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Had a pretty bad first date with the 5'11 woman. I went into it not in the right state of mind and couldn't gather my thoughts the whole time. Just had a 90 minute conversation that went nowhere. She was trying her damnedest too. I slowly became more and more aware of how poorly I was steering the ship, and never regained control.

She was even hotter in person so bleh.

I feel you're getting a second chance

try again coordi, much more interesting to hear tales of failure turned into something than these easy ass first dates where everything goes smoothly

Totally agree here.

Occasionally I would meet girls for a first meeting for a FWB date where I knew I had no interest in anything serious so I would go in with the mindset that I'd be way more aggro than my normal dates. More kino, more flirting, directing the convo towards sex when the opportunity seemed right. If I didn't at least get a kiss close at the end of the date, then I would just move on. And if there was a kiss close, then the 2nd date would almost always be me meeting them close to my place and then heading up to my apartment.

One could argue that I probably should have kept a similar aggro mentality for all my dates, but in general I'm a bit too passive. However, for the FWB dates I was able to convince myself that I only had this one shot and either I would succeed or move on to the next girl, so I might as well take my best shot.

Hope you at least recognized it with her, sometimes it be that way and getting it out there can possibly earn you another shot.

Take her to see dave attell this weekend, i find trying to quickly move on from a bad first date is better than giving her time to assess just how bad the date was.

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That may be, but she went out with me last Saturday and she's going out with me a week from Saturday, and hopefully sometime in between. Saturday night isn't friendzone. On Tuesday, she joke texted "you are making your way to my heart." She also has not shied away from any physical contact I've tried. And even though I was unsure of her receptiveness when I tried escalating physical contact last time out, she responded to it by having more correspondence with me than ever this week. She also amusingly sent me an instagram post my friend I had been complaining to about her sent me earlier in the day from an account on things overheard in LA. It was a guy complaining about a Russian girl who won't text him back no matter what he tries. She said apparently it's a common phenomenon in LA with a laugh, showing she is self-aware. But she actually does always text me back these days.

But I agree, I have not been aggressive enough, and maybe that's because I've had difficulty reading her. Next time out, I will be more aggressive. I'm not going to push for it all unless the signs are there, but I'm going to make my intentions clear (I'm sure she knows them already). If this is a reset as has been said, this will be our second date. If she's not receptive to my advances next week, I move on. But a pity bang sounds great!

I've had good results from telling a girl hey sorry I didn't make a move or acknowledging the fact that the vibe was a little weird and didn't seem normal, so this is actually solid advice.

Unfortunately she flat rejected me so there will be no second chances

Edit: 2p2 gets the strangest astroturfers

Edit2: as a small consolation prize I did match with a 4-9 Korean girl who graduated from law school and we're supposed to be getting together Sunday for a drink

My female best friend at work told me about a guy she had been friends with since college (~10 years) - hadn't hung out in a year - saw her post about having not gone ice skating in forever on IG. He drove down from NYC to Boston, got a hotel in the city (so min. $400), took her ice skating and to dinner, drove her around the city, and when she was getting out of the car to go into her apartment, told him she was moving to the West Coast in 3 months. No moves were made.

The next day - he calls her at 9am, and tells her he's been in love with her this whole time. She told him she had no idea, and that he's a really nice guy, but doesn't feel that way about him. She told me she really had no idea he was into her, and was just in her own world, believing he had no ulterior motives. My head near exploded at the end of this story.

Long story short - if a woman is not particularly self-aware - any night can be a friendzone night

It's odd how women can be so perceptive in some ways and so oblivious in others. I feel like in general women really compartmentalise their behaviour according to the setting. EG, if she is in work mode getting her out of that mindset takes some doing. And in your example, getting her out of the friendzone mindset is even tougher. I was on a work trip with this cute pr girl a few years ago and I asked her out on a date just before we parted ways. There was a light flirty vibe throughout the day but on me asking she turned bright purple and started spluttering like this was the last thing on earth she expected me to do. Possibly there's a link to women's higher levels of agreeableness making them less likely to deviate from behaviour that is generally deemed appropriate for a given social setting?

On the other hand if a woman is round at mine it's been a theme that she always seems to be sniffing around for signs of other women (when there have been); why are they so goddamn perceptive when it comes to that???

In this respect dating apps are a godsend for me because I've never been that good at getting dates 'out and about', and with apps the subtext that it's a date is defined loud and clear before any meetups happen

LOLHIM

Couldn't agree more about the apps. A big concept in PUA/cold approach is creating a man to woman conversation, ie: non-plutonic, and it's something I've always struggled with. Apps give implied consent to start off more aggressive

+3, those were big weaknesses of mine as well. I suppose I could have gradually worked on them and gotten better, but online dating was a nice shortcut that cut out a lot of the stuff I'm bad at.

