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PLO2 - Line check w/top set PLO2 - Line check w/top set

12-12-2012 , 01:38 AM
Hey, I'd like some advice on all streets please - particularly the flop and turn. I've run into spots like this a couple of times in the last few days, and I'm not entirely sure what the correct play should be. No stats available sorry, all I can say is that villain is a pretty standard 2PLO fish, and has made some weird plays. E.g the one relevant hand we've played, he lead small into Q9x, lead tiny again on A turn, called a 5x raise then bet .07 into rougly .65 on a Jx river after making the nuts.

I'm not totally new to PLO - have been playing 6max on and off for a few years, and recently beginning to post results consistently - however there are still a lot of spots I'm running into where I'm totally unsure of how to proceed, so like I said - advice on all streets are welcome.



    Full Tilt, $0.01/$0.02 Pot Limit Omaha Cash, 5 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #14975951

    Hero (MP): $2.99 (149.5 bb)
    CO: $1.24 (62 bb)
    BTN: $2.91 (145.5 bb)
    SB: $1.94 (97 bb)
    BB: $1.83 (91.5 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is MP with T T Q 9
    Hero raises to $0.06, CO calls $0.06, BTN calls $0.06, 2 folds

    Flop: ($0.21) 8 6 T (3 players)
    Hero bets $0.14, CO folds, BTN raises to $0.28, Hero calls $0.14

    Turn: ($0.77) 2 (2 players)
    Hero checks, BTN bets $0.77, Hero calls $0.77

    River: ($2.31) 2 (2 players)
    Hero bets $1.88 and is all-in, BTN folds

    Spoiler:
    Results: $2.31 pot ($0.15 rake)
    Final Board: 8 6 T 2 2
    Hero mucked T T Q 9 and won $2.16 ($1.05 net)
    BTN mucked and lost (-$1.11 net)



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    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 06:55 AM
    raise more OTF on this drawy board, then 80%+ turn and value bet river
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 08:02 AM
    flop- bet a bit bigger. there is a bunch of stuff villain could have that will call...

    obv call minirase. this could mean a few things such as, flopped nuts, two pair or a bluff...its weighted like nuts>>>>two pair>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>bluff.

    turn- depending on type of player villain is, this bet can be a few things.
    it is very unlikely villain is continuing and potting with a bluff at 2pl.

    more likely villain has 2pair or set and is getting value from draws.

    it is also likely they are competent and are just get max value from
    their flopped straight as many 2pl players will call with alot worse
    hands.

    agaisnt a straight you have around 20% equity and need 33%. though as said before villain also always had 2pair/lower sets. therefore i think a call is ok.

    river- your shove is obv very strong and is repping pretty much exactly what you have, however i dont think villain could lay down 66xx or 88xx....though once again depends on player stats.

    betting is better checking, though i dont if shove is better than a smaller bet...... shove is ok, like you are always getting max value when they have sets, though there probs folding 2 pairs and straights.

    just depends on how loose or tight villain is.

    this will also help you decide what the range is weighted towars onearlier streets.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 08:17 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by timr23

    agaisnt a straight you have around 20% equity and need 33%.

    .
    board: Td 8s 6h 2c
    Hand Equity Wins Ties
    QTT9 35.29% 189,982 43,497
    97** 64.71% 366,521 43,497
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 08:44 AM
    +1 with ReversedAngleShot.

    Your river sizing is too big and you won't get called there. You should bet 0.6$ - 0.8$ imo to get a call and free money.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 09:23 AM
    how about bet-3betting the flop? this way we can get the money in while we're ahead... assuming villain raises sets, good sd and 2 pair on the flop:

    ProPokerTools Omaha Hi Simulation
    600,000 trials (Randomized)
    board: 86T
    Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
    TsThQd9h66.78% 379,81541,724
    97,QJ9,88,66,JT833.22% 178,46141,724
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 10:19 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Vanhaomena
    board: Td 8s 6h 2c
    Hand Equity Wins Ties
    QTT9 35.29% 189,982 43,497
    97** 64.71% 366,521 43,497
    35 is kinda around 20 right?

    yeah sry, I like boats to much...forgot about the gutter and chop.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 11:16 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bela192
    how about bet-3betting the flop?
    In a 3bet pot shoving the flop is mathematically correct. Quadrophobia wrote a good post of this in his blog and proved that villain has a straight here so seldom that it's profitable for us to shove.

    I'm not exactly sure by how much the result changes compared to a single raised pot but I think 3betting flop is also good.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-12-2012 , 11:50 AM
    link to this?
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 05:55 AM
    So we think 3bet/get it in is the best line for this flop at this level generally?
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 06:00 AM
    Also as for the river - how do we like to play this spot? I considered c/jamming initially, but especially at these stakes I hate leaving value on the table, and I thought villain was likely to check back all straights. I opted to open jam since I figured if he has a smaller boat he's calling any amount, and not raising for the rest of it if I opt for a smaller, more valuey sized bet.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 06:46 AM
    http://quadrophobia.com/omaha-gold/

    I went a bit too straightforward with my statement. I should correct it to what Quadro says there that against an opponent who's cbetting 70%+ more of the time, check-raising the flop for value with top set is a profitable play. Anyway, there's the whole deal if you wish to read it.

    That river I'm betting really small. As I earlier mentioned, I'm betting something like 0.60$ just to get a call. Villains at this level will call with many strange kinds of hands and that is basically a free value.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 08:21 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by skillz_2106
    Also as for the river - how do we like to play this spot? I considered c/jamming initially, but especially at these stakes I hate leaving value on the table, and I thought villain was likely to check back all straights. I opted to open jam since I figured if he has a smaller boat he's calling any amount, and not raising for the rest of it if I opt for a smaller, more valuey sized bet.
    yeah jam seems good....almost definitely checking back straight.

    i dont think a smaller value bet is that bad either as they are probs calling with straights and 2 pair.

    but if you bet between like $0.6 - $1.20 you have to fold if they shove cause they could have 22**
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 09:26 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by timr23
    yeah jam seems good....almost definitely checking back straight.

    i dont think a smaller value bet is that bad either as they are probs calling with straights and 2 pair.

    but if you bet between like $0.6 - $1.20 you have to fold if they shove cause they could have 22**
    wat
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 09:59 AM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by timr23
    but if you bet between like $0.6 - $1.20 you have to fold if they shove cause they could have 22**
    Seriously, no. Just no. If he chooses to raise your tiny valuebet (which you should do), then you jam it and take the monies.

    Do not jam this river straight away, though. You'll lose value that you'd otherwise get by betting smaller.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 10:22 AM
    fold pf
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote
    12-13-2012 , 01:31 PM
    Villain can absolutely have worse sets in his range at this level, and I would bet-3bet the flop, you're actually ahead of bare 97 on the flop (55/45)... I think?

    Pre is a fine open imo.
    PLO2 - Line check w/top set Quote

          
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