Haha -

I don't disagree you guys! And I'm definitely a bit of a pushover in spots like this, so the coaching helps.

What's DOUBLE or TRIPLE frustrating to me is that obviously if the guy told me it was $10 more a light I'd have paid it in an instant, combined with to captain's point - he actually brought some cans, then after he installed the first had to go to Home Depot because the next was defective. So he bought a new pack! He could have bought the more expensive shallow ones at that point!

Will be going by the house today to see what's up.

Other note: man paying laborers to pack and or carry stuff $40/hour is insane.

Trapping a few may help identify what type of rodents you have but in my experience dam near impossible to get them all. If you have a livestock feed store or a farm and ranch type store, see if you can find a product called 'Just One Bite.' Or just order from Amazon. Kills everything from house mice to wharf rats. Dries them out from the inside so if they die in a wall or the attic they won't smell. And don't bother with any baits that are green in color as those products are minimally effective.

https://goo.gl/images/Zif3Fd

quick q for some of you guys in here..

few months ago had a guy replace a toilet in my upstairs bathroom, seems like it works fine, no visual damage or leaks that i can see around it or on the floor. however, over this summer there was a leak into the basement (toilet was on 2nd floor) that was small yet large enough to cause a small square of ceiling to collapse. basically a drop ceiling piece sized portion, except this was like a particle board and only the one spot was soft. couldnt break the rest in half even (not soft, didnt try too hard) and seemingly a much bigger one above the kitchen where the ceiling was turning a yellow color but more of outlines than entirely.

so before its obviously the toilet at fault, it also rained ALL summer. with the layout of the house, the toilet is not directly above the kitchen but is sort of above the basement steps.

so i guess what im asking is; if a toilet were installed incorrectly would you see the water in the bathroom? any idication? could a leak be that bad?

chances a clogged gutter or something let water rise high enough to find a weak spot in?

how ****ed would one be to replace 10x10ft of finished ceiling and any plumbing costs involved?

OH and what i forgot to mention was that in the same bathroom sink, around the same time, the water pressure from the sink comes shooting out at first, .5-1s, then goes back to normal. like half on will come out faster than full blast could ever reach.

pre ty for any ideas

Not necessarily. The flange is often right at or even below the floor covering.

Yeah, stained and collapsing ceilings.

It clearly is, and it's probably worse than you think.

On the 2nd floor? Zero. It's either the toilet or some other bit of plumbing in that area.

You can't afford not to fix it, and the sooner you do it the cheaper it will be. It will cause structural damage if you don't, probably mold and mildew too. Get a good plumber out there pronto and worry about fixing the holes he makes in the ceiling later. And if it does turn out to be a bad toilet installation you should be holding the guy who did it responsible.

thx for response. only things of note are that i saw the floor when the toilet was out, new wax ring, and the hole was slightly above the fake tiling floor of the bathroom. i guess its possible that the weight of the toilet seals the floor enough so that a leak goes straight under instead of out?

and the house is slightly weirdly shaped, in that roof is over first floor in parts, second floor, garage, etc. lots of corners, not the standard 2 story that a kid would draw.

i know its roughly impossibe, but ballpark a cost? under 5 figures possible?

and would the random sink surges in pressure be related to a poor install or possibly a failing line somewhere along the way? ive lived here off and on for ten years and it is extremely noticable and new

When you look at your house can you see a plausible path for rain water to get to that part of the ceiling without showing up somewhere else? That would be a pretty weird thing, I'd think.

I'd expect you to be able to get a plumbing leak fixed and your ceiling repaired for well under 5 figures. I have no idea what's going on with your sink. It could be a choke point in one of the supply lines, like if there's a segment of 3/8" in what is otherwise a 1/2" line.

well the kitchen is right next to a corner of first floor roof, then goes up with more siding to the sunroom on the back end, all of which have gutters and im surrounded by trees. i havent gone up there yet but its above a deck and also above the walkout basement so from the ground its about 20ft up (cant see)

above that is all 2nd floor roof, but there are also some cracked siding panels from a tree years ago. nothing major and been there for a while. im really thinking its the bathroom is the culprit but figured it cant hurt to ask.

thanks again, trying to get ahold of people to come look at it as its waaaay above my ability. the sink has been untouched since we moved in and just recently started

as an aside, house was built in 2005, POs had it for 6 months before moving then we bought it. was built by our neighbor who is kind of notorious for being cheap on construction. ac/heater has been replaced twice, microwave, fridge, dishwasher have all been replaced since buying. maybe 5-10 cracks in the walls from "settling" and for the area, its supposed to be a "nice" house

The current state of the master bathroom. Red tile all gone now.