I'm gonna have to go back to hitting on women the old fashioned creepy way soon. These apps just seem broken to me. I swipe right on dozens if not hundreds of women every single day and I get a match like once every week and a half and it's someone that is hardly a match and isn't even that close to where I live. I could spend an afternoon at grocery stores and malls and hit on a couple dozen chicks. I'll probably start that again when the weather warms in a month or two.

Sucks though because I was hoping to find someone successful for a meaningful relationship but I really have no clue how to approach women like that IRL and I'll probably go back to barrio chicks instead.

DC,

I thought you were a successful but homely man, who only swipes on very attractive women. Not getting matches shouldn't be that surprising.

You'd definitely do better in real life. It's weird that being an actual human who exists in the real world and is successful that you don't know where to meet other people who are similar to yourself. Truly weird. You should probably put more thought into that. Surely you have some knowledge of what such a woman would be like, and could figure out what sorts of locations or activities would make you likely to share space with them so you can hit on them.

Bazar.

[Long story short - if a woman is not particularly self-aware - any night can be a friendzone night]

This right here, except self awareness isn't needed as a condition.


[On the other hand if a woman is round at mine it's been a theme that she always seems to be sniffing around for signs of other women (when there have been); why are they so goddamn perceptive when it comes to that???]

What always bugged me is once you stop pursuing them they get all weird and somewhat jealous when they see you with another woman.

Even if they have no interest in you, it seems they still want the idea of you paying more attention to them than other women.

It used to be somewhat amusing because usually i would try to bang one of their friends as pettiness for getting rejected and more times than it should, it would work.

The best times were when they were roomies and I'd rail the ugly fat friend til she couldn't see straight, making sure to be as noisy as possible or get caught boning in the living room.

They weren't always fat/ugly but that's usually the one's that were easy to get.






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I've never heard the word homely used to describe a man. Anyways, I only swipe right on women I'm attracted to. If a woman is not obese and doesn't look like she could be my mom then there is a pretty decent shot I'll swipe right on her. I don't think you are understanding how the women on Hinge looked. It's as if Bumble rejected their bottom 10% of daters and sent them all to Hinge. The vast majority of women were grossly overweight. I am not overweight, so why should I be forced to date someone who is?

On Bumble I'm swiping right on a ton of women.

I've never met someone that is like myself. Never ever in my entire life. I'm definitely unique.


Pretty sure women like that are working all the time. If they are out somewhere it's probably somewhere I have no desire to be.

As I stated before, these dating apps like Bumble are just Hot or Not 2.0. They do a good job of facilitating dates and to a lesser extent sex, but not long term meaningful relationships. There is a long history of ugly men having beautiful partners but these apps do nothing to facilitate that. It's like we are moving into a world where the hotties are trying to find something meaningful with Ted Bundy and Andrew Cunanan rather than Billy Joel and Gianni Versace.

If those ugly people weren't attracting hotties with their money or power then they almost definitely were oozing with charisma. You show manic spurts of what could potentially be charisma, so I wouldn't say it's completely hopeless

DC, if you're comfortable with it, pm me your profile and I'll give you some honest and non trolling feedback

I would also use homely & successful to describe you based upon your posting here as well, cit was not trolling

Ted Bundy do slay the pussy, yo.

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might want to point out those spurts because I just can't see it, he just comes off as a very weird uninteresting/annoying kind of way

if anything I'd say his best shot is probably to talk as little as possible and work on just looking confident... without talking

Successful women aren't always working, but you are right that most are busy. They still have time to go to the gym, yoga, grab a drink, etc. You mentioned moving to a nicer area, so I assume that you will find successful, attractive women at the gym or even the grocery store. I think you said you rarely drink, but even occasionally grabbing a drink or a bite at the bar of a nice place and you should be able to find a few prospects.

I am genuinely curious about what you think single people do with their free time that you have no desire to also do.

I understand why people think this, but I'm not sure it's true. Maybe it's a bit more casual than match or eharmony (I'm not sure if those sites still have a good user base anymore). There are certainly a lot of people who swipe with no real intention of meeting someone irl. A place like match or eharmony (or maybe another site) which requires you to pay in order to communicate with someone may increase the chances of matching with a woman more serious about finding a partner. Those sites also have a more extensive profile and aren't always just matching based off of looks.

I agree with coordi. Most of the average/ugly men that have beautiful partners do so by having money or are funny/charming and fun to be around. You not wanting to be in social situations will limit your chances.

Being open to travel can also be attractive to women. If you do travel or would like to, then I would maybe highlight that in your profile or in real life.

Its a guy dressed up like a Sheila!

Piggybacking off this, I've recently had the epiphany that it's pretty important to have hobbies that women are actually interested in (but that you also have a genuine interest in). I've been spending most of my free time playing poker the last few years, and I love it, but I'm planning to spend a little less time on it this year and more time on wine tasting, volunteering with a dog fostering organization, etc.

year 2020 where girls will add you on snapchat and send nude selfies and random times while they play with their toys/themselves but never able to meet up. im unlucky and doing something wrong in the process apparently since getting stuck and not progressing