a big part of my realization that the desire to get ****faced is hugely driven by my perception of where my life is (in many regards) compared to others or where I think I should be. Just need to be comfortable in my own skin and where I actually am at. Thinking that calms my desires. Not totally erases them, but definitely calms them. I know it'll be a huge challenge next time I play the comparison game in my head.

Comparison of self with others is the absolute worst thing you can do in life. I think a lot of the pains of modern life are driven by constant exposure to people succeeding beyond the bounds of what is possible for normal people. Celebrities, sporting stars, Nobel Prize winners, and then even Facebook feeds tend to be the Greatest Hits of everyone's lives, like you don't see the 300 days a year they're living a suburban nightmare, you see their super awesome 7 day holiday.

Desire is the root of suffering.

Unfortunately, this modern life we've created is centered around messages of success and excess, consumption and ambition.

Buddah knew what's up.

I don't think I can eliminate desire. I've tried that and for me it leads to a grey, colorless existence. It also interferes with my ability to be useful to others imo. It's the attachment to desire / the things I desire that I can work on. Basic serenity prayer stuff: accept the things I cannot change. Fear is similar. I don't think I can eliminate it, but I can seek courage to abide it.

Attempting to manage my life so that nothing in my environment frightens me, bothers me, makes me envious, etc, is actually what I've been doing and it sucks. It's this line of thinking that leads me to browsing RVs on Craigslist that I could live in, alone, in the desert. Ultimately I'm trying to eliminate my self. Given enough rope (play on words intended!) I will end up literally eliminating myself. Instead, I wish to be released from the bondage of self, so that I may continue to exist without all this stuff dragging me down.

I work on that and I don't think that it sucks. It was huge for me to eliminate few fears. I mean.... I am still an emotional being. A lot of things do bother me. And I do have desires and aspirations, but they are so not in a material area. May be the answer to this is kind of more differentiated than to eliminate all desires.

I remember discussing with one very good friend at a tender age around 20 the question, how should we live. The answer given then was: "Juicy, without fear, reaching for the stars, to the full". I still believe it and work on that. It is clearly difficult to live juicy if you did let go of all emotions. But it is also impossible to be reaching for the stars if you fear to fall down.

To be clear, I'm not talking about being in an emotional place where the things in my environment don't bother me. I'm talking about managing the environment to eliminate all the things that do or could bother me. THAT'S what doesn't work for me. Because even when I'm successful, I'm leading a tiny life. I'm having NO fun at all. And the most important current issue: it makes it really really hard to be married, both for me and for my wife.

But you're right, it's a balance. Some element of ordering my life to reduce friction is great. But I'm an all-or-nothing kind of guy. This is another area where I need to learn to live in the grey.

-- Adyashanti

Hi I have been struggling with the hard to beat combination of alcoholism depression and grief. Hearing your wife whisper "I'm terrified " when she is dying of cancer is not easy to come to terms with.My family have just found out just how ill I am and are trying to sort out a program to get me through this . Wish me luck

Good luck, and I'm so sorry you have to deal with this.

I recently completed a court-ordered alcohol abuse evaluation (two or three, really, but the third one didn't recommend treatment). .... So that was six months of sessions and doctors and counselors and groups, resulting from a dwi.

The last doctor I saw (psychiatrist specializing in substance abuse) told me something that I didn't really agree with, but i'd like to know what others think: He told me there are essentially three different kinds of drinkers: Social, Problem and Alcoholic. And he said a problem drinker could revert back to a social drinker, but it was harder/or not possible for an alcoholic to do that.

That seems a little too simplified to ring true, but does it sound right to ppl in this thread?

Yes. It's a simplification and there is no generally agreed upon definition of "alcoholic", but there are certainly some people who can drink socially again and others who have no hope of doing so.

As an extreme example, I took 3 months off drinking in 2016/17. At the time I quit I had what's called "cue reactivity", where the sight of alcohol would provoke a strong desire to get drunk. When I came back to drinking I found that had largely gone, and I could have a beer and then stop without exertion. So, that worked out for me.

But on the other end of the scale, I know a guy in Melbourne who descended into alcoholism, went to rehab and ended up in AA. Unlike me, this guy was a "type 2" alcoholic, would do stuff like get into fights drunk, frequent blackouts, that sort of thing. After I think it was 9 months sober, he went to lunch with his son and was like "you know what, **** it, I'm going to have a beer". So he did. And then he woke up a day and a half later with a total blackout of the intervening period. I think it's pretty obvious that that guy can never drink socially. He doesn't need more time, a better attitude, medication or whatever, he needs to stay well away from alcohol.

