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Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread

04-10-2015 , 10:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoundingTheUnder
i wonder if this ****ing guy realises that by the latest dsm, basically half of us will have a diagnosable mental illness in our lifetime.

this thread sucks.

like really bro... you don't see why precluding people from a ton of jobs over 'mental illness' would be a counter productive thing? like people might not seek help then and be even more 'dangerous'.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoundingTheUnder
what's wrong with people? this **** is outrageous.
Perhaps if you sucker punched someone you would be able to calm down.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 10:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
What would be interesting is if a long-time employed pilot after seeing a doctor was prescribed one of these animals. Theoretically, he/she should be allowed to bring their animal into the cockpit. I also think an airline employer would have to legally comply and make reasonable accommodation.

It would be odd, as a passenger, to see a helper monkey in the cockpit of the plane, but if it makes my pilot more relaxed, I am all for it. Now if there was also a miniature horse and a bird up there, I would probably be more concerned.
I, for one, would not be flying on a plane with a pilot that required a support animal.

If the pilot needs an animal just to get through the day-to-day situations, how are they going to respond in an unusually stressful situation? It's not about stigmatizing mental illness, it's about acknowledging that certain jobs have certain requirements that need to be met. I wouldn't fly with a blind pilot, but I don't think that's stigmatizing blind people.
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04-10-2015 , 11:13 AM
waow some people just have no respect for our fellow earth's citizens, unreal
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04-10-2015 , 11:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by numberonedonk
I wasn't referring to actual service animals. I was referring to animals that are used for "emotional support". I have no problem with an actual service animal like a seeing eye horse. You seem to think an emotional support animal is the same thing as a service animal when they are not. Service animals do an actual service while ESA's are just emotional crutches. Just like Oscar was a crutch for you and not needed once you worked through your problems. Did you try to work on your problems before you resorted to taking your dog every where?

How do you feel about people that have allergies to animals? Do they not matter because someone has "anxiety" and can't be with out their dog?

Yes I'm well aware that anyone can buy a vest. Did you not read my post?

You can even buy your prescription here http://www.cptas.com/ for $160.
I fail to see how emotional crutches aren't 'doing something' for you. When I had him with me for a little less than a year, he was a psychiatric service dog (that's how emotional support dogs were classified) and had all the same protections. Who are you to decide if he wasn't doing as much for me as a dog that detected low blood sugar or seizures?

I went to a psychiatrist before and after his training and she was who gave me the script to have him get trained. I hated being on drugs but it took a year and a half or two years before I felt good enough to go about without his help.

To be honest your posts seem really disdainful of the fact that I had him with me and it makes me think you don't really believe how crippling mental illnesses can be. Yes, it can cause problems. I took him once to a poker tournament to see how he would be. When I got sat at one table, someone said they were allergic to dogs. The tournament staff moved me to a different table. Things can be worked around to accommodate people. When the next dealer came over, he dealt for around 20 minutes before noticing I had a dog with me in the 5 seat directly across from him. Tell me how this is putting anyone out.
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04-10-2015 , 11:58 AM
Pic of dog plz, Gobbo.
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04-10-2015 , 12:02 PM
I thought you'd never ask!



Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo


How can you guys be against this little guy?
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04-10-2015 , 12:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
Who are you to decide if he wasn't doing as much for me as a dog that detected low blood sugar or seizures?
The diabeties dog seems like an odd thing. If the palpitations, extreme face sweating and generally feeling like crap don't alert you to low blood sugar then I don't see Fido helping.

I have had this happen a couple of times, and even on the first occasion it was completely obvious what was going on just from the symptoms as described to me previously.
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04-10-2015 , 12:14 PM
AFAIK it affects some people differently. The biggest thing I know of is that you can pass out or go into shock and obviously it would help to detect before it got to that extreme a state.
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04-10-2015 , 12:16 PM
Anyone wanting to learn more about ESA horses can check out this very informative site.

http://www.guidehorse.com/news_emot_supt.htm

The monsters who seek to deny people the companionship of these majestic animals need help.

I was wondering if the patients size permitted could an ESA mini horse be ridden and still provide therapeutic value? I'm visualizing Warwick Davis galloping past me with a samsonite trailing behind and wondering why can't people get the help they need?
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04-10-2015 , 12:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
I thought you'd never ask!
That's a really cute dog Gobbo, and I don't even like dogs much.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
AFAIK it affects some people differently. The biggest thing I know of is that you can pass out or go into shock and obviously it would help to detect before it got to that extreme a state.
Yeah, did a little looking around and it seems they're mainly used for Type 1's and children. Amazing that they can be trained to do this.
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04-10-2015 , 12:22 PM
I find the seizure alert dogs fascinating.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...izuredogs.html
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04-10-2015 , 12:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjshabado
I, for one, would not be flying on a plane with a pilot that required a support animal.

If the pilot needs an animal just to get through the day-to-day situations, how are they going to respond in an unusually stressful situation? It's not about stigmatizing mental illness, it's about acknowledging that certain jobs have certain requirements that need to be met. I wouldn't fly with a blind pilot, but I don't think that's stigmatizing blind people.
Would you just walk off the plane?

Would you prefer your pilot was on anti-depressants?

