If you thought it was useless then you are dumb imo.

if fds post doesn't help you then you should just be playing "abc".

If you think I am dumb, you are useless imo

If you think I am useless then you are dumb. We can go all day buddy! Maybe you should just read OP since fds' post will not be applicable to you.

It doesn't help me at all. You know why? Because it's a typical ego based reply to someone who is trying to help and start a good discussion.

Instead of disagreeing politely, and furthering the discussion, it's just an overall dismissal of a post that someone wrote to help and start a discussion about poker , even though he admits that 3 of the 7 concepts he agrees with, accept he doesn't like the semantics.

Whenever someone posts something on an internet thread with the tone of "you are wrong and I am right", with no gray area left to ponder, it not useful. this is a post done from one's ego, to make himself feel better about his own knowledge and self, and put others down, instead of furthering the discussion. This is not helpful, especially when it usually starts an argument and gets away from constructive, reasonable discussion.

No it isn't. He has went through the points one at a time and included information on why he disagrees that its good advice. How is that not useful or good for furthering discussion? In fact its probably the best reply on the whole thread in BOTH REGARDS. He was also perfectly civil.

If you think it was just an ego post. Re read OP since it is not applicable to you....

you have 14K + posts, you are smarter and better than me, obviously.

He did have a good informative post. How many of them have you had? You just come in here and start criticizing.

Now let the people who have something useful to say post. I have been reading this thread all along and I find posts with very good arguments on both sides. Now stfu and leave this thread alone.

Come on guys, lets not derail this thread.... its been going so well...

I feel 'fds' is being helpful but I wouldnt mind more detail...

My Bad.

Clearly, Alvin wrote this to help people who aren't winning at poker currently, and are learning the game. it's solid advice for those people. Is it the end all be all advice for poker? Of course not. Is it helpful to SSNL players who are trying to learn and win money? Yes.

These are just general guidelines and theories. Even beginning players know there are no absolutes in poker. It's pretty obvious even early on in one's study. How people read the OP and still think he is giving absolutes in beyond me. Apparently a good many people have a hard time distinguishing the difference between theory and absolutes.

Secondly, this was posted in Small Stakes NL forum. There are A LOT of people here who are at all stages of study. It would be one thing if he posted it in HSNL, and fds posted his response there, but even then....

And furthermore, when someone is posting general theories, it's very easy to find something wrong with it. There hasn't been one famous philosopher in the history of mankind that hasn't been debunked or refuted in some way, but that shouldn't take anything away from their work. Philosophy is just that, philosophy. It's not a science based in fact, it's based in theory.

fds probably doesn't have anything to gain from posting in this thread so i think that everyone should just be happy that he posted anything at all

pretty much this.

also it makes me kinda happy when i see so many ppl actually like OPs.

I think a lot of the people who don't like OP are probably some of the people it is most directed at.

Its funny I agree with both sides of the argument. Some people need to be more solid because they aren't good enough yet to be laggy and spewy and are constantly making mistakes for stacks.

On the other hand if you plan long term to improve, move up, bust rolls you are going to need to stop limiting yourself.

i also think most of those ppl are better at poker than the ones who like OPs.

you guys have only played 500,000 hands combined?

im reminded of something i heard jack nicklaus say a while ago. he advocated that young golfers just grip it and rip it. learn to hit the ball hard and then worry about accuracy later.

i feel like there is a corollary to poker. if you want to become one of the best, its probably better to start off laggy, and learn to bluff and read hands, and push people around. you'll probably lose for a while, maybe even a long while, as you learn. but once things start to click, its a small order to tighten up slightly and play some really tough poker.

this is the route most of the very good players i know have taken. off the top of my head i can only think of 1 really nitty player who loosened up to a point where he could crush everyone. (and sadly it isnt me)

i think you have that backwards, even if you use your saying, hitting hard = TAG. learning "ABC" plays are easier when your equity edge is overall higher against mostly fish opponents and others who won't exploit you.

i guess for midstakes+ that makes sense, but midstakes+ players are already some of the very best players compared to everyone who plays poker, and a young golfer sounds like a beginner

lol at the dick waving in this thread. it never fails. op makes a solid post that is directed towards marginal winners, rakeback grinders, and losers and the midstakes guys come in and poke holes in it. duh. you feel better now?

walk before you can run, right?

Pretty terrible analogy. Fundamentals of poker: basic abc tag play. Fundamentals of golf: stance/grip and swing structure, not how hard or accurately you hit the ball.

lol, fine. my mistake at an analogy attempt.

very good read

Some good posts by fds and _JerryD_
Appreciated

Did you compare grunch notes?!

This is the relationship between VPIP and Win at SD: as the former increases, so the latter should decrease. When you are skilled, you can balance these figures and widen your preflop range, and win just as much when you are playing in more pots. When you get super-skilled, you are profitable in even more situations and don't even lose that much in the balance. But if you step over the edge / do not have the skillz, you can lose balance...spectacularly.

I find this thread fascinating. That is all.

I definitely think I'm winning more playing solid, I'm up 9 BIs over 11K hands so far
but then again people might still think I'm a spewtard because I get a lot of action still