Gamboneee,

I'm no expert, but if it was the toilet, I would think you'd continue to see water dripping out of the hole in the basement, unless you've stopped using it. I would flush it a whole bunch of times, use the sink a lot, and see if anything comes down. if that doesn't work, maybe wait for a good rainstorm and see what happens. Now that the hole is there it should be pretty immediate.

Can you see any plumbing or AC ducts above or around the hole in the basement?

Are you positive the kitchen staining is new as well? If the damage there is bad enough you'd want to replace it regardless, I'd open it up some so you can hopefully see what's going on. It sucks, but I'd be inclined to do that myself and not call anyone until you see some water actively dripping somewhere, or have a good idea what to blame. I don't know a lot of plumbers who would take the time to chase down an unknown problem, and it would be very expensive.

If you can tell there's a low point in the kitchen ceiling, you could also make a small hole and see if it's wet up there, and again you'd be able to tell immediately when water is actively leaking because it would drip down to the floor instead of getting absorbed by the drywall for a while.

Good luck. Water leaks sure seem to be the worst part of owning a home.

thanks for another reply, i also thought about putting a hole in the ceiling, i just didnt want to take away the integrity and have it fall down on me lol... maybe also overly dramatic

i was thinking about this again today, if it were the toilet to floor connection that is off, wouldnt it be.... sewagy water? there is nothing to indicate that, and the water-in lines are the same as before, which connect above ground and are not leaking.

idk if pics would help but i could get some probably tomorrow

It's fairly odd for a toilet to leak from the floor connection. For starters, it would only leak when it was flushed and even then, it would be unlikely that it would leak very much as most of the water would automatically go down into the drain unless there was some sort of clog. Pics would definitely help, specially from outside showing where this wet spot is in relation to the outside. Also pics of the first floor of what is directly above the wet spot. I'm guessing its a small leak in a pipe somewhere or it is rain water that is finding its way in from somewhere. Water finds it way to odd places sometimes when you have a leaking roof since it will just run down wall studs and stuff. Do you have an accessible attic?

At a previous house, I had water coming in from the window frame whenever there was a bad rainstorm and wind in a certain direction. Two contractors were unable to trace the origin, even though the general area it was getting in was somewhat obvious by tracing soft plaster.

One thought it was a certain spot on the roof flashing and sealed that. The other thought it was where the stone and brick met and sealed that. I eventually found the culprit myself. The window ledge a floor above (right near both of the above) had a rotten spot with just a pinhole in the paint. Not really visible, but very soft to the touch.

Point is, origin of water is often really hard to determine without opening up walls/ceilings and tracing it back.

sorry to get back to this this late, cant take pics outside cause its dark now. in trying to describe it i cant really come up with a way that will make much sense. basically the side of the kitchen where the table is is under the first floor roof, yet the rest of the kitchen is under the 2nd floor roof and down the flat side of the house is also the walkout basement. first floor side ends at the deck, goes back up a flat wall and maybe 15' single story roof over the sunroom.

so essentially a corner which is almost exactly where the stain in the kitchen is. however from the kitchen to the spot in the basement is about 15' away, and down a floor obv. there is a small pipe down there that is wet, but i cant tell if it is also above that or not. small as in maybe 1/8"-1/4", also looks like it may have been taped already. wouldn't have been by us, and the builder is certainly cheap enough to have done that from the start. the hot water heater is in the basement, there is no bathroom or sink etc down there.

there is no attic. 2 full baths on second floor, half bath/kitchen/laundry on first. my bathroom is over the garage, which is at least 25-30 feet from the kitchen spot and at a different direction, 10-15 feet from the basement spot (best guesses)

pretty busy with work so it might be a few days before pics (ill keep reading for sure tho) but ty everyone for the help so far.

