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Old 09-29-2017, 09:55 AM   #151
th14
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Originally Posted by cuserounder View Post
It's a difficult concept to get most people to understand, and yeah, $1 = $1... But inflation is real and rates of inflation go up when you increase the deficit. The buying power of $1 goes down when we cut taxes in a way that adds to the deficit. So even if your net tax burden does not change, your buying power with the "same" amount of money goes down. Meanwhile, the wealthy people getting the tax cuts have less buying power per dollar, but they have more dollars overall as a result of the tax cuts. Thus, their overall buying power goes up.
Japan is a real-life example disproving your claimed link between deficit spending and inflation.

Deficit spending is only inflationary if an economy is at full employment and productive capacity, otherwise the increase in demand is met by increased supply and prices are unchanged.

Money Growth Does Not Cause Inflation!
What Actually Causes Inflation (and who gains from it)

Bernie's econ advisor linking inflation, deficit spending, productive capacity:
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Old 09-29-2017, 09:56 AM   #152
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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In the Facts Don't Care About Your Feelings category




https://www.wsj.com/articles/treasur...ers-1506638463
But it's still dumb to call it a double tax on shareholders for some reason, right?
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Old 09-29-2017, 10:39 AM   #153
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Originally Posted by MyrnaFTW View Post
out of the 50 or so tax returns that i did last year ,, all but one was not efiled.
Yes, there is a form called an 8879 that you will sign that allows efiling. Nowadays the tech allows you to get the signature on the form using companies such as docusign. I have clients i have never met in person who I handle this way.


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Old 09-29-2017, 10:47 AM   #154
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

So republicans try to rename the estate tax to the death tax, because then it sounds like a tax that could apply to anyone when it’s actually anything but.

Maybe we should start calling taxes on food a life tax, because you need food to stay alive so it’s just a tax on the living. And it applies to everyone equally. Good counter to the death tax imo
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Old 09-29-2017, 10:48 AM   #155
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Originally Posted by estefaniocurry View Post
The most important tax of all is the estate tax. No one really rich "deserves" that money. That they have so much is evidence something isn't working right in the society/economy. A good remedy is to take a big chunk of it away from their heirs, and spread it out among everybody. Really rich people are a problem for a free, egalitarian society because their basic interest is consolidating their wealth/power at the expense of everyone else. The best solution anyone's found until now is just to take away a chunk of what they don't really need.
Deserving, why does the gov't deserve money that was already taxed? Deserving has nothing to do with it. I spent my entire life generating wealth. I should have the right to bequeath it to whomever or whatever I choose.
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Old 09-29-2017, 10:49 AM   #156
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

why?
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:23 AM   #157
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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why?
Because I earned it. Aren't you allowed to spend the money you earn however you want?
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:24 AM   #158
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Deserving, why does the gov't deserve money that was already taxed? Deserving has nothing to do with it. I spent my entire life generating wealth. I should have the right to bequeath it to whomever or whatever I choose.
Great news, you can give $5.5 million to anyone tax free, $11 million if you're married. Also if you engage in some basic estate planning you can shelter many millions more.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:29 AM   #159
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Because I earned it. Aren't you allowed to spend the money you earn however you want?
No one gets to $11 million without getting it off the backs of the working poor. No one gets to $11 million without being a tremendous beneficiary of the system of society we've set up here. Pretending you became a millionaire all on your own is the ultimate narcissistic delusion.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:29 AM   #160
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Because I earned it. Aren't you allowed to spend the money you earn however you want?
Nope. We take a portion of it to spend on things that are socially useful.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:32 AM   #161
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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No one gets to $11 million without getting it off the backs of the working poor. No one gets to $11 million without being a tremendous beneficiary of the system of society we've set up here. Pretending you became a millionaire all on your own is the ultimate narcissistic delusion.
Ahh, let's go down that rabbit hole. I responded to a post that someone made about no money should be left, fast forward from zero to 11 million. FWIW did poker players that invested in bitcoin get their money off the backs of the poor?

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Old 09-29-2017, 11:33 AM   #162
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Nope. We take a portion of it to spend on things that are socially useful.
So your after tax dollars are now subject to additional taxes?
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:35 AM   #163
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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So your after tax dollars are now subject to additional taxes?
Um, always? After I pay income taxes, I'm then stuck paying sales taxes, property taxes, etc. with after-tax dollars.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:36 AM   #164
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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So your after tax dollars are now subject to additional taxes?
Absolutely. Sales taxes, road taxes, estate taxes. After tax dollars is a totally meaningless phrase.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:39 AM   #165
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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So your after tax dollars are now subject to additional taxes?
you mean like when you take after tax dollars , and the winner has to pay taxes on it, and the loser cant write it off? seems fair and legit
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:49 AM   #166
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

It's not even double taxation anyway. The recipient never paid taxes on it.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:52 AM   #167
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

One of the things I'm most excited to watch for:

Tax cuts on rich people are massively unpopular. Congressional Republicans will try their hardest to keep on message and spin lies that this isn't actually a tax cut for rich people. At some point, Trump will say the quiet part out loud and give up the entire lie.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:56 AM   #168
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

They're already there.

"It's not a tax cut for rich people but this tax cut will unleash growth by giving more money to rich people" is already the out of the gate talking point.

Prediction: estate tax repeal gets through. Not that expensive, directly helps tons of congress critters.
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Old 09-29-2017, 11:58 AM   #169
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Originally Posted by estefaniocurry View Post
It's a piecewise linear function. Not really that complicated. Even engineers can understand it.


nerd shade itt
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:00 PM   #170
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Um, always? After I pay income taxes, I'm then stuck paying sales taxes, property taxes, etc. with after-tax dollars.
No, you aren't.

At least, not if you're doing your tax returns properly.
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:02 PM   #171
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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No, you aren't.

At least, not if you're doing your tax returns properly.
You can only deduct one of state sales or income taxes. CA has both.
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:08 PM   #172
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Originally Posted by raradevils View Post
Deserving, why does the gov't deserve money that was already taxed? Deserving has nothing to do with it. I spent my entire life generating wealth. I should have the right to bequeath it to whomever or whatever I choose.
And the double taxation crowd is back as predicted. Going to back for the billionaires, but ignoring the middle class.
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:11 PM   #173
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

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Originally Posted by cuserounder View Post
The problem here is people like my Dad, who's middle class and typically voted conservative throughout his life but hates Trump. Never the less, he represents a voter a little right of center. The most steadfast political take he's had over the years has always been this:

"Sure, the Republicans give tax cuts to the rich, but at least SOMEONE gets SOMETHING."

Which always leaves me trying to explain that if the deficit goes up to give tax cuts to the rich, the value of the dollar goes down and people who didn't get a tax cut actually did worse.

That's a tough argument to make... But trying to explain that they're worse off after getting a $165 tax cut is going to be damn near impossible. You'll hear a lot of, "At least I got something! Better than the Democrats!!!"
Translation: at least it's going to hard-working white people and not Obama giving to lazy minorities. Although 'minorities' is likely not the word used in their internal subtext monologue.
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:18 PM   #174
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

Suzzer,
Chiefsplanet update?
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:26 PM   #175
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Re: 2017 "Tax Reform": They'll Screw This Up Too, Right?

You can always check yourself here: http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/forumdisplay.php?f=30

I find the front page a great way to take the temperature of the derp crowd. As expected, about a dozen threads on the NFL, a few conspiracy theories and Hillary threads, Graham-Cassidy long forgotten, no threads on tax reform.

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