Yes, this was a wonderful thread and I've learned a whole lot from it. Hopefully, anyone one else who read it , regardless of their skill level, got something from it too. Caterina gave an excellent description and I need to know all it, not just uncapped. It's saved to my desktop, so I can keep referencing it when I play (Yes, I have a crowded desktop).

Still, at micro stakes, it can be very hard to put a maniac on a preflop range when they have stats like 70/50 or more and higher. Some are playing almost every hand and raising every time they enter at any position, including calling all raises. Since there's basically zero fold equity, it makes me just want to start limping as well.

Additionally, even though you said there's no limping in 6max, I have to believe there is a certain advantage to it as well. It's like having an extra tool in your hand or play. I mean if you're a tight player and raise, it gives t the villain a much better idea of what they're up against. Whereas the occasional limp with hands like AAxx, KKxx or KQQJ disguises things more and the villain is a lot less sure what to guess and that typically leaves us with very good bluff catchers or IP, surprising a LAG with a check raise or all in, if we hit a huge hand that they don't expect us to be on.

In regard to range, ProPokerTools has a chart for hand ordering range. It's a big list and I'm trying to figure out the syntax how to type in 5% or 18% and just have it show 5% of the hands that are with that, rather than a huge list. If it doesn't show up in there, maybe MonkerSolver or one of the training apps can do it?

http://www.propokertools.com/orderin...axordering.txt

Thanks again.

https://us9fu.csb.app/

just type the percent you want to view in the box at the top

That's awesome! Thank you!

70/50 is a little bit extreme and maniacs are a profitable book in themselves.

The weaker players at my limits typically play 40-50% preflop. They also do this statically from every postion. Even though we like to think of them as "mindless stations" or "big whales" they are human beings with logic attached to their starting hand selection. It may be faulty logic, but it's still logic. Meaning, if somebody shows down a weak hand, it is fair to assume that this person is going to play every hand that is stronger than the shown one aswell. Just from looking at those showdowns I have made up a range:
- Every suited A
- Every Pocket Pair
- Every AK combo (all the way down to AK32r)
- Every somewhat connected hand that has also a suit like J(98)2
- Every 0g, 1g and 2g
- Every double suited hand
The logic could be: Any hand that looks like a good PLO or Hold'em Hand (AK, ds trash) and every hand that can "hit big". Meaning making a straight or a set.

I agree that slowplaying big hands (occasionally) is good for overall balance, but there is a different way to do this: Don't have a limping range at all.

It's general a bad idea to use the top of your range (AA preflop) for bluffcatching. The right sort of hands are in the middle of ones range. They loose to all of V.s value but beat all of V.s bluffs.
Using valuehands for bluffcatching makes you lose ev in the long run, because you are missing out on value from betting. It will also make your bets weaker overall, since the ratio of value/bluffs changes in favor of bluffs and so you can bluff less often.

Bluffcatching is no fun and doesn't feel comfortable. It really sucks to call down with hands you know lose a good amount of time. We have to get used to it, playing our strong hands trappy and weak is not a good adjustment against LAGs or other players that put the pressure on us.

Omaha has a 270725 original hands, 36504 of them are double-suited, and
158184 are single-suited. As you can see, it’s hard to present a strategy as
simple as it is for hold'em.
In Preflopper all the hands are divided by suits and pairing: DS – doublesuited,
SS – single-suited, Rainbow. Unpaired, 1 pair, 2 pair. Further, these
categories are divided into smaller ones. Because in Omaha, the hand with the
suited ace is much stronger than the same hand with unsuited ace. High
rundowns plays another way than low rundowns etc. In this way we got 82 categories.

You choose your hand, position, stack size, cash games or MTT, ante or not, rake level. And you got ready-made GTO solution.

some people are good at numbers, while others are good at visual. I'm probably from the second group. For example: they say raise 30% from the button. Okay, I have TT65 suited on the button. Is it in those 30%? Cash game with 5% rake or MTT? Who can answer quickly ... I love this app, it shows what to do graphically. Sometimes the decision is borderline and we can adjust to the opponent

added a visual component to this ppt range viewer thing

https://604ue.csb.app/

does anyone think it's valuable to look at ranges in a nested grid like this? any ideas on other ways to visualize omaha ranges?

green is double suited, blue is single suited. it might take a few seconds to load.

