Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Other Other Topics Discussion of arts & entertainment, pop culture, food & drink, health and exercise, fashion, relationships, work, and just about anything else in life except poker, sports, religion and politics.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-14-2019, 11:30 PM   #701
ScreaminAsian
For President
 
ScreaminAsian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: DO NOT CONGRATULATE
Posts: 33,266
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrChesspain View Post
Or nerds who watch GoT, which is the only reason I can see for that Clarke woman having made it out of the opening round.
the craziest thing about clarke is, if you actually watch the show, she gets less sexy year over year. so for her to be in this competition now? it's like, wtf show are you even watching? did you see the terminator movie she was in? 3 more months off her diet and melissa mcarthy is beating her out for roles. but that ****in game of thrones, they ****ed up so big hiring her, cause they're stuck with her, she knew she was definitely making it to the end so she's like, "no more topless scenes, and i'm not gonna stay thin anymore, forcing you to awkwardly shoot me any time i'm wearing less than full plate armor". **** her
ScreaminAsian is offline  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:42 PM   #702
Howard Treesong
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Howard Treesong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In for the long con!
Posts: 14,340
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScreaminAsian View Post

here's what real collusion would look like: tons of nominations for different candidates, flooding the pool of contestants making the contest unplayable due to being surrounded by political people who were only put up as a goof

Youíre smart enough to make better arguments than this straw man. Lektorís objection is to politics posters dunning their threads with requests trolling this contest and then seeing many more votes cast in the AOC brackets than any other. Those facts create at least an inference of a problem.

You can frame the problem differently, but some other process foul isnít what Lektor is trying to address.

Nor is the Ivanka/Lahren point relevant. Nobody ó literally nobodyó is objecting to AOC being in the contest. Itís that universally left politics posters are pulling in voters from other forums and asking them to troll the contest, along with their projective masturbation bull**** and racism accusations.

I suspect youíre trolling with all this, but at least some of it seems sincere. Plus you nominated Sara Calixto last year, so you have that going for you.
Howard Treesong is offline  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:46 PM   #703
Howard Treesong
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Howard Treesong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In for the long con!
Posts: 14,340
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScreaminAsian View Post
the craziest thing about clarke is, if you actually watch the show, she gets less sexy year over year. so for her to be in this competition now? it's like, wtf show are you even watching? did you see the terminator movie she was in? 3 more months off her diet and melissa mcarthy is beating her out for roles. but that ****in game of thrones, they ****ed up so big hiring her, cause they're stuck with her, she knew she was definitely making it to the end so she's like, "no more topless scenes, and i'm not gonna stay thin anymore, forcing you to awkwardly shoot me any time i'm wearing less than full plate armor". **** her


Iím with you on this issue. Iím not a big Clarke fan, although I did think her season one performance was rather better than the rest of the series. Other than her, they did a fine job casting that show: Tyrion, Jaime, Cersei, Tywin, Theon and several others were perfect for their roles.
Howard Treesong is offline  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:49 PM   #704
Grue
Pooh-Bah
 
Grue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: https://unstuckpolitics.com
Posts: 5,667
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScreaminAsian View Post
the craziest thing about clarke is, if you actually watch the show, she gets less sexy year over year. so for her to be in this competition now? it's like, wtf show are you even watching? did you see the terminator movie she was in? 3 more months off her diet and melissa mcarthy is beating her out for roles. but that ****in game of thrones, they ****ed up so big hiring her, cause they're stuck with her, she knew she was definitely making it to the end so she's like, "no more topless scenes, and i'm not gonna stay thin anymore, forcing you to awkwardly shoot me any time i'm wearing less than full plate armor". **** her
The. ****. Is. This?

