I think I have no idea what I’m doing this hand.

5-5

LAG fish on the BTN straddles. SB folds. I raise to 30 with AA43 with the Ah. Three fish call. BTN also calls.

Flop Kh 5s 2h

Checked to BTN. He pots for 155. I call. Others fold.

Turn Qh

I shove for 440.

It's not necessarily true to say that a lag fish will never fold, nor that we should never try to bluff them, but we should be particularly careful when trying to bluff them. As an example, it's easier to bluff them on the river than on the turn, when they're more apt to shrug their shoulders and say 'I've got outs if I've got top set' or 'I'm ahead if they're playing top set weirdly against my medium flush'. Even though the Qh is like the best heart to hit the turn, a lagfish will still have plenty of raggedy flushes that he's just going to snap you with because it's hard to make a flush. This line will work sometimes and he'll proudly fold top set and say 'you have to have it' and you flash the A hearts just to reassure him that you're not being a weirdo with a lower set or something. But lagfish are usually losing and when they're losing they're not in the mood to fold anything that's better than 2 pair here, unfortunately.

How would you play the nut flush?

In this sitch you "could" play it but imo there's better spots and likely just fold flop but if you play it I "think" repotting flop and running it twice is best option.

Not sure about as it was played but I think it's just plus ev to look for better spots plo becomes harder than it really is in a way when you think about the four card combos to much. Just play tight and wait for more sure spots. They'll def. Come up

Yeah, I definitely think check turn and bluff most rivers if the turn gets checked through is the better way to play it.

I thought it might be a little sinful to just check-fold flop. But it’s a 5-way flop, and I’m not drawing to many nuts. And I have the worst position.

I wonder if a better line on the flop is bet half pot, fold to a raise?

it sounds like you are in the BB or UTG and all the other callers are between you and the button? this matters a lot for your flop decision.

i agree with wazz that the nut blocker play works a lot better, especially against this player type, when you can bet river.

i would probably crai on this flop. the players between you and button should very rarely be able to call given your hand, and you are probably an equity favorite against a LAG fish betting range.

as played, check turn and bluff river is also viable

I think you consistently give some of the worst advice I've read on any forum on 2+2 in the 20 years I've been here. This is circa 2000 level advice.

Do not fold this flop.

If the players are not deep, then preflop straddles make the game no longer even 100bb. Also, I've played in straddle games with a lot of different rules, you preflop raised to $30 but could you have raised it to $40? If so, then for the love of everything decent in the world, raise the max when you are up against players who play particularly loose versus raises after they've straddled. You called the straddle a LAG. If they preflop defend with a bad hand, then great for you. If they preflop re-raise your AAxx, then great for you.

Since there is a preflop straddle and you are not effectively deep, then on the flop, over pairs like yours go up in value especially with backup and blockers. You are the preflop aggressor, even out of position against this many players you should bet the flop this short (and hope to get raised and get it in on the flop). But, and it is a big ass butt, if you bet the flop and get called, then you have to shut down on the turn if the flush comes in. It is difficult to bet 1/2 pot or pot on the flop and then fold on the turn, but it happens. It feels dirty like you never should have bet the flop, but that is not how it works some of time.

As played on flop, your bare ace flush bluff is bad on the turn AND would also be bad on the river in a hand that became short from the beginning because no one was deep with a straddle on. You started the hand with about $625 which is 100bb+ if there is no straddle, but there was straddle. Many players don't fold any type of flush in hands that are around 50bb poker hands. You can't bluff here.

Ummm I’m betting like $120 on the flop and getting it in vs 1 player.

As played, don’t jam turn you already said he’s a fish so he’s not folding a set/flush and you have one pair.

Check turn and see what’s happening, and honestly if he’s a whale, maybe river goes check check.

Also don’t mind check jamming vs button as played.

You have $30 in with a stack of $600. It's not heads up there three other players you all are the antichrist. What's the point of getting involved in the pot?

