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Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board.

03-17-2014 , 10:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjshabado
Do you mean a flight attendant needs to be in the cockpit while one of the pilots is in the bathroom?
I think it's to open the door when the pilot comes back. I was on a flight once (JetBlue) where a pilot went to the bathroom and the flight attendant repurposed the drink cart as a barrier to getting to the cockpit (turned it horizontal in the aisle just before Row 1). she got behind it and was pretty vigilant about not allowing anyone to get near her. she then removed this barrier when the pilot came back from the bathroom. I'd imagine having the flight attendant in the cockpit is just a much more secure version of this
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 10:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by W0X0F
When a flight attendant calls us, they always identify themselves (e.g. "This is Cheryl up front" or "This is Dick in the rear").
How has this gotten no love yet?
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ntnBO
How has this gotten no love yet?
I was just going to post. Made me laugh loudly sitting at my desk.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 10:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by YouR_DooM
The father of a childhood friend of mine was a pilot and he always had the latest sim installed and was constantly playing when i came over to play with my friend. I wouldn't read too much into it.
To be clear I was thinking of a real flight simulator with a cockpit and 180 degree screen. Not the latest Microsoft flight simulator. Maybe I was totally off. A flight simulator on hour desktop I agree doesn't sound suspicious at all.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:06 AM
the indian ocean is like the redheaded stepchild of oceans. this could be little more then an attempt to become relavent.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by #Thinman
the indian ocean is like the redheaded stepchild of oceans. this could be little more then an attempt to become relavent.
Thinman, for the Mario Mendoza of posters, this is very well done!

Last edited by niss; 03-17-2014 at 11:14 AM. Reason: relevant tho
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by W0X0F
Sounds like something right out of a Tom Clancy novel. At the risk of throwing fuel on the conspiracy fire, I'll say that it's my understanding that you could fly formation close to another plane and thus escape detection. In military formation flying in the U.S., I'm pretty sure that it's standard for all but the lead plane to have the transponder off. This is probably just to de-clutter the controller's screen.

What I don't know is how close the two aircraft have to be so that they present as one target.
On pprune they are suggesting that having the TCAS on makes you visible to the other aircraft and therefore it's not possible. Is that true?
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:23 AM
Warren Buffet should offer a billion dollars for whoever can find this plane.
Increases the chances of it ever being found a huge amount.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:35 AM
Because Warren Buffet cares about increasing the chances?
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by #Thinman
the indian ocean is like the redheaded stepchild of oceans. this could be little more then an attempt to become relavent.
racially insensitive name too, might as well call it the redskin ocean
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:45 AM
So funny the Indians in the US is still called Indians because Columbus thought he was in INDIA India.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 11:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme Ways
So funny the Indians in the US is still called Indians because Columbus thought he was in INDIA India.


Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yeti
i don't know if this is a dumb question:

if this actually has been hijacked to be used in a future terrorist attack, wouldn't it just have made a lot more sense to hijack a plane near whatever the target is and instantly use it?
If you think about it, would it not have been easier to steal/highjack a cargo configured aircraft. There are loads of Fedex type aircraft (converted 727s, 737s,) and converted other large commercial aircraft all over the world.

In stealing a cargo plane you don't have to deal with 239 passengers.

If this is about stealing an aircraft to do future damage, it was very well planned. If you had that planning ability, you would just steal not only an easier target (cargo aircraft), but one better equipped for your future mission.

I mean really. You need to steal a large bus. Are you going to steal an empty one or steal one full of people?

This theories breakdown when you have to weigh the logistics and brilliance required to pull it off, when people that smart would have had way better options.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjshabado
Do you mean a flight attendant needs to be in the cockpit while one of the pilots is in the bathroom?
Yes. You can't have one pilot alone in the cockpit. The second person doesn't necessarily have to be a flight attendant. If we have a jumpseater in the cockpit, that satisfies the requirement.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcticKnight
If you think about it, would it not have been easier to steal/highjack a cargo configured aircraft. There are loads of Fedex type aircraft (converted 727s, 737s,) and converted other large commercial aircraft all over the world.

In stealing a cargo plane you don't have to deal with 239 passengers.

If this is about stealing an aircraft to do future damage, it was very well planned. If you had that planning ability, you would just steal not only an easier target (cargo aircraft), but one better equipped for your future mission.