At the very least she went nude, again, in season 6 which was like 2 years ago. I'm so sad I know this
Grue is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:03 AM   #705
BluffMyNuts
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
BluffMyNuts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,209
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bundy5 View Post
I did say largely
Rules for thee but not for me
BluffMyNuts is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:05 AM   #706
ScreaminAsian
For President
 
ScreaminAsian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: DO NOT CONGRATULATE
Posts: 33,266
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grue View Post
The. ****. Is. This?

At the very least she went nude, again, in season 6 which was like 2 years ago. I'm so sad I know this
only because the plot forced her to (her clothes burned off), and the entire thing was SO CGI it was embarrassing. like who do they think they're fooling? we've been watching her this whole season this is not what she looks like. and it was all shadows and flames, but i remember being blown away with how ****ty they cgi'd her body in that scene. i'm not counting that as a nude scene at all, that was 90% computer editing.
ScreaminAsian is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:08 AM   #707
ScreaminAsian
For President
 
ScreaminAsian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: DO NOT CONGRATULATE
Posts: 33,266
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong View Post
You’re smart enough to make better arguments than this straw man. Lektor’s objection is to politics posters dunning their threads with requests trolling this contest and then seeing many more votes cast in the AOC brackets than any other. Those facts create at least an inference of a problem.

You can frame the problem differently, but some other process foul isn’t what Lektor is trying to address.

Nor is the Ivanka/Lahren point relevant. Nobody — literally nobody— is objecting to AOC being in the contest. It’s that universally left politics posters are pulling in voters from other forums and asking them to troll the contest, along with their projective masturbation bull**** and racism accusations.

I suspect you’re trolling with all this, but at least some of it seems sincere. Plus you nominated Sara Calixto last year, so you have that going for you.
hate to break it to you but there was never any collusion, howard. believe me.

the only collusion was done by the other side, and i have a lot of evidence, people are sending me some incredible things, and i'll be presenting that evidence to all of you very shortly
ScreaminAsian is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:16 AM   #708
Howard Treesong
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Howard Treesong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In for the long con!
Posts: 14,340
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScreaminAsian View Post
hate to break it to you but there was never any collusion, howard. believe me.

the only collusion was done by the other side, and i have a lot of evidence, people are sending me some incredible things, and i'll be presenting that evidence to all of you very shortly

Youíre almost always funny.
Howard Treesong is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:21 AM   #709
El Diablo
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
El Diablo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 70,776
Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

HT,

The most literal reading of the specific sentence quoted by Fabian has you only having to pay off if you are the one to introduce politics talk into a thread. So you could reply to an offhand one-liner political joke with pages and pages of politics talk replies and not have to pay up. Seems against the point of the bet/offer, but thatís the most literal reading of the word inject in that sentence.
El Diablo is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:35 AM   #710
bundy5
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
bundy5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 6,555
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScreaminAsian View Post
the only collusion was done by the other side, and i have a lot of evidence, people are sending me some incredible things, and i'll be presenting that evidence to all of you very shortly
I'll be interested to see it free from fabrication of course
bundy5 is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:46 AM   #711
NoSoup4U
old hand
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,633
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MEb View Post
Are you against long time OOT posters being brought back to the forum?
Iím against posters who have no inclination to participate in OOT going forward participating just for the lulz of trolling the contest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by patron View Post
So? Your implication is really really stupid. If mmbt0ne came back and wanted to vote, should he be allowed to? If killa decided he wanted to vote, should he be allowed to?

If your answer is No, then your perspective is completely warped, ahistorical, against common sense, anti-OOT, and anti-Ms OOT.
Iím just reflecting on El Dís proposal that votes be limited to people with 10 recent OOT posts. I think it would also have improved the contest. Any rule will have some undesirable outcomes.
NoSoup4U is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:48 AM   #712
Howard Treesong
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Howard Treesong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In for the long con!
Posts: 14,340
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Diablo View Post
HT,

The most literal reading of the specific sentence quoted by Fabian has you only having to pay off if you are the one to introduce politics talk into a thread. So you could reply to an offhand one-liner political joke with pages and pages of politics talk replies and not have to pay up. Seems against the point of the bet/offer, but thatís the most literal reading of the word inject in that sentence.