Thanks for your work. I used Opera to look at it and it was shown in an unreadably small grid. Even after zooming out to 200% I could barely make out the actual hands.

I have seen this grit format before, seems to make most sense. Visualizing like this is not bad. Any idea on how to treat triple and quad suited hands?

Could you please leave the old one as default and make the grit optional?

You don’t need to have a solver and spend a lot of time to learn how to use it. Just find preflopper in the AppStore and it shows you what to open, 3bet or cold call from every position. There are some free hands to check every day, so you can use it for free

I looked at it and while the free version may be a decent reference, I'm fairly comfortable with my preflop hands already, so other than the free version, I don't see myself subscribing to something like that - especially for $19.95 a month.

If your preflof was so good that even the Preflopper you don’t need. Then you would not seek the answers here, but would simply printed bucks on poker tables. I use it for several months and it saved me 100 times more than the subscription cost. And most importantly, I am much less likely to make mistakes that did not even understand before.

Are you the developer of the app or part of the people that did?

These programs only bring you so far - there's too many variables to factor in with PLO.

It should work well in chrome.

Regarding the grid, I'm not sure how valuable it is because it is so hard to view the individual squares. PLO Matrix lets you view each individual 2 card combo which is nice, but not entirely useful for more breadth style analysis. Where I feel some kind of hand bucketing chart would be useful.

I made some updates to the app I posted earlier:
https://5z9x2.csb.app/

Also if anyone has a library of postflop sims and wants to make something thats better, cheaper, and/or more exclusive than the rio vision or mastermind plo trainer, send me a PM!

PLO 08 version: https://qfhzu.csb.app/

One solution is "short-hand." Old school poster GoGetARealJob made a post once for open raising ranges. Even 9 years later it probably still holds up well given when it was posted. But the idea is to write hands in some type of short-hand that you will understand. And only you need to understand it, it doesn't need to be accurate simulator syntax.

For example, if I wrote

AJ-4/sa

You would read it as a hand with a suited ace, a jack as the second highest card, no pair and the other two cards are at least a 4 high.

I could write how to open raise every single hand from any position in some type of short-hand syntax.

I could get the cutoff open raising range on a single sheet of paper. You would eventually start to visualize it on you own. That is 1/6 of the positions. Then EP and MP are a bit tighter. The BU is looser and you could easily decide which type of hands to go looser. And the CO and SB are very similar if you are only open raising from the SB because of the rake.

The below link was posted 9 years ago in 2012 by GoGetaRealJob.

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/3...ghlight=ranges

I really like this app because it helps me to win a lot

Here's the thing, NiHao. You're a noob with 20 posts and every one of them is mentioning or pumping the preflopper program. If you're the creator, developer or part of the team with Preflopper, don't be a shill, just say so.

You conducted an integer investigation. I'm impressed. But the answer is much easier. PLO beginners have the same questions (which cards / ranges open or to 3bet, etc.). You can answer them kilometers of text with percentages and formulas. I have an answer much easier and clearer.

SMH. Uh, yeah. We can read between the lines here.

I'm not saying that your program is bad or unhelpful at all but if you believe in it so much, why would you avoid admitting ownership or being part of the team that built it? Upswing, RIO Visions and PLO Trainer all take credit for their programs.

I don't like to do this ****, but I had to look at all your posts on the forum. And what do I see? plo mastermind appears suspiciously often. Are you creator or part of the team?

No, absolutely not. I'm not a creator, associated with the production and I receive no type of incentive or monetary compensation at all with PLO Mastermind.

How about you? Are you the creator, associated with the production or receive any type of incentive or monetary compensation with or from Preflopper?

I was a beta tester of this app Along with hundreds of other people. Testing was free and available to everyone. During testing, my level increased, I stopped loosing. I've been winning more than $1000 regularly in recent months. Of course, I'm full of gratitude to the developer.
As for your strange way of communicating. I don't intend to keep playing your game, which you blame me, and I have to justify myself. So I'll just ignore all your next messages

If asking direct questions and expecting honest answers is a strange way of communicating, well then, call it strange.

As far as the rest, thanks for letting us know your role in relation to the app and congrats on your success at the tables.