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Old 10-03-2010, 12:50 AM   #1
O_TAY
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What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

** SORRY FOR THE WALL OF TEXT **

After a very long hiatus from online poker, I've simply become overwhelmed by the sheer number of tools available to today's online player. Just to give you an idea of what was out there when I last played online, Pokertracker was relatively new and (at least as far as I was aware) coaching sites didn't exist. Coming back into the scene, I find myself just bamboozled as to what tools to begin making use of first.

I've read the "STTF Tools - Software, Videos, & Link Collection" sticky, and definitely looked over a vast majority of the information in that thread. I guess my concern is taking on one (or even multiple) pieces of software that end up distracting me from the games I'm involved in, and hinder rather than help my performance. Valid concern?

Some of what I perceive to be "mainstream" programs also seem to be rather pricey, at least to a new-all-over-again player with a relatively small bankroll. I'm aware most of them have free trial periods, but I don't want to initiate a trial period on software that isn't "initially essential" (if there even is such a thing as an essential program), but could prove to be beneficial down the road.


So, getting back to the title of this thread:
  1. What tools / software have you found highly beneficial to your SNG game and SNG profits?
  2. After trial-period evaluations or recommendations from friends, what software have you chosen to spend your hard earned money on? If all of your SNG-related programs were stripped away today, which ones would you turn right around and buy again?
  3. Hindsight being 20/20, what software would you say was the most beneficial to you in the early stages of your SNG career?


Thanks in advance for any and all opinions and experience you choose to share. Appreciate it!


P.S. I don't know if this matters ... perhaps it will provide a little information about where I'm currently at in the game and what I'm working with. After a little bit of dabbling around at different stakes and formats I seem to have settled in on $3.40 SNGs on Stars, primarily playing STTs with a few 2&3 table games of the same stakes mixed in. I've doubled my original bankroll in just about a weeks time, from $100 to $200. The only software I'm currently using is the trial version of Hold'em Manager.
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Old 10-03-2010, 01:05 AM   #2
sippin_criss
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I would pay lots and lots of $ for SNGWiz, HEM, and Hjalper is also a very nice tool for playing a lot of tables at once.
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Old 10-03-2010, 01:09 AM   #3
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

early stages: sngwiz
without sng wiz you have no chance of becoming a winning player unless you naturally have a feel for push shove

good things to know: pokerstove. if you've been playing holdem for a while it's not too useful, but it's just for basic equity knowledge for your hand against ranges / other hands

pretty much essential: holdem manager
follow your own stats, hud (people play without hud but personally i feel like i'd make a lot more mistakes if i was playing 16 tables, if i accidentally identified an opponent wrongly and played badly against him/her)

things to avoid: tableninja
i think tableninja is unnecessary, i mean clicking is usually ok, but (for me at least) tableninja has f'd up a couple times and bet / called when i didn't want it to. i've heard other people having the same troubles, other people having tableninja be fine, but in general i like to take the minimal risk in making unnecessary mistakes
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Old 10-03-2010, 01:19 AM   #4
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I just got back into poker a few months ago with a focus on SNG's. After much discussion and deliberation, this is what I ended up buying:

Holdem Manager (has a HUD which I find useful, especially when multi-tabling, also tracks your stats so you can see how you are doing)

Sit N Go Wizard - Fantastic for reviewing hands, learning ICM, and push fold situations (I review hands in this after almost every session)

Table Ninja - (makes playing many tables very easy, it uses hot keys on your key board or game pad *I have a belkin N52TE*)

I also have a membership at Deuces Cracked, they have great staff, and great video's which you can download and use on your Iphone.

If you are not playing, or don't play on playing more than 4 tables then you don't need table ninja, and also Holdem Manager might be something to wait on as well.

Best of luck,
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Old 10-03-2010, 01:26 AM   #5
WhiteRabbito
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

haven't tried hjalper - think i ought to look into it seeing as sippin criss uses it lol

i pretty much couldn't live without table ninja or pt3 (i could live with holdem manager instead of pt3 but not with neither)(pt3 is pokertracker 3 btw). i use the hud of course which is super useful for playing many tables, quickly identify fish by their stats. i play up to 20 tables at a time,and use tableninjas features of hotkeys (a, s ,d ,f for raise, call, fold/check and all-in, respectively, and pretermined pot bet ammount hotkeys for 30% 50%, 75% and 100% of pot with keys q,w ,e ,r respectively), auto bet sizing (not always), and also spacebar to set a table away from my stacks (i play with four stacks)

don't think i could play anywhere near as many tables as i do now without tableninja for hotkeys.. so its essential for me. if you only plan to play fewer tables u prob don't need it.