Had I posted pages and pages of politics talk, I would have paid Fabian instantly and without complaint. Or if my comment ITT encouraged political discussion and somehow demanded a response ó as in challenging or responding to a differing political view. My point here was different, and while I did think it was close to the line, I did not think it was over.

Iíve heard from LKJ and gregorio has asked for short briefs by the end of the week.
Howard Treesong is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:50 AM   #713
stabn
Usurper
 
stabn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Boris?
Posts: 21,381
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong View Post
Youíre almost always funny.
Or always almost funny.
stabn is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:51 AM   #714
thenewsavman
old hand
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,555
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

This is a tough Elite 8 for me. I like Riley the most, and while she's smart and scores well on attainability, she just doesn't have the horsepower in the looks or relevance department. If I'm being honest with myself I don't think she's worthy of the Mrs. OOT title.

The 18 year old chick and the Mudd girl are goners in earlier rounds in any other Mrs. OOT imo, so I guess I'm rooting for a power outage or like a corrupted database during their round...idk.

I don't really like Underwood or Garcia, but they at least have one elite attribute each: hotness. I guess I will begrudgingly give the nod to Underwood (although I voted against her in earlier rounds) b/c I can't support Garcia due to the fact she perpetuates the cartoon sized ass look which I despise.

AOC is an obvious LOL.

Soberano is an easy pick in her Elite 8 round. She's super attractive but not really hot; has decent attainability but pretty much zero relevance imo. Also her Instagram is decidedly meh. What is up with all the product ads....seriously. She's only 21 so ummm maybe she'll become relevant???
thenewsavman is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 01:25 AM   #715
patron
Pooh-Bah
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,766
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong View Post
Youíre smart enough to make better arguments than this straw man. Lektorís objection is to politics posters dunning their threads with requests trolling this contest and then seeing many more votes cast in the AOC brackets than any other. Those facts create at least an inference of a problem.
Perhaps an inference of a problem, but not necessarily an actual problem. They way to find out if there is an actual problem is to do what just about every other Ms OOT in history has done: examine the voters and disqualify those who do not meet the eligibility requirements, in this case the 100/10 rule. If a Politics poster is not an OOT poster, they should be disqualified. If a Politics poster is also an OOT poster, their vote should count. It is that simple. Lektor previously said this would not be a problem.

However, he then decided mid-competition, with no consultation, to break his own word and make an immoral decision which created an actual problem - arbitrarily disqualifying more than half of the voters and many of OOT's greatest posters. Even if he had the noble intention of not letting non-OOT posters overrun the competition, his execution was abysmal and led to a far, far worse problem than the one he was trying to address.

Both you and Lektor have effectively agreed with the above, by agreeing that my list of disqualified voters should obviously be allowed to vote. But that does not solve the problem, it just demonstrates the magnitude of it and then selectively helps a small portion of those who Lektor never should have disqualified in the first place. There are still an enormous number of correctly eligible voters who remain disenfranchised.

The only fair solution is to allow all voters and then disqualify those who do not meet the 100/10 rule.
patron is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 01:42 AM   #716
Howard Treesong
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Howard Treesong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: In for the long con!
Posts: 14,340
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Their disenfranchisement is an abstraction. If they ask and wish to vote and meet the criterion, their votes will count and they are not disenfranchised. If they donít care enough to ask to vote, then their disenfranchisement is immaterial, if only because they donít care about their votes.

Lektorís solution is reasonable and fair given the circumstances, ie deliberate trolling requests in politics threads.

If you were putting in the work to run this contest, then Iíd line up behind your solution. But you are not, instead devoting long post after long post to criticize it in an unhelpful way. Here, however, Lektor deserves deference.