Heads up or cs two players I could see but vs three players it's not worth it guy has kpkusfd and we are behind

Button is a 'LAG fish' we want to play pots with him. You're right we do have to worry about the other 3 players, so proceed cautiously.

You have 45% equity on flop according to rough sim I did which means you push no equity by check raising all in. Btw I check since OoP to so many players).

On turn he has flush around 35% and a set or flush around 58%.

Potting turn needs to work 50% of the time on FE alone. Your dead if he calls with a flush and you have equity if he calls with a set.

It's up to you to decide if you can get enough folds vs this player type.

I think potting turn is reasonable given the kinds of hands you get to the turn with. What hands do you call the flop that didn't check raise that aren't the nut flush? It might be the case that you have the nuts here most of the time.

So you raised PF but didn't bet your 'nut' flush draw OTF? What do you have? AQQxhh? Nope! This screams of nut flush blocker BS .. You're not all of a sudden pounding a set here, eh? This really comes down to history with the opponent and how seriously they take their Board reading. I probably call with 2-3 pip weaker flushes here than normal.

I agree that V are more prone to call this on Turn than River. I think you are giving your V a lot of 'thinking' credit here, perhaps too much. I think you can get LAGs to fold here, but maybe not LAG Fish. LAGs like to control the betting and you've taken that away from them here, so that's good. It's just that Fish play cards, not poker, and are going to be drawn to the light of a big pot with one card to go.

A classic 'why so much' spot even though it's just for pot. Have you ever EP opened and shown down Ax9y8x7y types of holdings? If so, then hopefully V remembers and your Flop check-float makes more sense.

I probably say that 'your image' is key here too much, but it really is. Folds + live draws needs to be over 50%? Probably close and that may or may not be realistic. GL

Just fold the flop - when someone pots 5-6 ways or whatever it is they're not messing around. On the turn you're now asking him to fold the top of his range - you want to bluff when you people have the middling/lower parts of their range, not the top. If you saw he had KK would you jam here? Don't like this at all - maybe on the turn if you're deeper than you could barrel away but even so I really don't want to challenge strong ranges.

any time someone is making the effort of running sims to analyze a hand on this forum i think that's really cool and helpful, but i think this post would add a lot more to the discussion if you gave us some info about what your assumptions were that got you to these numbers. also, when you say we have 45% on the flop, i assume you mean vs. the assumed ranges of the field? doesn't it matter where the remainder of that equity is distributed and how likely we are to deny it or help people realize it depending on call / raise / fold? or are you just saying we are 45% vs the button's perceived range specifically?

Yeh ill post the details if someone asks, people don’t usually ask

45% was vs BU range only and thats because i was checking to see what equity would be if we check raise (and assuming remaining players fold).

I gave the BU sets, 2p, combo draws, top pair + fd. I also removed some power house hands like top set+combo draw because i assume people might not pot when they crush the board so hard.

Yes, if we choose to call only our equity will decrease when a third player comes along but this is actually ok because they will contribute more money to the pot to compensate.

As played, it sounds like the consensus is to check the turn, maybe shove the river if the turn is checked back.

On the flop, there are strong arguments here for check-fold, check-call, CRAI v. LAG, bet-fold (multi-way), and bet-call v. LAG. This is why I feel like I have no idea what I’m doing when I play PLO…

this sounds pretty reasonable, although i came up with a slightly higher number for hero. but if we have 45% equity jamming 600 with 300 already in the middle, we are +EV with the overlay of the existing pot, even if villain never folds.

i'm not sure i agree that the tradeoff of lower equity for a larger pot with a 3rd player is always positive for us. if we flat and allow another player to enter the pot, we lose a lot of visibility on most turn cards. one or both villains may fold if the straight comes in. what is our plan on board-pairing or flush completing turns? what is our plan for bricks? etc. letting another player in is ok if we have only nut outs and must improve to win, but more of a mixed bag when button can have pair+draw hands and we can sometimes win unimproved, or if the 3rd player can chop on some of our straight outs or even take them away if he has a higher straight draw as part of a marginal combo.