival and remaining in power. Donald Trump is equally determined that Un never obtains that capability. Donald Trump sees this as a matter of national security - North Korea having the bomb is a direct threat to our survival. As the lyrics to the old Johnny Mercer song go: Something's gotta give.

There is a possible solution to this problem which does have a precedent in history. It's a variation on how the Cuban Missile Crisis of 1962 was resolved and nuclear war was averted. The United States and Russia stared down the abyss of Armageddon and quickly realized that they both had to figure a way out since destroying the world over a damn island wasn't a good idea - for either side. In the end, a deal was struck. In exchange for agreeing to withdraw their "offensive missiles" from Cuba, (under UN monitoring and supervision), Russia obtained a pledge from the United States that we would cease trying to overthrow Fidel Castro and Cuba's [communist] government. That "agreement" has held in place to this day as Castro managed to outlast eleven U.S. Presidents - despite numerous CIA plots and attempts to destabilize and try to eliminate him.

North Korea is not going to halt their attempt to obtain nuclear weapons. There is a deep mindset in NK that having these weapons is their only guarantee against eventually being invaded and/or toppled by the United States. This fear (for their security) is visceral. A deal, a binding deal, (possibly brokered by the UN), will have to be reached where the United States agrees never to attempt to depose, by force or direct military action, the Government of North Korea. North Korea, in exchange for this pledge, will agree - under UN supervision - to halt their pursuit of nuclear weapons and not attempt to develop such weapons in the future. There are a lot of details that will have to be worked out for such an agreement to come to fruition, but the alternative to reaching such an agreement, (i.e. eventual war), will avoid [possibly] millions of deaths and casualties.

The United States - not to mention China - has a vested interest in reaching such an agreement. A major conflagration on the Korean peninsula will produce enormous strains for both nations - not to mention South Korea and Japan. This is another reason why past U.S. Presidents have put the North Korean problem on the back burner. They've known that dealing decisively [militarily] with NK will unleash a Pandora's box of problems ...

Whether we like it or not, trying to reach a negotiated settlement to this problem is preferable to going down the military road. (It's also preferable to having a nuclear armed North Korea.) One thing is almost certain. Without such an agreement, the status quo will not hold indefinitely ... If North Korea keeps advancing toward having a nuclear capability, there will [eventually] be war - and it won't be pleasant.

Last edited by Alan C. Lawhon; 04-15-2017 at 04:18 PM.
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Old 04-15-2017, 04:42 PM   #69
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Re: America & North Korea

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Originally Posted by Alan C. Lawhon View Post
...Russia obtained a pledge from the United States that we would cease trying to overthrow Fidel Castro and Cuba's [communist] government. That "agreement" has held in place to this day as Castro managed to outlast eleven U.S. Presidents - despite numerous CIA plots and attempts to destabilize and try to eliminate him.
Sounds like the US welched on its pledge.
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Old 04-15-2017, 06:16 PM   #70
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Re: America & North Korea

Nonsense, Alan. Both North Korea and the United States's "word" are meaningless. Both regimes have a long history of duplicity, including up to today.

There are considered to be two possible outcomes. One: the U.S. will attack North Korea, and while the U.S. would win that war, she and her allies would suffer millions of casualties in South Korea, Japan, possibly across the Pacific. Or, North Korea will obtain the means to deliver the bomb, and start getting the Russia treatment.

Alternatively, there is a third scenario in which the United States continues down the path of moral decline and global belligerency. The U.S. may do a nuclear first strike on North Korea as a Guernica like test run for a future existential conflict, as military doctrine abandons mutually assured destruction and embraces nuclear warfare and missile defense.
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Old 04-15-2017, 07:17 PM   #71
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Re: America & North Korea

So NK just launched a missile - - but it failed. US military is assessing for more details.
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Old 04-15-2017, 07:20 PM   #72
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Re: America & North Korea

**** I thought we faded a NK test this weekend when they didn't launch last night or early this morning.
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Old 04-15-2017, 07:25 PM   #73
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Re: America & North Korea

Edit: my pony test failed.
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Old 04-15-2017, 07:25 PM   #74
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Club Re: America & North Korea

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**** I thought we faded a NK test this weekend when they didn't launch last night or early this morning.
Nope. Trying to think, why now at this hour of the morning? Is Pence just arriving in SK or something? Wonder where it was headed and what was in it. And what response will there be from our maniac? This is getting intense.

Last edited by Our House; 04-15-2017 at 07:28 PM. Reason: The US has initiated its "missile launch conference call" according to MSNBC.
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Old 04-15-2017, 07:49 PM   #75
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Re: America & North Korea

Trump was just briefed. China might become a currency manipulator again.
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