5/5, fish opens to 25, bunch of callers, i repot AAJ8ss from HJ, the CO and BTN both flat, we end up going 6 ways to A96r with no backdoor FD for me.

fish open jams for 350, folds to me and i have 950 total, both players left to act behind me have me well covered. both are splashy action players and the CO has a major vendetta against the fish. if i just flat here, they are both capable of calling with some pretty wide holdings, maybe including stuff like gutshot + two backdoor FDs, pair/gutshot/one BDFD, etc.

given how much is in the pot, i just ship it now in order to charge the maximum to any hand that has at least 8 outs. wraps and the like are never folding anyway.

after the hand there was some discussion about whether this is a spot that i should consider flatting; my feeling is that this might be worth considering if i am much deeper with the remaining players, but even then, meh.

Flat is ok and may be more profitable then jam.

I like calling after the fish lead jams.

I have the pot at $1310 with you having $600 left after your call (assuming no raise by either trailing opponent). The key is that your money is going in anyway but your flop jam might drive out one of both of your remaining opponents that may be drawing close to dead relative to you. If you call and one or the other or both call the pot will be be about $2350 or $2700. No matter what comes on the turn you should lead for your remaining $600. There are straight cards that could come that don't actually make a straight for opponents calling a small all-in flop bet hoping to see a showdown cheaply. It won't be that cheap with you jamming turn.

The other advantage of calling is next to act (who has a vendetta against the fish) might more likely raise driving out the remaining opponent who actually has enough outs to make calling the small bet correct.

That said raising is at most a small mistake or perhaps not one at all if my thinking is flawed.

I like calling after the fish lead jams.

I have the pot at $1310 with you having $600 left after your call (assuming no raise by either trailing opponent). The key is that your money is going in anyway but your flop jam might drive out one of both of your remaining opponents that may be drawing close to dead relative to you. If you call and one or the other or both call the pot will be be about $2350 or $2700. No matter what comes on the turn you should lead for your remaining $600. There are straight cards that could come that don't actually make a straight for opponents calling a small all-in flop bet hoping to see a showdown cheaply. It won't be that cheap with you jamming turn.

The other advantage of calling is next to act (who has a vendetta against the fish) might more likely raise driving out the remaining opponent who actually has enough outs to make calling the small bet correct.

That said raising is at most a small mistake or perhaps not one at all if my thinking is flawed.

This is just a math problem that isn’t too hard to work out. Someon should just do that.

I am fine with the jam. You only have $600 above the fish. I guess getting another $700 in there is pretty good, though, and if they might jam for you, it's better. So, either is fine.

I think one of the main benefits from call is a dominated made hand like 2p or set may be more likely to fold to a jam, because hero may call with some weaker hands.

87xx will often not play much differently vs jam or call, plus hero has a redraw with j8 of the t hi straight completes.

But there is a case for folding out semi-speculative backdoor equity, since pot will become bloated enough to call with most half-decent draws.

I would just call and jam all turns. Keeping them in is a good thing. The hands that have good equity were calling anyways.

I used to like slow playing top set nuts. And the call flop is good by me. A factor is your variance situation, looking to win big pots or to win this pot. I like the former. It has been known to backfire. Giving those little sets and two pairs life is really good when it's good.

Meh I like jamming mostly. You have plenty of hands you could potentially rip lightly here so think a lot of 2p holdings are gonna go with it.

You heavily block those btw. And when you’re calling the psb lead there with that SPR it doesn’t look like you’re folding so the only thing it accomplishes is that people get to draw at correct odds vs your hand.

The idea that top set should go in the slow play/small bet range because of relative hand strength is incorrect t.

Rather think: do I keep dominated hands in with that action? Sometimes top set is better to just bomb. A9T8 is a great flat instead for example.

Based on the player dynamics: Jam.

Anyone who is paying attention knows your call commits your stack anyways. Villains with made hands will decide to call/fold based on the assumption they'll put in the $950 regardless. Drawing villains get a nice overlay to hit the turn.

CO's vendetta is mooted in this hand now that you're announcing he has to also beat you at showdown to get the fish's money.

Jam.

well, i may have inadvertently spoiled this one with a player description i posted in another thread around the same time, but CO super tank-called with middle set + a gutshot, fish somehow also had two pair, and my hand held up.

I think this decision comes down to Hero image quite a bit. Can Hero have bottom two/wrap in V's viewpoint? Would Hero handle both AA and run downs the same way? Does Hero always have nuts/monsters when 3-betting post-Flop?

I like side pots, so in my games I'm min-clicking this a lot. I have a high VPiP and the Players would've seen this plenty in the past.

If I'm an unknown then I go through the act of of counting down my chips and separating out the call .. looking at the rest and probably shoving it all in.

I'm fine with CO targeting Fish, but I'm not too keen on letting them into my party without paying a premium to do so. GL

Its funny how that happens sometimes and I think the take away is a reminder that people will always play poker a lot from their emotions rather than logic. This kind of player in that moment is not considering SPR much but is hating having to put in 230bbs with a non nutted hand that he had no attachment to to begin with.

I better correct to slow playing top set is much better on dry boards and you have someone firing into you who you put on a made hand that is in big big trouble versus your holding. Raising obv wises them up, just call and they are potting any blank of which there are many on dry boards. You can end up with stacks and a one-outer situation.