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Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread

04-10-2015 , 07:00 PM
really glad this stuff doesnt happen in the UK

what would happen in the following example, lecturer at university allergic to dogs, student in class has emotional support dog, lecturer cant be in same room as dog thus cant do his job properly, university has nobody else that could teach course to high level, who wins? every other student in class gets shafted with sub standard teaching? pretty selfish no?
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04-10-2015 , 07:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FUrake
really glad this stuff doesnt happen in the UK

what would happen in the following example, lecturer at university allergic to dogs, student in class has emotional support dog, lecturer cant be in same room as dog thus cant do his job properly, university has nobody else that could teach course to high level, who wins? every other student in class gets shafted with sub standard teaching? pretty selfish no?
The United States is much more advanced with animal protection laws

I can't imagine that a dog in the back of the room can set off allergies.

How does this person manage to be on a train or bus with dogs?

I think it would be interesting if we mandated that all people have a pet with them at all times out in public. It may make the world a friendlier place. And yes, these pets would have to be certified safe and friendly too.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 07:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
Fwiw that seems really insensitive to me. But I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on that.
Problem's never with use, always with abuse.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 07:31 PM
How can this be a real thing? No way an airline lets a ****ing horse on a plane. Even if SL Jackson is on the same flight.
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04-10-2015 , 07:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic
How can this be a real thing? No way an airline lets a ****ing horse on a plane. Even if SL Jackson is on the same flight.
Yes, it is real thing.

Please get over your discriminatory mind of thinking

You should be outraged that Southwest does not allow Pot-bellied Pigs or Miniature Horses on their planes. Delta Airlines is much more accommodating and forward thinking.

And, if you demonstrate to your medical professional adequately enough, you may be prescribed two miniature horses to deal with your psychiatric issues. Sometimes on miniature horse is not enough. Up the dosage!
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04-10-2015 , 07:56 PM
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04-10-2015 , 08:05 PM
Wow, that's an interesting reaction to this thread, jmakin. I feel like we must have been reading completely different posts. Who here was stigmatizing mental disorders?

You say "some people will game the system"; for this particular topic (emotional support animals on planes), I'd guess the number is north of 90%. And I've talked to at least three different people who have used this dodge (and admitted to me that it's bull****) to get their dog wherever they want to take him.
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04-10-2015 , 08:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirOsis
The woman looks a little put out
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04-10-2015 , 08:14 PM
All I have to say is that a ****ing bull mastiff is not an emotional support animal.
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04-10-2015 , 08:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by W0X0F
Wow, that's an interesting reaction to this thread, jmakin. I feel like we must have been reading completely different posts. Who here was stigmatizing mental disorders?

You say "some people will game the system"; for this particular topic (emotional support animals on planes), I'd guess the number is north of 90%. And I've talked to at least three different people who have used this dodge (and admitted to me that it's bull****) to get their dog wherever they want to take him.
the ****ing op did. several times.
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04-10-2015 , 08:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
Here is the sample letter. That is all that is needed and you are golden to take your animal virtually anywhere.


[Date]


To Whom It May Concern:
[Full Name of Patient] is my patient and has been under my care since [date]. I am intimately familiar with his/her history and with the functional limitations imposed by his/her emotional/mental health-related issue.

Due to this emotional disability, [patient first name] has certain limitations coping with what would otherwise be considered normal, but significant day to day situations. To help alleviate these challenges and to enhance his/her day to day functionality, I have prescribed [patient first name] an emotional support animal. The presence of this animal is necessary for the emotional/mental health of [patient name] because its presence will mitigate the symptoms he/she is currently experiencing.

Sincerely,

(Physician’s name and title)
That is a load of ****ing bull****.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmakin

Having a psychiatric disorder or illness "on record" literally means bull**** for almost any job anywhere that I am aware of. I ticked every box on my medical form for depression, anxiety, bipolar, stress-related issues, etc. etc. and I was not only able to get a Transportation Worker Identity Card (says I'm not a terrorist or a safety issue) I was able to get a master's license to pilot any vessel up to 100 tons in near coastal waters off the United States and/or inland waters.

Having them "on record" literally means **** because the only person that can view those records are doctors and only with your permission. HIPAA is a thing, derp. And for good reason, obviously, because of people like you and some others itt.
That is why accidents like the German plane that went down in France can happen because of relaxed safeguards that should really be keeping people like you from obtaining these licenses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gobbo
I thought you'd never ask!



See I have no problem with a dog like this and using it to emotionally support any psychotic disease that you may have. It is when people start saying that bigger, more aggressive dogs are emotional support dogs is what I have a problem with, especially when they start claiming it after the dog has been attacking other people.

Last edited by bundy5; 04-10-2015 at 08:29 PM.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 08:38 PM
Found that lady I was talking about before, the one with 3 support/service dogs who supposedly warn her before some unnamed attack happens.

Cliffs: Casino buffet wouldn't allow it, she filed complaint





Link
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 08:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bundy5
That is a load of ****ing bull****.



That is why accidents like the German plane that went down in France can happen because of relaxed safeguards that should really be keeping people like you from obtaining these licenses.



See I have no problem with a dog like this and using it to emotionally support any psychotic disease that you may have. It is when people start saying that bigger, more aggressive dogs are emotional support dogs is what I have a problem with, especially when they start claiming it after the dog has been attacking other people.
1) That letter is all you need. Do you want an essay attached? Call the office to confirm. It has the doctor's name.