Your friend,

Howard
Howard Treesong is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 02:01 AM   #717
SteveSax
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 18,575
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Sounds like both people are putting in work and yet old man Howard only wants to recognize the merit of the one he favors
SteveSax is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 02:22 AM   #718
patron
Pooh-Bah
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,766
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong View Post
Their disenfranchisement is an abstraction. If they ask and wish to vote and meet the criterion, their votes will count and they are not disenfranchised. If they donít care enough to ask to vote, then their disenfranchisement is immaterial, if only because they donít care about their votes.
This is false. Even after those on my list were reinstated, multiple other OOT posters who meet the criteria have spoken up, some of them longtime regs, and they remain disenfranchised.

Also, voter suppression is a real thing. If you tell a bunch of people they are not allowed to vote, many of them will not vote or ask to vote, even if they might have wished to or voted otherwise. Also, some people vote in the threads but don't read every post in this lengthy discussion thread, and when they see the wrong and immoral disqualification notice in the OP's of each voting thread, they just get upset and go away, even though they deserve to vote.

You should also note that your position is similar to:
1) All people of X race are disqualified from voting.
2) That's wrong and immoral, they should be allowed to vote!
3) Fine, fine, if any person of X race really wants to vote, they can speak up and ask nicely in a non-voting thread, but we're still gonna post notices in every voting thread that people of X race are not allowed to vote.

Is (3) a fair solution to the problem in (1)?


Quote:
Lektorís solution is reasonable and fair given the circumstances, ie deliberate trolling requests in politics threads.

If you were putting in the work to run this contest, then Iíd line up behind your solution. But you are not, instead devoting long post after long post to criticize it in an unhelpful way. Here, however, Lektor deserves deference.
This is also false. I am criticizing it in the most helpful way possible - by posting the fair solution. Interestingly, it is also the solution that has been used in almost all of Ms OOT history. Also interestingly, it is the solution that Lektor himself always promised to use and said would be no problem to use...until 35 hrs ago, over halfway through the competition.

It is beyond obvious that the only fair solution is to use the rules from the beginning of the competition, which are the same as the rules for almost the entire history of the contest.

This is the most helpful thing that can be posted at this point, until these fair and historical rules are restored.
patron is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 02:55 AM   #719
LektorAJ
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
LektorAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: none
Posts: 7,723
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by patron View Post
The only fair solution is to allow all voters and then disqualify those who do not meet the 100/10 rule. Others will help you vet the voters.
So far it's been difficult to get people to "help" even by writing bios of the candidates they nominated themselves.

If you're volunteering to help, well so far I've got up to the s16 round with Robbie / Ocasio-Cortez (the one where goofyballer was in another subforum encouraging people to vote regardless of eligiblity as I would sort it out - which I have, just not how he expected.) Please post lists of which of Robbie's voters do and don't meet the 100/10 rule then we'll start work on Ocasio-Cortez's, then we'll move to the next s16 round and so on.

@JohnnyA - the software can just give me a list of people who haven't been checked yet - it can't open up 2p2 and do a search for their OOT posts. If there are a couple of new voters per round that's fine, it only takes a minute. goofyballer took that option off the table though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ScreaminAsian View Post
can you imagine how ****ty it would be if someone who uses this website and likes sports voted for a miss oot who's an athlete? it'd be chaos. i mean, people who are fans of her from watching sports, it'd be insane, no way, you'd have to come up with some way on the fly to deal with that, right?
If people voted for Lexi Sun, Lieke Martens or Mikaela Shiffrin because they like their sport that's fine. If they went out of OOT to recruit voters it's not.
LektorAJ is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 03:07 AM   #720
LektorAJ
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
LektorAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: none
Posts: 7,723
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

I'm getting "Database error" when I try to count posts but anyone who meets the criteria El Diablo suggests of having 20 posts in OOT between from 1 Jan 2018 to 29 Nov 2018 should assume their vote will count.
LektorAJ is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 03:21 AM   #721
Fabian
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Fabian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 9,237
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Diablo View Post
Howard,

Would you like a judgement based on purely literal interpretation of that post, or taking into account the intent/spirit of the offer and my interpretation of the understanding/agreement in place between the two of you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong View Post
The general rule for interpreting contracts is that the literal language controls, but if the literal language is ambiguous, then context, course of dealing, and interpretation of intent come into play. That rule is fairly universal across all of USA#1 and common-law countries such as the UK, NZ, Australia and Nigeria. Eurolaws can be quite different depending where you are and I don’t know precisely where Fabian lives. I suggest that you ask this question of Fabian as well.