sngwiz(or equivalent) is necesary for improving ur game, review sessions etc, and pretty much necesary to become good at sngs.

pokerstove is good and free, shows ur equity in a hand vs a range of hands opp. could have (or a specific hand)

but yeah the only essential one is either pt3 or hem i think.

coaching sites are good too, but can be expensive, i just bought membership at cardrunners and find the vids super useful. i think u can even get it for free if u play x ammount at fulltilt.

but yeah... good luck and welcome back to the online grind
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Old 10-03-2010, 03:11 AM   #6
kamel
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

As others said, SnGWizard is a must. I'd add http://www.holdemresources.net as a free NashEquilbrium-Tool.
If you used PT2, that's still o.k., I also still use it, if you don't have it, buy HoldemManager as others said.

I'd be skeptical of coaching sites, for at least concerning SnGs. Better to read Mathematics of Poker/Kill everyone and a postflop cash game book (maybe the new Harrington on OnlinePoker-Book, haven't read it, so dunno). In doubt, DanielNegreanu's PowerHoldem is pretty good for SnGs, allthough it was written for other purposes. Nowadays, you need to play postflop unless you want be a rakeback pro. Would read most high stakes discussion of this forum in addition, should give a grasp of what's going on.

The most important tool, you already have:

In contrast to some years ago, nowadays you also need it for SnGs.

Good luck
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Old 10-03-2010, 12:17 PM   #7
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

A reliable internet connection ftw.
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Old 10-03-2010, 12:19 PM   #8
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

In order of priority:

1. Holdem Manager
2. SNG Wizard
3. AHK Scripts

To be fair 1 and 2 are so close, I wouldn't like to play without either now, although I guess if I had to choose to ditch one now, I'd ditch wiz, just because I've done most of my learning with it, wheras HEM will be necessary for ever, and as edges decrease HEM will become more and more important. And 3 would make it very difficult for me to more than 10-table without.
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Old 10-03-2010, 03:29 PM   #9
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I agree with the above, HEM, SNG WIZ, Ninja(or substitute), Stove is nice or more advanced thinking, your brain is also an excellent tool for all stages, and my other big recommendation is shutting off all other programs on your computer while playing especially skype/aim, they interfere with the brain.

Sippin, apart from you promoting Hjalper and being on their home page. What makes it better than Ninja? From what I briefly read the only feature it has that ninja doesn't really is the counter of how many tables are open. Does it have other features also that would make it worth switching too?
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Old 10-03-2010, 04:01 PM   #10
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manhat10ite View Post
I agree with the above, HEM, SNG WIZ, Ninja(or substitute), Stove is nice or more advanced thinking, your brain is also an excellent tool for all stages, and my other big recommendation is shutting off all other programs on your computer while playing especially skype/aim, they interfere with the brain.

Sippin, apart from you promoting Hjalper and being on their home page. What makes it better than Ninja? From what I briefly read the only feature it has that ninja doesn't really is the counter of how many tables are open. Does it have other features also that would make it worth switching too?
im also curious. does hjalper auto populate the bet box? (super useful imo)
or have something similiar to TN's SnG Sensei?
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Old 10-04-2010, 08:20 PM   #11
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I use SNGPT which is great. Is SNGWiz better in some respects? Like in SNGPT you can pick the hands in the range but in SNGWiz you have those nice graphs and stuff
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Old 10-04-2010, 08:21 PM   #12
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xznv View Post
I use SNGPT which is great. Is SNGWiz better in some respects? Like in SNGPT you can pick the hands in the range but in SNGWiz you have those nice graphs and stuff
Either is fine imo. Wiz has more bells and whistles, but I like the simplicity of SNGPT myself.
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Old 10-04-2010, 08:37 PM   #13
Master999
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I use this when 16 to 20 tabling :

1- PT3
2- Tableninja
3- Sng Wiz
4- Sharkscope or pokerprolabs

I think all of these alow me to play a lot more tables than I normally would. Its pretty simple, the only actions I have to do while playing are playing poker. I dont have to register to tournaments or to go through hands to see how players played different hands. I think these are musts, but I guess some other programs can be usefull.

