Anyways I do like how the Weeds put it. A way to describe a bill is to describe the situation that it's trying to remedy and this bill is mostly trying to remedy a situation where investors and companies are having a rough time in America, where if you out in the hard work to invest in Facebook or any number of corporations then you're relatively scraping by.

We could imagine a situation where that might happen but that doesn't really describe America 2017.

Just like the people they kicked off healthcare.

But these fabled overseas cash stock piles are incredibly top heavy. The top 20-30 companies control most of it. And thinking that high taxes are preventing companies like Apple from expanding in the US is "taking Noahs Ark seriously" level dumb.

Corporate taxes rates should increase not decrease. This **** isn't reform it is just tax cuts.

In 2015 US corporate tax rates were the 3rd highest in the world. https://taxfoundation.org/corporate-...nd-world-2015/ Lower than UAE and Chad. A little higher than Congo, Equatorial Guinea and Sudan.

What would you consider the appropriate rate?

Were their fishtanks on the boat? Because if the flood waters were not the same salinity as the ocean i think you are going to need a bigger boat. Even if they were and you dont need to find a spot for blue whale babies you will need to have space for all the fresh water species.

No one ever cares about the fish.

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That graph is showing the statutory rate, NOT the effective rate. To quote this graph and talk about corporate rates in the US is not only disingenuous, it is moronic. The effective business tax rate in the US is well under 20%. Most big companies pay much less than that. Some pay nothing at all. This is a ****ing abomination, and playinggameswithu is 100% right, it should be increased. The rate should be much higher. Also, the revenue from corporate taxes has fallen drastically as a % of GDP over the last 50 years. That's complete nonsense. These are taxes that are paid after the bottom line is figured. There's no reason the effective rate should be at least 25%.

While we're at it, individuals should have a personal exemption equal to the cost of food/water/shelter/transportation/utilities/any other basic life need. it should be at least $30k.

Let's start with the obvious and then take each of your 'points' one by one.

First the obvious: You're no better than Wil. Are you that short sigted you can't see what is wrong with this bill?

You think this bill is positive for everyone? The ****ing personal tax cuts expire. Taxes will go up on everyone but the rich at the end of this bill and at the expiration of the cuts. Taxes WILL be increasing on certain sectors of the poor and middle class RIGHT NOW, while the rich all get a permanent tax cut. It's nothing but a ruse for the rich to transfer as much money as they can from the poor and middle class before the GOP is removed from politics for good.

What makes us most angry about this bill? It's 'people' like you that think everyone is benefiting. You don't get what the increase in the debt does do you? Of course not. You don't get what the repeal of the individual mandate does do you? Of course not. You don't get what it does to widen the income inequality gap does do you? Of course you don't. Why should you care.

You know that's not how government normally works, but you're happy about it? You're happy that the right is fighting to TAKE MONEY AWAY from the poor and middle class to give to the rich? You do realize that's what is happening don't you? Don't you? Maybe not, maybe you just don't care.

You want to play the whataboutism game? Not only that, but as a hypothetical? Obama could raise the debt 5T? He's not the ****ing president. What's more, 95% of the debt increase under Obama was due to Bush. There is no debating that. Bush fought two wars off the books. He fought 2 wars as ****ING LIABILITIES without paying for them. Guess who finally paid for them? Guess who passed a giant spending measure to stimulate the economy after those wars? Take a ****ing wild guess. Or you can just keep on being a low information deplorable. You keep doing you.

Every other quote in your dog whistle post is nothing more than irrelevant drivel. Nobody agrees with your hot takes because they are blatantly wrong and obviously self serving. You are just like Wil. Just like him. Keep watching Fox news and crawl back in your hole. The world is better off without hearing your useless nonsense.

Also, you absolutely cannot cut taxes in a good economic period unless there is a surplus. You increase taxes on the rich and cut spending to decrease the debt. Cut the ****ing military spending for Christs sake. For the money they are giving away to the rich with this tax cut, we could fund college for all and universal healthcare. You should be embarrassed to follow the current Republican party.

How many people are these rich guys going to employ thanks to their tax cuts?

Some things we've learned in this thread:

[x] Higher taxes == less poverty.
[x] Shareholders are leeches effectively robbing the poor.
[ ] Business investment leads to economic growth
[ ] Dividend increases/stock buybacks have a positive effect on the economy.

dont think so. hes just not very good at constructing a proper analysis so he relies on right wing propaganda. nor is he very adept at realizing dishonest propaganda so he takes it as fact and repeats it. its a problem with his intellect and not his moral compass.

Well no not really, but kind of? Nothing is absolute or 100% and black and white.

So all of that is indeed true at certain times and in certain ways. So sometimes, but not always. Why is that so hard to grasp?

lol no, taxes are not going up. I'll be seeing a 4 point drop in my bracket, not to mention the doubled deduction.

lol no, most people are going to have their taxes lowered from this bill.

lol no, but withholding is going to change

lol no, the question was not regarding the bill, it was a question of how long do we think it'll take payroll to adjust withholding...

snarky liberals are so snarky.

This can't seriously be your analysis.

huh? Why?

I know this has nothing to do with taxes, but bolded is of course correct. Anyone who actually denies the possibility of a higher being of some kind is basically just as delusional as religious people are.

However, even if a higher being exists, the probability that any of the actually existing religions are correct about its nature, actions, or preferences is still ~0.0000000000%

For one, they got rid of the personal exemptions to largely offset the doubling of the standard deduction.

Uhh like what? I'm all ears here guys.

Just bc your taxes went down does not mean that EVERYONE's did too.

Also, they are phased out over 10 ys. Over that time the taxes of more and more people will get raised and at 10 yrs nearly everyone will be paying more than they are now, ie before the bill.

So I have kind of a personal axe to grind with all the pundits who have circulated the idea that you can save money under the new bill by "forming an LLC." Normally people have all kinds of zany theories about the tax law and you can mostly just ignore them, but I'm already starting to see people who want to insert their LLC (or worse, their S corporation) into random transactions because they have heard that doing things through an LLC is going to save them money on taxes. And you can't just tell them that their personal LLC is literally disregarded for income tax purposes and is treated as if it did not exist, and therefore does nothing, because they've heard it on the teevee that you can save money by forming an LLC now.

Let’s take a family with two kids

In 2017 they get

12,700 standard deduction
4 * 4050 = 16,200 in personal exemptions.

That’s 28,900 off of agi (adjusted gross income)

Once the tax is computed they get 2 * 1,000 = 2000 for child tax credit


Under new plan

Standard deduction of 24,000
PE = get ****ed

So they have an extra 5,000 of taxable income

28,900 - 24,000


The good news is the child tax credit is 2000 per kid and that makes up for losing the PE, because that’s dollar for dollar


So yes most families will see nominal tax benefit, but it’s not like we are all getting an extra 20,000

Or 11,000,000 tax free to heirs.

Before you answer, let's have Taso describe everything he is aware of that this bill changes. Don't have to know everything about the bill, just just as much as you can.

Huh?! Didn't you see the post I was responding to? It was specifically about MY taxes...So yes, my "analysis" was that my taxes are going down.


Will be up to the Congress of 10 years from now to decide if they want to extend the tax cuts or not. "These tax cuts don't last long enough" seems like a pretty weak criticism. I'll take my lower taxes for the next 9 years, though, thnx!