I entirely understand Fabian’s position here and I will of course abide y’all’s decision.
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Diablo View Post
Howard,

We’re not in court. So simply answer the question please.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong View Post
Literal language unless that is not adequate to answer the question. In that case, fine to consider the other items you listed.

I'm really surprised that Howard would try to lawyer his way out of this with talks of "literal language" and court of law speak. He is well aware of the history, context and spirit of his no politics in OOT freerolls. When we agreed to renew the freeroll, I thought a quick one line agreement was fine, without the need to nail down conditions and clauses etc. I didn't think it was necessary because this isn't babs or mbabs, and I thought Howard and I both perfectly understood what the spirit of "no politics in OOT" meant, as we've been talking about it (and have had freerolls on it) before.

If you don't want to talk politics in OOT, then I suggest not telling OOT that you disagree with AOC's policies. There's a politics forum for that, as you know from the many previous times we've had this discussion.

If we must talk context and interpretation of intent, it's probably worth it to look at the other two posts in the original thread where this freeroll was set up. Again, I can't link to them directly, but the quotes:

"Howard,

In for a new negative freeroll to not bring politics into OOT, perhaps? How about $200 and a year, this time?"


and

"Fabian,

Done."


I think saying "he didn't bring it in, he was just responding to others" is ridiculous, in the babsian "I'm only posting to defend myself" sense. If that's the interpretation the ombudsmen are going with, then fair enough, but at least to me, telling OOT that he disagrees with AOC's policies is a clear violation of our freeroll, and I didn't expect there to be any disagreement tbh.

I'm not going to send any "briefs" by PM as has been suggested, the above will suffice. Curious what you others think.

Last edited by Fabian; 01-15-2019 at 03:29 AM.
Fabian is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 03:23 AM   #722
MrWookie
Don't Call Me Meredith
 
MrWookie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Treating my drinking problem.
Posts: 94,113
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ View Post
I'm getting "Database error" when I try to count posts but anyone who meets the criteria El Diablo suggests of having 20 posts in OOT between from 1 Jan 2018 to 29 Nov 2018 should assume their vote will count.
Wait so now we are changing the rules yet again?

Lololololololol
MrWookie is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 03:27 AM   #723
bundy5
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
bundy5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 6,555
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Lol PVN doing a good job instead
bundy5 is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 04:51 AM   #724
patron
Pooh-Bah
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,766
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ View Post
If you're volunteering to help, well so far I've got up to the s16 round with Robbie / Ocasio-Cortez (the one where goofyballer was in another subforum encouraging people to vote regardless of eligiblity as I would sort it out - which I have, just not how he expected.) Please post lists of which of Robbie's voters do and don't meet the 100/10 rule then we'll start work on Ocasio-Cortez's, then we'll move to the next s16 round and so on.
If I and/or others help, then you agree to (1) return to the historical 100/10 rule that you already said you would abide by, (2) eliminate the mid-competition (1/13) rules change, and (3) not change these rules going forward?
patron is offline  
Old 01-15-2019, 04:53 AM   #725
El Diablo
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
El Diablo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 70,776
Re: Ms. OOT 2018 Discussion thread.

Wookie,

All lektor is trying to do is to limit the voters to current OOT participants, thatís all. I think thatís reasonable given the spirit of the contest.
El Diablo is offline  

Closed Thread
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive