Please settle foolish MMA argument - Sports Betting - SportsBetting Strategy and Forum

Who is favored to win in a MMA match and by how much, say in a UFC ring:

Alexander Ovechkin, after being trained for a day on how to punch, try to avoid takedowns, rules, etc.

A female MMA fighter who is no taller than 5 foot 9 and has won at least one professional match before.

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06-01-2008 , 02:37 PM

The Humungus

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=StBSvfcuQrQ

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06-01-2008 , 02:46 PM

3tm13

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The Humungous: A submission match has almost no bearing on my question.

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06-01-2008 , 03:02 PM

The Humungus

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Originally Posted by 3tm13

The Humungous: A submission match has almost no bearing on my question.

Let me elaborate. The biggest advantage a professional woman fighter would have over a hockey player would be grappling, and there you can see that a properly trained woman can beat even a man with submission training. She demonstrates that she has the strength and technique to dominate a man that's trained in the same thing she is. I think that does a good enough job of making the point.

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06-01-2008 , 03:18 PM

SteelersDMW

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LOL good luck taking him down, this is not a submission contest so he has no reason to go down. Unless she's Gina Carano or something she has less than 5% chance of winning by a freak submission or something after she gets knocked down by a punch in a few seconds. Remember this is a top level athlete in a physical sport.

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06-01-2008 , 03:22 PM

tonymark01

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so is she.

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06-01-2008 , 03:24 PM

The Humungus

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Originally Posted by SteelersDMW

I didn't know that wrestling was an important part of hockey training. Not to mention a pro mma fighter could easily pull guard, even if he's bigger and stronger.

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06-01-2008 , 03:25 PM

3tm13

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The size difference in the video that Humungous showed is not equivalent to a 6'2" man vs a 5'9" woman.

Without striking it obviously just turns into a skill match where strength is a lot less important. The potential for a 5'9" woman to be struck really hard by a 6'2" man while she tries to get him to the ground is part of the question.

Last edited by 3tm13; 06-01-2008 at 03:35 PM. Reason: post was confusing

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06-01-2008 , 03:38 PM

The Humungus

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Originally Posted by 3tm13

Their size difference is not equivalent to a 6'2" man vs a 5'9" woman. Without striking it obviously just turns into a skill match where strength is a lot less important. The potential for a 5'9" woman to be struck really hard by a 6'2" man while she tries to get him to the ground is part of the question.

I would say that the women she fights (if they're strikers) in a pro fight most likely hit harder than a 6'2" man with 1 day in training how to punch. You also have to remember that if the girl is taking it to the ground, and has a hold of the guy, there's almost no way he can generate enough power to hurt her with little arm punches to someone buried in his chest.

Training and technique is a lot more important than size

http://youtube.com/watch?v=hTSFl1M-P1U

Last edited by The Humungus; 06-01-2008 at 03:51 PM.

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06-01-2008 , 03:41 PM

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The Humungus

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We're talking about a GOOD female fighter here, right?

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06-01-2008 , 03:44 PM

#11

3tm13

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Humungous: Im curious both about a simply average female fighter (maybe one who wins half, loses half in the women's UFC) and also a top fighter (one who would beat most other fighters in any women's MMA venue).

Last edited by 3tm13; 06-01-2008 at 03:51 PM. Reason: forgot to add "women's"

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06-01-2008 , 04:03 PM

#12

warrantofice

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I'm pretty sure that every Professional Hockey player is trained atleast in basic boxing techniques.

so i don;t think you can say 1 day of fight training

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06-01-2008 , 04:07 PM

#13

warrantofice

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Oh and this is such an easy victory of Ovechkin.

i mean a pro athlete that strength and endurance trains on a very regular basis - w/ basic striking skills + weight and height advantage...plus he has a day of training.

only way he looses is if he decideds to go to the ground - and with such a big advantage i'm sure most good corner men could couch him out of getting caught

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06-01-2008 , 04:16 PM

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The Humungus

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Have you ever seen someone that has never trained wrestling in an MMA fight?