Maybe he/she just needs the animal to deal with people and not the actual flight itself.
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04-10-2015 , 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chippa58
I guess anxiety presents itself differently to different people. For me, an anxiety attack means the onset of extreme self awareness. Sometimes I can predict when its going to happen, like at a wedding or a job interview. Sometimes its just random, like at a shopping mall. Anyway, it makes me feel like everyone is looking at me, and I get very flushed and nervous.

When I see these dogs in public places where you wouldn't normally see animals, I can't help but look at them and their owners. They're often engaged in conversations with strangers about their animals etc. For me, drawing attention to myself, and making a normally routine situation more awkward would be counter-productive in terms of my anxiety issues. But that's just me. Taking lorazepam as needed works a lot better IMO.
Well, that is why having an animal near your side may help in situations like that.

These people get tons of attentions. Kids go bonkers if they see a miniature horse in a restaurant.

One person came to my office with a vest that said "not a pet, do not pet."

I kicked her out of the practice because she was such a hostile person and abusing the system.
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04-10-2015 , 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guardian troll
waow some people just have no respect for our fellow earth's citizens, unreal
It could be seen that you have no respect for animals and discriminate against them as well as citizens that require animals to live better lives.

This should be like a drug that you get weaned off of. That is why it is only a year and you get re-evaluated.

The problem is that it is probably an auto-refill. And these people now have gotten so used to taking their pig in public and getting attention that they cannot function without it.

I think a study should be done examining the addictive nature of this.

We have such little data to go off to determine the efficacy.
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04-10-2015 , 12:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
I find the seizure alert dogs fascinating.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...izuredogs.html
Got to say I'm a bit skeptical - small sample sizes, alerts up to 12 hours in advance and something that can't be trained for.

My snake oil alert hamster just bit my finger.
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04-10-2015 , 12:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
This should be like a drug that you get weaned off of. That is why it is only a year and you get re-evaluated.

The problem is that it is probably an auto-refill. And these people now have gotten so used to taking their pig in public and getting attention that they cannot function without it.

I think a study should be done examining the addictive nature of this.

We have such little data to go off to determine the efficacy.
There's so many other things you could say exactly the same thing about. Maybe people should be weened off having a drink when they're out at the bar to make social interactions easier.

If it's any reassurance, the animal will die at some point, so that should ween them right off.
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04-10-2015 , 12:56 PM
That's a very old article fwiw. The one I read most recently focused on one person and her dog specifically. Probably should've linked to that one.
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04-10-2015 , 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
To be honest your posts seem really disdainful of the fact that I had him with me and it makes me think you don't really believe how crippling mental illnesses can be. Yes, it can cause problems. I took him once to a poker tournament to see how he would be. When I got sat at one table, someone said they were allergic to dogs. The tournament staff moved me to a different table. Things can be worked around to accommodate people. When the next dealer came over, he dealt for around 20 minutes before noticing I had a dog with me in the 5 seat directly across from him. Tell me how this is putting anyone out.
FWIW, although I am a psychologist, I still find your attitude about this to be really self-absorbed. Individuals with mental disorders do not have an unfettered right to use whatever coping tools they feel necessary in order to be out in public, especially when these tools may frighten or trigger allergy reactions in individuals who have no reason to expect that they will be subjected to them.

I personally believe that genuine service animals who perform some sort of recognizable task and can be properly certified should be allowed in establishments, while "emotional support" animals should be allowed only in places that already allow pets.
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04-10-2015 , 01:13 PM
I understand and respect that point of view. I assume that's why emotional support animals no longer have federal protection. But it bothers me most likely because I've always loved being around dogs and it's hard for me to understand how someone who is afraid of all dogs can feel when they see me holding my 11 pound wiener dog.

That being said, in this country and culture we immediately have more understanding of people with physical ailments than mental. I think one of the things holding us back as a society is lack of understanding, compassion, and attempts to accommodate those with mental illnesses of some sort. As a psychologist, wouldn't you agree your job would be a lot easier if people sought help much earlier rather than waiting to seek help as much as several years later?

Last edited by gobbo; 04-10-2015 at 01:19 PM.
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04-10-2015 , 01:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
Would you just walk off the plane?
Sure. If I saw a pilot taking a hit of cocaine I'd walk off the plane too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
Would you prefer your pilot was on anti-depressants?
Maybe? Would it work?

Ultimately, I can't know if someone is on anti-depressants or not, will react well in a stressful emergency, or is taking hits of cocaine in a locked bathroom. So if I don't have any specific information, I just rely on the fact that the vast majority of pilots are responsible and can handle things just fine.

But if I get a specific piece of information (like seeing they need a support monkey in the cockpit with them) I can take that into consideration and act on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
Maybe he/she just needs the animal to deal with people and not the actual flight itself.
Maybe?
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
I understand and respect that point of view. I assume that's why emotional support animals no longer have federal protection. But it bothers me most likely because I've always loved being around dogs and it's hard for me to understand how someone who is afraid of all dogs can feel when they see me holding my 11 pound wiener dog.
Don't diss the wiener - has a proud heritage as a badger hunting dog and is not to be messed with.
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04-10-2015 , 01:18 PM
Tribbles!
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04-10-2015 , 01:18 PM
Don't Judge Me: My Emotional Support Dog is Not a Scam

https://www.yahoo.com/travel/dont-ju...705401532.html

So this person used to take a lot of drugs to make it through a flight, but doesn't anymore.

Should others suffer because of her psychological inability to take a flight?

My issue is that you may be (are) creating dependency. This woman will never be able to go on a flight without her dog.
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