I mean really. You need to steal a large bus. Are you going to steal an empty one or steal one full of people?

This theories breakdown when you have to weigh the logistics and brilliance required to pull it off, when people that smart would have had way better options.
It'd be much easier to steal a cargo plane once you're on board. The problem getting onto the plane in the first place. Unless it's an inside job by the pilot or crew member, how do you propose to get on board?
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kneel B4 Zod
I think it's to open the door when the pilot comes back. I was on a flight once (JetBlue) where a pilot went to the bathroom and the flight attendant repurposed the drink cart as a barrier to getting to the cockpit (turned it horizontal in the aisle just before Row 1). she got behind it and was pretty vigilant about not allowing anyone to get near her. she then removed this barrier when the pilot came back from the bathroom. I'd imagine having the flight attendant in the cockpit is just a much more secure version of this
We have both: a flight attendant in the cockpit and one "standing guard." And you're right, the FA's major role is to be there to open the door when the pilot comes back. The flying pilot can't very well get up to do it.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArcticKnight
This theories breakdown when you have to weigh the logistics and brilliance required to pull it off, when people that smart would have had way better options.
Regardless of the specific alternatives, I think this statement is really true and indicative of why the answer to what happened probably isn't nearly as 'exciting' as some of the scenarios out there.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:23 PM
I always thought it would be easy to hide something on a flight when I lived next to the air field in Dallas that American uses to fix planes. Very little security and looks like it would be easy to sneak in at night.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by W0X0F
Yes. You can't have one pilot alone in the cockpit. The second person doesn't necessarily have to be a flight attendant. If we have a jumpseater in the cockpit, that satisfies the requirement.
Very interesting, I didn't realize that.

So I guess that might change the possible scenarios involved in this flight as its not quite as simple as one of the pilots just waiting for the other to leave. They'd likely need to do something to incapacitate the other person in the cockpit.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FeralCreature
On pprune they are suggesting that having the TCAS on makes you visible to the other aircraft and therefore it's not possible. Is that true?
TCAS operates in conjunction with the transponder. If the transponder is off, so is TCAS.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ntanygd760
I always thought it would be easy to hide something on a flight when I lived next to the air field in Dallas that American uses to fix planes. Very little security and looks like it would be easy to sneak in at night.
You have to remember a lot of the security around an airport is little more than theatre or enough to stop stupid people attacks or simple attacks.

But think about how many people and how many supplies need to get into and out of the controlled part of an airport. It's just not practical to be able to have it super secured. I had a friend that worked on jet bridges for a few months and he talked about how they almost never had their car/tool boxes searched.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjshabado
You have to remember a lot of the security around an airport is little more than theatre or enough to stop stupid people attacks or simple attacks.

But think about how many people and how many supplies need to get into and out of the controlled part of an airport. It's just not practical to be able to have it super secured. I had a friend that worked on jet bridges for a few months and he talked about how they almost never had their car/tool boxes searched.
I find that if you look serious and carry a clipboard, you can get away with almost anything in this world.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerRon247
It'd be much easier to steal a cargo plane once you're on board. The problem getting onto the plane in the first place. Unless it's an inside job by the pilot or crew member, how do you propose to get on board?
With planning and help, hide in cargo or in cargo area during loading. Find the best country/airport where getting airside with fake ID is the easiest.
We have already seen how lax things are in some countries.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjshabado
Regardless of the specific alternatives, I think this statement is really true and indicative of why the answer to what happened probably isn't nearly as 'exciting' as some of the scenarios out there.
I totally agree and personally think pilot failure still seems like the way to go. The hand off and subsequent change in height/direction do kinda counter this imo. The timing would demand a very tight planning around some things that he might not even have influence on, like having the (co)pilot leaving the cockpit. That part of the story seems to speak in favor of 3rd party wrongdoing (hostage/threat situation).
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote
03-17-2014 , 12:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjshabado
Very interesting, I didn't realize that.

So I guess that might change the possible scenarios involved in this flight as its not quite as simple as one of the pilots just waiting for the other to leave. They'd likely need to do something to incapacitate the other person in the cockpit.
I don't know if these secured cockpit rules are used outside of US and European airlines though.
Malaysia Airlines 777 Disappears: 239 on board. Quote

      
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