Whether that's a fundamental difference between me and him, or whether he was further down the slope than I was when we did something about our problems, I don't know. I'm guessing it's a bit of both. There do seem to be some behavioural correlates to whether you can make it back or not and, unsurprisingly, one of them seems to be that "once I get started, I can't stop" thing. My problem is less that and more that if I don't exert any self control, I will simply drink to excess every night. But the idea that I'm in danger of being arrested, or having full on blackouts, or whatever, that's just never been my deal.

Meant to reply to Rebelp. Good luck man. Sounds like you're in for a fight but you'll get there.

Thanks Chris.

I am so sorry for what you are going through and wish you all the luck. If you choose to take this route, I can tell you that in AA you will find people who will love you and support you and listen to absolutely anything and everything you want or need to say. I hope you will find some relief.

Like Chris said, it's an over-simplification, but basically accurate. To add to what he said, an alcoholic is not just someone who "doesn't need more time, a better attitude, medication or whatever, he needs to stay well away from alcohol", it's someone who very well knows all that and still drinks again anyway (which sounds like it describes the guy in his story). A problem drinker might really need to stop altogether because of the consequences involved, and then they do so and their life gets better because alcohol was the problem. IMO when an alcoholic stops drinking without additional support, his life gets worse because alcohol wasn't really the problem - the problem was alcoholism. Take away the alcohol and you still need to treat the ism.

Can you please explain this more fully? Are you saying 1 beer knocked him out for a day and a half - surely this isn't possible? Or you are saying that 1 beer led to enough to knock him out for that long?

Yeah, he went on a bender. Several weeks later, he did it again. Ex wife got a call from him and organised him a trip to hospital. He went back to rehab and I think has rejoined AA. I'm not close with him so not sure where he's at.

This is one of the saddest/scariest things I have ever read here. Heart goes out to you and your wife.

Hi all, quick update for anyone interested.My family had arranged to sort out a plan, however things changed when I caught acute tonsillitis.This caused me to Vomit immediately after drinking anything.After 24 hours of no fluids and sweating profusely I went to the hospital.Unfortunatly I was misdiagnosed (vomiting + alcohol withdrawal) and I was going to be discharged with some anti-sickness drugs.
However one of the nurses looked at me and said “there is something wrong here”
She called the senior consultant, and minutes later I was in resus having ECGs and IV fluids.
At one point I overheard the staff say “Do a bladder scan, we may have to insert a catheter “
After the scan the nurse said to me that my bladder was full but I was not peeing.She gave me a bottle, and of course I peed as hard as I f****ing could, so that unpleasantness was avoided.
I spent a week in hospital until my blood results were OK, during which they used Librium to control my withdrawal symptoms (They were still awful BTW)
Since coming home I am still drinking about 3 cans of beer in the evening in order to help me to sleep, however I am in contact with alcohol support services and intend to go dry ASAP.
I honestly believe that nurse saved my life.
Good luck everybody

Glad to hear you made it through man. Do you have health insurance / a way to get into a rehab?

Hi, we have considered rehab as an option if necessary. At the moment my mood is much better, not drinking a little of vodka a day may have something to do with this.
My family are currently checking up on me everyday.
My wife had a very serious alcohol problem at one point (she would drink a pint of vodka in about five minutes).She went dry for a year and then managed to go to the occasional drink at weekends or on holidays.She kept this up even when she knew that she was dying,so I am trying to use this for inspiration.

survived the craziest bach party I could imagine in vegas. glad i went, wish i had kept it more under control, but at least i didn't end up in as bad of a place as i've been so many times before. The fear definitely kept me from pushing it past the edge. I still probably went harder than most of the guys in the crew.

Haven’t posted in this thread in years, checking in to say I celebrated 22 years in March. Been going to a ton of meetings since we moved back to NYC last week and it feels great. Don’t quit before the miracle happens.

That's awesome man, I'm so happy for you. I really hope I'm saying the same things when I'm 22, because I really don't think I'm not going to need it anymore!

Wow nice one, congrats brian.


I've been going really well for a month or so, but was going to a 3 day music festival so bought a ton of booze to prepare (spirits were a bad choice...).

Naturally, smashed the lot pretty much straight away and was very sick the days running up to the festival.

Festival was amazing, but spent a ton of money at the bars.

I kept 'in control' (probably because I was only drinking beers), but definitely wasn't drinking 'normally'.

Back on the horse I guess.