If not, you should really check out the crossover fights pro kickboxers like Stefan Leko or Semmy Schilt had under MMA rules. Someone that knows how to wrestle vs. someone that doesn't... the wrestler almost always gets the takedown, regardless of size difference.

6'11" 270+ lb Semmy Schilt is a multiple-time K-1 kickboxing Champion, and he lost 3 times to 180lb Yuki Kondo, who isn't even known for his wrestling ability.

I imagine Schilt probably hits harder than a hockey player, as well.

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06-01-2008 , 04:39 PM

#15

warrantofice

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Quote:

Originally Posted by The Humungus

First off, i would think its easier to take down a very large person (270+) because they have reduced mobility/speed/endurance

I think the basic knowledge of the sprawl technique + heavy punches the woman wouldn't have a chance.

Were talking about a full sized man throwing fast/heavy punches against a much smaller woman who's only option is to go for a take down/grapple

I really don't see this being much of a contest

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06-01-2008 , 04:44 PM

#16

paperchamp

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The female and it's not even close. There is no way he would be capable of defending the take down or the submission in one day of training. She would probably even be able to beat him standing up considering he probably has little to no striking experience.

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06-01-2008 , 04:46 PM

#17

paperchamp

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Quote:

Originally Posted by warrantofice

You are way overestimating weight and height and way underestimating technique and training. The latter is much more important than the former. We are talking about a professional MMA fighter against someone with zero experience. Easy pick.

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06-01-2008 , 05:01 PM

#18

Thremp

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How big is this chick? Is it like last night with the 5'9 140 lbs girl? What would be a comparable man? 5'6 120? 5'8 120?

The strength difference ******edly absurd though. It'd be interesting to see. I wouldn't be shocked if the dude just bear hugged the girl into passing out like in one of those sweet 1970s martial arts movies... Didn't they have that in bloodsport?

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06-01-2008 , 05:12 PM

#19

SteelersDMW

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Quote:

Originally Posted by The Humungus

Yeah but the only difference is they are both males whereas Ovechkin is a male who works out regularly against a woman who is obv not close to his size. I'd say its Ovechkin by a brutal TKO about 1 min in. Oh and there is no way she wins the standing battle because after one big punch from Ovechkin she is laying on the floor.

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06-01-2008 , 05:33 PM

#20

Thremp

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SteelersDMW

This isn't accurate. I doubt a untrained male would have any shot at making solid contact with a trained fighter. All of these women are elite strikers and if given Muay Thai rules, would probably beat down most of the dudes.

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06-01-2008 , 06:02 PM

#21

Phildo

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if the girl is competent at takedowns and submissions, ovechkin gets worked like 95% of the time and wins by ko/tko 5% of the time

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkT3wphWSrk

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06-01-2008 , 07:09 PM

#22

smbruin22

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i'd say ovechkin easily.... 180 lb guy taking down 270 lb kickboxers is interesting. but the 180 lb guy could be alot stronger than ovechkin. no way the woman is.

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06-01-2008 , 07:17 PM

#23

Phildo

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Quote:

Originally Posted by smbruin22

i'd say ovechkin easily.... 180 lb guy taking down 270 lb kickboxers is interesting. but the 180 lb guy could be alot stronger than ovechkin.

kondo isn't and he's nowhere near as strong as semmy schilt either, who is monstrously strong.

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06-01-2008 , 07:21 PM

#24

smbruin22

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this is mixing a bunch of things, but look when chyna boxed joey buttafucco. she was elite strong woman athlete and he was middle-aged bar owner type and he basically manhandled her. it was a joke.

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06-01-2008 , 07:25 PM

#25

Phildo

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Originally Posted by smbruin22

she was elite strong woman athlete

lol no

this is pretty much big show vs. floyd mayweather in a boxing match, except that mma favors size/strength even less than boxing for the most part (mostly because of the grappling element) and ovechkin has even less applicable training than big show does (big show did boxing for awhile before getting into pro wrestling, while ovechkin is getting one day of gappling/wrestling training, which isn't going to teach him ****).

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