2) Safeguards are relaxed? What safeguards were in place previously that would have avoided that incident occurring? This pilot at least went to a doctor and admitted depression which I will presume was very rare before.

3) Small dogs have snappers too. I don't think you should be discriminating on size or breed of dog.
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04-10-2015 , 08:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gin 'n Tonic
Got to say I'm a bit skeptical - small sample sizes, alerts up to 12 hours in advance and something that can't be trained for.

My snake oil alert hamster just bit my finger.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 09:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by W0X0F
Wow, that's an interesting reaction to this thread, jmakin. I feel like we must have been reading completely different posts. Who here was stigmatizing mental disorders?
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoundingTheUnder
the ****ing op did. several times.
Since I'm such a simpleton I'm having a hard time finding anything like that in the OP. Could you point it out for me? Here's the OP for your convenience.
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
I have seen a huge uptick in emotional support animals.

They are in restaurants, grocery stores, and all public spaces.

Some groups think they have the same rights as service animals.

In terms of Southwest Airlines, if you were prescribed an emotional support animal you can bring the following into the passenger area:

1) Dog
2) Cat
3) Bird
4) Monkey

Delta Airlines, in addition, allows:

5) Pot-bellied Pigs
6) Miniature Horses

You are potentially facing a discrimination suit if you ask to see a physician's paper that shows a valid prescription.

At what point, do you think society will say enough...
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04-10-2015 , 09:04 PM
Before even talking of the logistics of these animals, I feel we as a society (or the medical field, really) should first determine if they even actually help with psychiatric disorders. Do we have evidence that there are patients for which the animals help and other treatment modalities don't or can't be used for some reason?

I haven't yet seen this evidence, but I also didn't look very hard.
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04-10-2015 , 09:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirOsis
We have gone off the rails as a society.
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04-10-2015 , 09:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoundingTheUnder
the ****ing op did. several times.
I didn't read his posts that way. He has only been factual in how the system works. Please give examples of how he has stigmatized mental disorders.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 09:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirOsis
Lol GTFO

I can just picture it...I'm sitting in the window seat as the rest of the plane is boarding...I'm hoping no one sits down next to me and I can then spread out some...

And then this jackass sits down.

OH HELL NO

I'm pressing that little stewardess button, and if I don't get a seat change, that airline is going to be giving me lots of free mileage.

I think that when I buy a ticket on a plane, I have a reasonable expectation of not sharing my leg room with a ****ing horse.
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04-10-2015 , 09:14 PM
god damn that's funny. bravo dominick.
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04-10-2015 , 11:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by W0X0F
I didn't read his posts that way. He has only been factual in how the system works. Please give examples of how he has stigmatized mental disorders.
Thank you W0X0F.

I opined that having been prescribed an emotional support animal may preclude one from jobs. Someone said that is true for certain government jobs that require security clearance. I don't know.

I opined that I think it has gotten out of control and I have seen a huge upsurge in requests.

Nobody asked for this 5 years ago.

There have been various opinions in this thread. Some people who can't be around dogs are considered the people with problems.

I believe it should be addressed now before people really do get "addicted" to their animal and probably can't deal with society on their own. This might be creating more of a problem than it solves.

I believe a pet (in all due deference to W0X0F, they are pets) should be one of the last solutions before someone is prescribed that due to infringement on society.

I am bothered that you can't even ask people to see a certificate. They should put that doctor's note on the pet so everyone can see it.

These pets are walking advertisements. Even part of me thinks that would be cool and why do they get that benefit and I don't.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 11:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic
Lol GTFO

I can just picture it...I'm sitting in the window seat as the rest of the plane is boarding...I'm hoping no one sits down next to me and I can then spread out some...

And then this jackass sits down.

OH HELL NO

I'm pressing that little stewardess button, and if I don't get a seat change, that airline is going to be giving me lots of free mileage.

I think that when I buy a ticket on a plane, I have a reasonable expectation of not sharing my leg room with a ****ing horse.
I am hoping that is a couple and that lady is ok with it.

Even being in the rows around it would freak some people out.

All airlines have caved in to this. Every major carrier allows it with Delta being the most liberal.
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04-10-2015 , 11:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman
Before even talking of the logistics of these animals, I feel we as a society (or the medical field, really) should first determine if they even actually help with psychiatric disorders. Do we have evidence that there are patients for which the animals help and other treatment modalities don't or can't be used for some reason?

I haven't yet seen this evidence, but I also didn't look very hard.
I would also like evidence on the impact on animals. That miniature horse doesn't look happy.

Won't someone please think of the animals...
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 11:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
I am hoping that is a couple and that lady is ok with it.

Even being in the rows around it would freak some people out.

All airlines have caved in to this. Every major carrier allows it with Delta being the most liberal.
This was on my Delta flight on Tuesday. I had no idea these even existed before that.

Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
04-10-2015 , 11:55 PM
At least let's start with fining people heavily who fake it and just buy an Internet vest.

The problem, and I may be part of it too, is that 25% of the general population thinks they are adorable and approach dogs. The owner is a mini-celebrity. It is a conversation ice-breaker.

When I saw this lady with a vest on her 12 pound mutt that said, "Do not pet, this is not a pet" and she had no documentation and she was defiant when asked, all I could think was leave your pet at home if you don't want him touched. You are physically healthy and it is natural for many people to approach small pets.

You are playing games with the wrong game player, honey. Show a script. Or have a doctor evaluate you for your condition. I will approach your pet in my office if I want.

She left. Never returned.
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