i have been reading the small stakes digests etc and i have noticed that everyone is saying to 4 bet/gii and pot gii on the flop with AA with a certain spr and we are auto profiting. but what i dont get is that surely the caller of the 4 better will be losing money then so they will have to tighten up, or is there something i am missing as surely cannot be auto profiting and the caller of the 4 better losing. or is this dependent on the 4 betters range (e.g, if they 4 bet wider than just AA you can call more 4 bets, idk). sorry for ramblling :/

Some people are looking for variance and they like the opportunity to win a stack with a chance of losing one as well.

Also when they have money already invested it can be +EV for them to call. Because we can not raise more than the pot they can have a good price to see a flop.

ye makes sense, but also are people over playing AA in 4 bet pots or are people overplaying hands vs aces in 4 bet pots coz surely it if AA can auto profit the caller of the 4 bet will be losing a lot, can tell im rambling so sorry if im not making any sense

Key is to put in as much money as possible before the flop and try to minimize the Stack to Pot Ratio so we can not make a postflop error.

Let our opponent pay for drawing out on us.

Not correct, and derjan's answers aren't either.

At a low enough SPR, AA "autoprofits" (weird term, but okay) when the caller of the 4-bet plays perfectly against it (i.e., making every stackoff they have the odds for, folding when they don't). So if the caller of the 4-bet tightens up, AA simply increases its EV.

Happening to be up against AA is an unfortunate situation. And at a low enough SPR, the caller simply loses, but loses less than they would by either folding preflop or stacking off too tightly on the flop.

We had a AA related topic a few days ago. Maybe this helps, op...

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/38...-1ish-1630426/

1. Since there's money already in the pot, both players can make +EV plays simultaneously. Even if all you're doing is charging your opponent to draw, that's still better than not charging your opponent to draw.

2. A lot of players do call 4bets too loosely. Hands like single suited kings, queens, AKT, etc., usually do not have odds to call a 4bet against an AA only range. But vs normal 3bet ranges and with normal sprs (100bb deep, pot-sized opens and 3bets), a 4bet-pot/potcall flop line should be slightly profitable even if your opponent correctly calls the 4bet with hands that can crack aces. Its just that vs typical players who autocall 4bets the line is more obviously profitable.

3. Also, while pot/calling flop is profitable, you can usually do better with check/folds and smallbet/folds on certain bad flops.

Is it possible that both are making +ev plays? Sure. Isolate some guy because position and you have 4-cards. Getting odds with whatever to call a 4-bet. Getting odds to gii otf. Making it -ev means we expect to get 4-bet which is obviously not the case when we 3-bet because we wouldn't 3-bet if that were the case.

edit: didn't see McNasty covered this with #1. I will +1 him and leave my post.

People are overplaying AA hands in general.

Many players see the AA and just assume they have to do everything they can to get their entire stack in regardless of their position, the opponents they are up against or the flop texture once they get there.

The key is to still make +EV decisions from the start to the end of the hand, which many players seem incapable of doing once they see two aces in their hand. They instead go into auto mash pot button mode.

That is actually close to my words but in a more technical format

I was fixated on this part:

But yeah, the rest is fine.

Ok ty.

Sometimes I prefer speed over accuracy in my posts.

Ok ty.

Sometimes I prefer speed over accuracy in my posts. That might affect the quality a bit