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Old 03-13-2008, 07:36 PM   #1
KlausSmallblind
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Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Full Tilt Poker $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

tennis_full_t (MP): $157.50
flexfit (CO): $144.20
Ultimate3000 (BTN): $99.90
Charcot (SB): $109.70
Hero (BB): $256.00
UniKK (UTG): $100.00

Pre Flop: Hero is BB with K A
UniKK raises to $3.50, 3 folds, Charcot calls $3, Hero raises to $14, UniKK calls $10.50, Charcot calls $10.50

Flop: ($42.00) 5 4 7 (3 players)
Charcot checks, Hero checks, UniKK checks

Turn: ($42.00) K (3 players)
Charcot checks, Hero bets $25, UniKK folds, Charcot calls $25

River: ($92.00) 6 (2 players)
Charcot bets $54, Hero folds

Hey, this is Klaus Smallblind again, this time i want to talk with you about the river, i choosed this hand from my PO database.

in my first 2 Threads ( https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...d.php?t=153370 ) & ( https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...d.php?t=153302 )
i talked to you about the turn and the preflop play, and some deep thinkings behind it.

As already stated, in this new thread i will talk about the river.

I think, in my first 2 Threads, i was going to deep, and most people couldnt follow. Lets do it simple this time.

We're in the BB, utg opened and sb calls only, so i think with our AK here, a squeeze is the best possible play preflop.

We get 2 Callers, and here comes the flop. The Pot is 42$, we have 2 player with us in this hand, no backdoordraw and only 2 overcards, both players have like 80bb and more behind. What ever we bet here(which had enough foldeq), would commit us to this hand, i think a check is the best play here.

I see alot of people just shove here and tell me about foldeq, and that we got some outs - i would possibly sometimes agree to this if we play against 1 villain, but any player that will shove here, has to think about his game and why he isnt a big winner at his limit.

Turn: we got tptk now, perfect card - would you shove? keep in mind that Unikk also checked behind on the flop (which was the UTG raiser). BUT, Unikk the UTG raiser, isnt our problem at all.. he got most times overcards on this limit, we can totaly concentrate about the SB which called both raises preflop. His handrange is way more dangerous for us at this flop. Overpairs, sets, and so on.

So with our TPTK i only bet 25$ in the 42$, with the thinking BEHIND: to fold on a bad betsize by the SB, and to call everything from the UTG. THIS HERE might be the key, think about this!!!!

of course we also got some foldeq with the 25$ bet, not much, but im fine with it.

The SB calls and the UTG player folds.

River:

NOW, what is a bad bet from the SB to that i would fold?
exactly this value donk bet here. he dont even shoves for his 10bb or whatever more, so i could think about a stupid draw that misses and now he could bluff, NO. He has US definatly with this Betting size Beat, were dead right here.

Think about his randrange with that he would make this betting size.
Till the river, i also thought an overpair 88-QQ for possible for him. But he would never do this betting size with QQ here, cmon.

So what does he have here, to make us fold to 54$ in a 92$ pot with AK?

sets, weired twopair/straights(lol?), slowplayed AA(still possible), backdoor fd?(possible and would be our error cause of the small turn bet). Ak split pot?

I can tell you, that he showed his hand, so i cut this out, and yes i was right, but thats not the point of the thread.

The Point is the riverplay, maybe there some informations and things that you see on the past streets. I saved atleast 54$ here, thats what makes the difference between a 10ptbb winner, and for example a 30ptbb winner.

take a deep think, thing about the ev of all our possible plays.

I showed you another way of outplaying bad players at smallstakes longterm for way more money as your could get with your "stupid" shove/fold plays, that i see allways here, u can with a deep thinking and understanding of the gameflow, make more money as you can imagine.