If I had to guess, I would say water is getting in from outside somehow. Finding it may be tricky. Good luck. I'd start by getting on the roof and inspecting any place where there is flashing or anything sticking out of the roof (vents, pipes, electrical, etc.) and joints like where 2nd floor meets 1st floor roof... Could just as easily be plumbing, but that may be harder to determine. You could start with any sinks, showers, tubs close to in line with the wet spot and just leave the water on for awhile one at a time and see if it starts dripping. Most likely it will be a drain seal that is leaking versus a water supply pipe.

ill do my best to get pics up this week, as i have some time off. since im pretty amateur at this, it may be slightly excessive to get the point across.

while im here, my gf managed to break a glass coffee table top, trying to get it back onto an area rug. it was roughly 2'x3'x.5" thick brown tinted, 45 degree beveled edges. any idea where to source a replacement or just try locally? havent had much luck in the area so far

oh and car goes in the shop next week so should be nice and expensive all around

Do not replace glass, just replace coffee table. Custom cut glass is through the roof pricewise, and you'll just be mad when it breaks again.

GvoiceofexperienceG

It'll be nearly impossible to post too many pics, close ups will help. There are bunch of people in this thread with great knowledge of various trades who'll off their expertise for free.

You mentioned that there was a 1/8" to 1/4" "pipe" that was taped and wet. Is it plastic or copper? Do you have an ice maker in your freezer?

As far as the broken glass, there are several online glass stores. Just google "order glass online" and you'll get several options to simply input the specs, order online, and have it delivered to your house.

thanks guys, and sorry for cluttering the thread. the coffee table was apparently a gift to my mom from her (late) mother so nothing good there. my gf broke it while i was at work, can barely tell me why shes crying on the phone. im thinking she managed to kill my cat and she finally spits that out. obviously not great but too late now. we've had it for probably 20+ years and it hasnt broken soooooo she wins?

to de captain, ice maker yes, but the bucket inside kind. its a short cutout and not the usual height with water/ice dispenser in the door. i have no idea what kind of pipe, i havent looked that closely yet. but definitely not plastic. also the measurments were a guess of the size overall, and not converging pipes of different sizes.

and my mom is back for the holidays nice and early, so all pictures will probably include a large amount of dog and/or hair

ok looked again and the pipe is plastic in the basement. looks like a blue glue/seal on the corners, not actual tape. took a few pics ill get up later, didnt have time to get on the roof yet

Well apparently the other night our neighbor got up to go to the bathroom at about 1:30am and when she turned on the light she saw a shadow jump out of our yard side over the side gate next to side garage door. I am cutting down a stupid ****ing tree that I have always hated in our front yard today, that also gives cover to the gate in question which is likely why they targeted us to begin with, and Will be installing security cameras this week. I bought a 6 camera system from Costco that is hardwired with a local hard drive and includes no subscription cloud storage.

I am going to be traveling more for work leaving wife and kids home, so it will make me feel better. I am assuming the deterrence of having visible cameras will be the most important part, but does anyone have any tips re effective camera placement and installation?

This stupid camera system at $1,500 will instantly be the most valuable item on the premises.

motion lights should be a good deterrent also (cant always see a camera in the dark) and way cheaper

with 6 and size of house probably front door, garage, back door/porch, backyard, one on each side

I'd point one at the neighbor's house. That story makes no sense at all.

I've got a neighbor like that. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he has a different telescope set up inside his house to spy on at least four neighbors.

Johnny,
This is obviously the mini van owner

At least the garage door was closed. It was, right?

Yes, the garage door was closed. =) Hopping the fence there gives them access to the side door on the garage, also closed and locked, then a path to the backyard and two back doors. The neighbor who heard/saw it woke up her husband to investigate. They do have a camera set up but on their driveway and checked the footage and didn't see anything. I just cut that ****ing tree down like a lumberjack and the increased visibility probably fixed the problem already. We do have a motion light set up right there on the inside of the fence and the neighbor said that it was on already, but she is not sure how long it was on. That side is pretty hidden even with the light on.

Irrelevant fun fact: neighbor is distractingly hot.