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How big of a mistake was this? How big of a mistake was this?

04-26-2020 , 03:41 PM
I'm not too familiar with these spots, but my gut is telling me I should be a lot tighter.

5 people remaining
top 4 get paid
I'm second in chips (14BB)
There are 2 short stacks at the table with 4BB each

Folds around to HERO in the SB. BB is chip leader.

HERO has K4o

Shoving looks to be about +0.73bb but because of all the short stacks and the fact we're on the bubble, is this just a fold?

Thanks
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04-27-2020 , 05:48 AM
Big mistake mate. You're shoving with a trash hand against the only one who can bust you out.
This play is +chip EV but is strongly - $ EV imo
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04-27-2020 , 06:55 AM
These spots are math based, you cant run them without posting stack of the chipleader and mention stack of the 5th guy
if its 40-30-20-10 payout for example if chip leader has 16 bb, other guy 10bb, you can push 32o if he calls with 99+ AKo, AQs, however if he calls few% wider, you have to cut like 90% :P
It just depends on stacks and how you perceive your opponent (if he is capable player and will know his maths to lay down some 'sexy' hands like A9o etc)


if its a low stakes game and he isnt a great reg and his stack is bigger, its a fold (how big of a mistake, dunno without all info)

Last edited by dybboss; 04-27-2020 at 07:12 AM.
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04-27-2020 , 08:33 AM
I don't think this is a mistake per se. As dybboss has already stated we can jam any2 here if BB is good/tight and is not calling stuff like A7o (obviously depends on the exact stack sizes but assuming stacks of 8/4/4/14/18).

Even if we might not want to shove 100% here I think we can still shove 50% pretty comfortable without reads. 50% would (barely) contain K4o so I think this is totally fine. Just keep in mind that our range tightens really quickly even if BB only calls a couple of hands more than he should.
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05-02-2020 , 02:49 PM
if there are 2 small stacks and 2 big stack then your shove is much wider.
K4 is perfect jam when big stack has 11bb as well-he can basically call with 99+
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05-02-2020 , 05:03 PM
Big stack has not 11 BB, he has at least 15BB and the two short stacks are going to bust in no time. I strongly disagree with shoving such a hand.

It would be interesting if we could ICMize it. OP, could you provide us some info about payouts and chipleader's stack size?
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07-17-2020 , 02:48 PM
I don't shove here, we don't how deep stack the CL BB is but our 14BB is deep enough to wait for a better hand or the 2 short stacks bursted.
If I am in a good mood, I might open 2-2.5BB here.
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07-20-2020 , 02:37 AM
As someone else noted there's way too much relevant info missing to answer definitely. Actual stack sizes are key as are actual players tendencies. What percentage of hands is BB going to call off against your shove?
With 14bb K4o is definitely going to a be a shove sometimes on the bubble blind v blind. You should be shoving a lot lighter in some spots. The rule of thumb for these situations is shove light and call off very tight.
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