most tilting thread ever. Good things happen if you call the 3bet though in my experience. The 78 helps a tiny bit.

AA78r sucks. Just fold and move with your life. Why are we such fans of forcing ourselves into a marginal spot oop?

Because we like things and people doing things for us and for many of these things we have to give them our own shiny things and to get those shiny things we know we sometimes have to work or something.

Nailed it Wazzzz

I have seen people with a nitty image folding bad aces in that spot (there are way worse aces than aa78 though )
I was not good enough to understand that move at that time and the whole table had a decent laugh after his hand got accidently turned over but for that person it was the correct move.

I would decide to call if you call other double suited/double paired/rundown hands in that situation too.In some cases you would even get a raise behind you and there are several good flops for your hand.

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My thoughts are that if I pot 4b and villain 2 calls, I set up a poor SPR of just over 2 (pot of ~3300 with ~7k behind) and allow him to play perfectly against me with a FACE UP hand that does not flop well. Sometimes villain 1 will call also, but that still leaves an awkward SPR 3-way

Have other hands in ure cold 4 bet range KQJT 5678ds AT98ds and what not so u connect with all board types and ure opponent can't have an uncapped range on a lot flops where as u will be constantly capped at aces ; yes this will increase your variance but it will be profitable and make you much tougher to play against

This is terrible , and so exploitable , ppl can just flat u and raise u on all non high card flops , u wanna haves range of hands that hits all over the board basically paint paint x flops are really good for your whole range , and any non paint flops are realy bad this is still unbalanced. You want to have hands a 4 betting range that contains hands that hit middle and lowing flops too so ure not always check folding 568 or 997 or 34T

lol

Playing to maximize our edge against suboptimal opponents necessitates deviating from 'standard' strategy and always allows our opponents to exploit us, if they both knew our deviated range and how to exploit it.

I'd say 4-betting is profitable. And 87 isnt face up

Check out PPT for how this hand flops vs different ranges.

Yay took a while, but 4betting has another fan

Unlike alot of others, I like flatting here. I don't think flatting gives away your hand at all & if you 4 bet, you're getting called for sure by the 3bettor since he has position. I'd call and play the pot 3 ways oop.

I like shiny things in position personally.

Surely flatting here to balance our range (which would consist of rundowns and 2 pairs almost always) isn't bad. It's just not ideal since we're c/f almost every flop.

The Urubu (4-bet / stack off) has some validity but we'll never end up in a good spot if someone sticks around.

I'm sticking with a fold.

+1. Seems like this forum's gone way downhill. As for the hand, it's the clearest call ever. Thread should have been resolved in like 7 posts with everyone agreeing.

So the clear consensus is always call and always check fold without top set? Seems so obvious now. Like printing money.

Why would we be always c/fing unless we hit top set? If thats your plan then yeah just fold pre

Jesus - folding pre? 450 with 8k left? You have a nit image - how good are you post flop? you have two nut blockers for flushes - they think you are a nit right so when you lead out on a 3 suited board how often are they folding?? With your image I am flatting - Leading out unconnected boards with two of my suit, leading out 1/2 pot size bet when flush hits. USE YOUR IMAGE.

If they are solid players, laying down k high or q high flush against what they perceive as a nit will not be an issue for them. If the flop comes ace high there is zero chance they believe you have aaa.

There is so much opportunity here to make money I just can't see how people think folding is an option. Even if you do call and the flop comes well connected it is a simple fold.

Also, if you don't have any of the above moves in your locker... why/how are you even in this game?

Brilliant Holmes, massive nit, cold flats out of the SB, never has AAxx in his range, in fact it could not be sneakier when you go to war on A high boards, they'll put you on something but will be safe in the knowledge that AAxx is never in your range.

............sigh.

7 pages of almost entirely derailing and we have yet to hear what OP even did. What was result of preflop action as maybe we can discuss continuing on how the hand can be played or did you fold preflop?

As for preflop Im def flat calling here and its not even close***

+1 lets see the turn!