I have Pokerstove and Hold'em ranger but don't really use them that much.
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Old 10-04-2010, 08:59 PM   #14
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manhat10ite View Post
Sippin, apart from you promoting Hjalper and being on their home page. What makes it better than Ninja? From what I briefly read the only feature it has that ninja doesn't really is the counter of how many tables are open. Does it have other features also that would make it worth switching too?
Not sure what the hjalper site having a quote from me has to do with anything, and I've never used TN, but I basically had it with the way I had my AHK scripts setup. Hjalper is easier on the wrists, I'm sure it will happen eventually, but for the time being I can't see how there could be anything better for a mass multitabler. A big thing was that it didn't steal focus as tables were loading, but Stars fixed that up anyways.
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:08 PM   #15
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Sipps forgets to mention he uses it to use an xbox controller. Tbale ninja is probably better than hjalper for us mousies
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:43 PM   #16
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

You use it with an xbox controler, how do you setup your buttons, I have been planing on doing that for a while. Do you use the triggers to up/down bets. Could I do the same with TN ??? thanks for info im really interested !!!
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:52 PM   #17
O_TAY
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I appreciate all of you taking the time to reply with your opinions and experiences. Your input has helped calm my mind and thin the field from dozens and dozens of options down to a select few, at least for the beginner. HEM (and to a lesser extent PT3) and SNGWiz seem to be the two "must-haves", with some form of table manager also being a highly beneficial tool.

I've got 7 days left on my HEM trial period before it expires, so I reckon I'll be making that my first purchase. SNGWiz has a nice 30 day trial period, so I'll be downloading that tonight and putting it to good use. As I've only been back on the scene for less than two weeks, I'm trying to take it slow and not get involved in so many tables at once that I get overwhelmed and unnecessarily bleed money as a result of more action than I can attend to. Playing a maximum of 4 tables at once (for now), I believe I'll hold off on Hjalper or Table Ninja until I feel comfortable tackling more tables.

One more thing I did want to discuss:
As I mentioned in my original post, I'm working with a pretty small bankroll for the time being (though hopefully not for long!). With an original buy-in of $100 just over a week ago to a current roll of $200 today, programs like HEM and SNGWiz are pretty substantial purchases. I can delay buying the full version of HEM for a week and the full version of SNGWiz for a month by taking full advantage of the trial periods, but at $90 and $100 respectively, this software certainly isn't "cheap".

- In your opinion, are these the types of purchases that will pay for themselves in spades if used effectively? Are these the types of purchases that a serious player can't afford to not make?

Thanks again guys!
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:58 PM   #18
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

they are worth it and will pay back really quickly... then you can get serious
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Old 10-04-2010, 10:08 PM   #19
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

I 20 - 24 table DONs and find the following useful:

1) HEM, for obvious reasons.
2) SNG WIZ, for obvious reasons.
3) Table Ninja, because I play 20 - 24 tables and Ninja makes it much easier. I can play 24 tables with Ninja as easily as playing 12 without. I use Ninja to move tables around, have mouse shortcuts for bet, call, fold, shove, etc., auto close tourneys, keep new tourneys from stealing focus, auto click time button, etc. It also has a SNG opener and a ton of other features. Bottom line it is completely worth the $60. Sure, you can use some free programs to do SOME of the things you can do in Ninja, but not all of them, and not so smoothly.
4) AllSnap-- I use this to move tables from stacks into tiling. Makes it easy to line the tables up.
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Old 10-04-2010, 10:46 PM   #20
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Master999 View Post
You use it with an xbox controler, how do you setup your buttons, I have been planing on doing that for a while. Do you use the triggers to up/down bets. Could I do the same with TN ??? thanks for info im really interested !!!

Word, I just made a small change to the defaults to make the sb/bb up down increments made by the crosspad, left joystick toggles between tables, clicking left joystick brings up table with action, X is fold, Y is check/call, B is raise, RB + B is all in. It's always fun.
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Old 10-04-2010, 10:55 PM   #21
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

nice, thanks for quick reply. im gonna buy one tomorrow I think... haha cant wait for it !
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Old 10-04-2010, 11:00 PM   #22
AdamHeaney
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Only use pokerprolabs and obviously the brain, seems to work well!
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Old 10-04-2010, 11:24 PM   #23
WhiteRabbito
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sippin_criss View Post
Word, I just made a small change to the defaults to make the sb/bb up down increments made by the crosspad, left joystick toggles between tables, clicking left joystick brings up table with action, X is fold, Y is check/call, B is raise, RB + B is all in. It's always fun.
can hjalper auto-populate bet box with preset ammounts, ala table ninja?
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Old 10-05-2010, 01:31 AM   #24
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Are there still situations where SNGPT (Sit N Go Power Tools) is more helpful than SNG Wizard?
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Old 10-05-2010, 02:05 AM   #25
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Re: What are your "indispensable" SNG tools?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteRabbito View Post
can hjalper auto-populate bet box with preset ammounts, ala table ninja?
No, you can only do it with sb increments, which I guess is the only real problem I can see with it, although it's not a very big deal. There are times where I'd rather bet 2.25bb but if it's that important you can take the extra 2 seconds and type it in.
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