Klaus 'Attention Whore' Smallblind

Last edited by Not_In_My_Name; 03-13-2008 at 08:09 PM.
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:45 PM   #2
naaz
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:
I think, in my first 2 Threads, i was going to deep, and most people couldnt follow.
o rly?
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:45 PM   #3
KeanuReaver
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

wat
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:49 PM   #4
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

hey, its klaussmallblind!
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:50 PM   #5
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

omg FOURF!
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:51 PM   #6
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/fo...hp?f=81&pp=100
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:56 PM   #7
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

fold the turn
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:57 PM   #8
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

BR screen shot on FTP plz
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Old 03-13-2008, 07:59 PM   #9
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

I don't follow.
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:09 PM   #10
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:
Originally Posted by taint_bad View Post
I don't follow.
I lol'ed pretty hard at this. n1
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:12 PM   #11
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

As for the hand I think you're really overthinking things. Or just spelling out unnecessarily what we all know is going on. I understand your reasoning for your bet-sizing on the turn, but these guys aren't great and they're going to call larger bets with their draws. Furthermore it's just so drawy you don't mind taking it down here, there are two FD's and a bunch of str8 draws. I'd bet like $32 on the turn. On the river he's almost always betting for value with a better hand and yeah his range definitely hits this board hard, so folding is fine.

I feel like you're overthinking this hand because it's really not that complicated. At least you played it well though (except for maybe a larger turn bet)
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:13 PM   #12
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Hello KaneKungFu
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:16 PM   #13
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:
I think, in my first 2 Threads, i was going to deep, and most people couldnt follow. Lets do it simple this time.

[197 lines of contorted reasoning over a simple hand follow]
lol
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:17 PM   #14
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:
thats what makes the difference between a 10ptbb winner, and for example a 30ptbb winner.
baahahhhahahaha I missed that the first time! lol!!!
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:18 PM   #15
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

omg this is so awesome
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:23 PM   #16
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

You would get more respect if you had 400bb's at the beginning of this hand.

"Note: This is ONLY to be used to report spam, advertising messages, and problematic (harassment, fighting, or rude) posts."

I always click on that when I see posts like these and then I get sad sad.
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:25 PM   #17
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:
I showed you another way of outplaying bad players at smallstakes longterm for way more money as your could get with your "stupid" shove/fold plays, that i see allways here, u can with a deep thinking and understanding of the gameflow, make more money as you can imagine.
ty
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:32 PM   #18
FoldEqu1ty
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:

he got most times overcards on this limit
He cannot possibly have overcards on this turn ever DUCY???
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:35 PM   #19
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Man I could pick your reasoning to shreds, but then that would be exactly what you wanted wouldn't it?
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:35 PM   #20
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

**582nd Goomashroom Post**

lol these threads are so good
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:39 PM   #21
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

I am so waiting for the hand where he limp raises button all in.. or bets 1$ then gets raised and then shoves. Those moves are so awesome!!! More threads please.. excuse me while i get back to taking notes.
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Old 03-13-2008, 08:57 PM   #22
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

No one's going to answer this because:

You make it sound like you're writing for a BLUFF magazine article and everyone's eagerly following along. YAY, HE POSTED AGAIN!!
You insulted everyone reading in the first five lines.
You're sentences are all over the place. Think before you type.

For example, what's going on inside of your head here?
Quote:
So what does he have here, to make us fold to 54$ in a 92$ pot with AK?

sets, weired twopair/straights(lol?), slowplayed AA(still possible), backdoor fd?(possible and would be our error cause of the small turn bet). Ak split pot?
Explain why his line is pointing towards a set or slow-played AA. Why are two pair or straights funny? I'm sure that you have some reasoning behind your random jabs here but we don't get it, not because you're "going too deep" (LOL) but because you're not saying you're thoughts out loud.

Simply put, reading this post is like listening to one side of a telephone conversation and trying to figure out what the other side is saying.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:00 PM   #23
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Quote:
thats what makes the difference between a 10ptbb winner, and for example a 30ptbb winner
i love this commie batard, bring on the next installment donk..
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:07 PM   #24
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

Okay, everybody made some random comment and we had our laugh, but could we let this thread quietly fade away now?
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:29 PM   #25
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Re: Nl100: River decision, lets take a deep think **3rd KlausSmallblind thread**

we're back in action baby
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