2/2 live PLO with $5 btn straddles
$4200 eff covered by utg+1

We have JJT5ds in the CO
JTd J5c

$5 straddle btn, sb call, bb fold, utg call, utg+1 raise to $30, mp call, hero call, btn call, sb call.

Not sure if this is too wide of a call. I know sb isn't limp reraising so unless btn 3bets we will see a flop. It's double suited but the 5 doesn't connect at all.

Utg+1 will play kind of crazy with a smaller stack size. When he first sat down he was really loose, like I saw him call a $400 all in pre with a weird hand like KT98 single suited. With as much as he has now I haven't seen him spew but he still plays a fair amount of hands.

Flop ($160) 8cJsAc

Checks to utg+1, bets $125, mp calls, hero?

Just call. Way to deep to raise. The problem is not just that he can 3bet you otf but even if he flats it can get iffy because there’s still lots of bad runouts.

You have position and can make excellent decisions vs his barrels

Decision:

Whoops I totally missed you had a fd! I still prefer calling, because it’s non nutted if you raise it just helps you with equity vs AA but it can create some troublesome scenarios when you hit the flush or boat up because you make the pot very large for your non nutted outs.

Additionally flatting keeps all his weaker hands in which people can absolutely barrel too light.

Ott I think this will come down to your reads on this player. Is he very strong here or is he the type to barrel most decent 2ps with equity? I can see either option being good depending on that.

I think theyres a good amount of hands besides aa that can play it this way. 910ja, some type of wrap and fd... I think we are good here most of the time and would raise the turn to $1200 or so. You can just call but I rather make drawing hands pay. Higher risk spot but this deep its a good spot to win a really big pot.

I would just call again ott. His vpips short stacked don't tell us much about his barrels deep. Here he's betting pretty big into big mw fields from OOP x2. What's he usually betting when the texture doesn't change? We have a T, Jc, and another club in hand shading him away from draws but he reasonably has all combos of AA.

The reason I think I disagree with this is because he's OOP vs 3 other people and still firing big. Yeah he has more hands than just AA but AA is possible. He could also have a wrap + fd type of hand. We do hold Jc and a T but that doesn't stop him from still having like you said AJT9 or something. Being this deep I think is more of a reason to flat. We are also OOP to 1 more player. If I raise and get called by both then the flush or straight hits, what now? Can't bet fold the pot is too big. If EP checks and I check then btn jams we could be dead. Same if we bloat the pot then EP jams river.

I just don't like it with the A on the board and the pfr being this agro multiway. He also could know nobody else has AA so he's fine barreling with draws to get folds.

I don't think it's completely wrong to raise, I just think with our holdings and multiway OOP. I lean toward a call instead.

We aren't thrilled to see a club even if it could be good unless action checks through. Probably never betting it if EP checks. Also don't want to see any card that could complete a wrap. So a 7, 9, T, Q, or K. That's a lot of cards to fade.

He's actually OOP vs 3 players on the turn still, so even stronger imo. We block some draws but he could still have them. I think he still bets those as well. He knows we don't have AA since it's always 3bet. He would play AA the same way as the draws.

Decision:

I think this is all very solid reasoning. I agree that besides running into aces ott there is also plenty of trouble if they flat with worse hands because of an enormous pot on a lot of bad rivers. Agree with mostly calling.

Otr I just crying fold. Unless I think he can overplay some weak hand. He lacks natural bluffs, he could easily vbet AA here, there’s still a player behind.

Clubs. Especially clubs with an Ace.

I agree it's suspect for him to bluff 1/3 sizing into two players on the river with this though.

I'd probably call here because my background is limit holdem and I don't like folding getting 4-1 on my bet. I expect to lose most of the time, but I only have to win 1 time in 5.

Just one of those hands where we are holding on for the ride?!

I don't really like the B hanging around on the Turn. We could very well get raised off any range equity we have over UTG1 if the B raises. Based on the bet/H call size I might raise from B and try to get both Players to fold if I don't have a winner already.

Flop fine, Turn fine .. River trouble.

How often are we not getting to Showdown? That's my concern, so the focus now goes to the B, not UTG1.

What about KKxx of flush? Feasible on Flop/Turn but not so much now. Would UTG1 'block' bet AA when an obvious draw comes in. Was UTG1 expecting a raise from either Player on the Turn when they hold a draw?

I like the pot odds, but just don't like the set up. So dependent on the opponents. Do we risk keeping the $750 in lieu of B snap folding also? I think HU I just take my medicine here and call off.

Also .. you moved pretty quickly into the other parts of the hand. May want to wait for more posts before doing so (even in a spoiler box). GL


PS .. In my games the MP could've been disgusted that he folded some sort of 56xx .. lol

He barrelled two streets into two people so his clubs with an ace in it are often going to have two pair so too much sd value

The clubs without an ace are bad bluffs because they massively block the folding range and you need that A blocker

The clubs with an ace without two pair are not very good because they block a lot of folds.

AA however is extremely easy to have for him.

You can see with how people construct their range in reality that they have all the natural value hands but not many good bluffs. Plo is full of situations like this.