Hi all,

5/5/25btn/50sb occasional bb $100 is on too.

1. A few limps to hero in the CO with KK744ss to king, $1,200 eff. bb $100 is on this hand so we are basically 12bb eff. If we raise pot it's going to be for nearly 1/2 our stack.

2. UTG min raise to $100 off a short stack, unpredictable V 3! $300 in MP, hero in $25 btn straddle with AQJ97ds a-high q-high $700 eff.

3. UTG1 limp, UTG2 min raises to $100, a few callers, hero in $50 SB with QQJT4 q-high diamonds calls the extra $50, limper pots $600, everyone folds to hero with $800 behind (slightly cover V). Assuming V has AA a lot and there is a lot of dead money in the pot already and we're closing the action.

Thanks,
DT

1 fold. Bad kk not worth overplaying.

2 call.

3 hero probably supposed to stack off with dead money, only needs 30% or so and can have 40%+ equity

Fold

Call

Fold

The KK744 I could be convinced to overlimp, but what happens if someone raises behind?

I'm potting the double suit KK. I think you get lots of folds which generates a lot of EV. If you only get 1 or 2 callers I think its still ok because you flop a set or flush draw half the time. Plus SPR will be low you wont have to fold much.

i think the KK is ss (single suited) but maybe we should just stack off with it anyway with only 12x the largest forced bet inin our stack.

Oh right. Yeah it makes it much closer. Id still take it i think only 3 ppl behind.

Wont fault anyone now for folding though, pushing only small edge might not be worth it

1. Having enough buyins to weather swings is the difference between potting this hand and just calling. Not sure I could bring myself to fold.

2. I'm probably all-in even if I am feeling underrolled

3. I think the term 'dead money' is oft misunderstood and misused and here just because people have put money in and then folded, that's not what dead money is. If my maths is correct we need ~37% not accounting for rake (put in $800 more for total pot of $2200?) and QsQdJdTc4h is 38% against AA*** and it looks like adding in hands that aren't AA makes our odds better, so in a 0 rake game you've got a very slightly +ev call, i.e. saving our last $200 when the flop comes like A22r or something.

Are you in the big blind rather than the SB for $50?

What do folks use for PLO5 equity calculators these days?

In PLO4 QQJTs is probably what, about 35% or so vs. a range of AA and two non-aces? Here you're getting just about 2:1 immediate (assuming "few" is three and IDK which blind you were or if there was another blind that folded), and then you have to play the additional $300 at a disadvantage because you're pot-stuck even though you know two of their cards. So you'd need a little better than 33%.

In PLO5 I'm sure the pair equities have to run much closer so you're probably fine to call it. But I want a good calculator so I'm not just guessing.

It's gonna be close to 40% unless the AA cover our side cards in which case a little lower. Pro poker tools has a free license.

I still have kind-of mixed feelings about the KK - attacking bad limping ranges (or players that limp fold at high frequencies) pre-flop may be worth 1-2bb in ev.

But Hero will almost always have below average equity share when he is put-all in pre-flop. Similarly below average equity most of the time when 2 or more additional players see a flop.

Assuming 1 or more player typically sees a flop despite Hero potting, combined with poor visibility and playability from Hero hand, Hero is going to have a lot of unprofitable post-flop decisions and make errors that may erase any theoretical gains pre-flop.

Like most PLO spots, knowledge of our opponents will greatly influence how profitable a spot (or not) we think this is.

PPT Odds Oracle.



I did the maths above. Calling off $800 (not many flops we can fold for 11-1 but there will be some) to win a pot of that $800, villain's $800, and the $600 in there already, for $2200, means we need 8/22 = 36.36...%. So if we have 38.051% equity, the rake and rake cap could very easily play the difference in whether this is a call or a fold. Without rake it's a call.

Again I don't know how much live 5 or 6 card PLO you've played but people like to get it in extremely wide, so I don't think we'll be at an equity disadvantage against their ranges when we do get it in, but even if that's true, we more than make up for it the times when they call and miss and fold.

Thanks for the tip. I'll check out that download -- I have fond memories of the live Web version of PPT.

In games in the United States I don't think it's going to affect many decisions in a $2200 pot. Figuring out what happened to the $50 big blind (I'm still not totally understanding the structure of this game) would have a lot more to do with the eventual size of the pot

My recollection of casino games in the US were rakes of a couple of $ or something tiny so yeah if it's that or a time pot then it's a clear get in, but in UK private games we have fairly obscene rake that could make the difference here.

It's time raked, $6 per half hour. The structure is $50 SB blind raise, $5 big blind, $25 btn straddle.

Wait, what? Say that again? That might be the weirdest blind structure I've ever heard of.

Anyway. Sims say to call hand 3 looking to fold flops where we have < 8.3% equity, which occasionally saves us a nice dinner or 8 button straddles. That is, unless both a) the game is juicy AF and b) we're short-rolled or alternatively c) you're in a gambling establishment for a reason other than gambling.

I wonder if the forced straddle is mandated as $25 so that it will play in green chips. Seems like the straddle should be to pot, $20, but I guess it's simpler to allow $25? I'm not one to throw stones-- I play in a $1-2 5 bring-in game where the only "straddle" allowed is to $5. Go figure.

If I were a pedant, I'd mention that a minraise UTG+1 would be to $75. I'm kidding because psychologically I'm sure he meant it as a minraise, especially in the unlikely event he's colluding with UTG.

Anyway so BB folded first to act for $5?

I still remember using the OG (it's still up and online) predecessor to PPT - twodimes.net, had that page open constantly while I was grinding.

No the BB was in the blind $100.

Is everyone this shallow in these games ? Whats your thought process on not being even remotely not short ?

Hello mate!
Can you provide me with the full name or webpage of the calculator?
I just recently started learning Plo5
Thanks

Hello mate!
Can you provide me with the full name or webpage of the calculator?
I just recently started learning Plo5
Thanks

Fewer tough spots postflop when shallow.

odds oracle can be found here. free license until dec 2023 also.

http://www.propokertools.com/

youre playing 20bb plo5, any suited pretty hand is a jam