Is this thread real?

"I make double the median US income. Am I poor because I like to spend more than double the median US income?"

only poor b/c of where you live. nyc 65k is not very much. tough to get an apartment that's decent on that type of wage. that's also pre-tax income, in nyc the state/city tax are insanely high.

Plus olive oil.

Move would be my advice.

There are almost certainly Co-op City residents with a 2+2 account, but that's not the point. I mean, I'm sure that when you ride by on the train from Connecticut the complex looms like a Corbusian nightmare, but Co-op city is not a dilapidated housing project. It is a middle income development in a safe area full of working people. The apartments are spacious and well maintained and are of the same style as those East Side white brick buildings where 1BDs sell for over a million, and real estate agents advertise as "Mid-Century Modern" to the right kind of white people.

My point is that there is no waiting list for these places. I'm responding to ND who is arguing that you can't reasonably live in NYC for 65k/yr, and proving his point by cherry-picking rent in the most expensive areas and waving away other alternatives as "hellholes." But here is a well known development where they are basically giving away nice apartments, and any of the millions of middle income New Yorkers can live at cost, yet they can barely fill the place. That's because there are a million other options, often in more fashionable or convenient areas.

The truth is that NYC can be one of the best places to live on a middle class income. I know I certainly would rather live here on 65K then pretty much anywhere else in the US (including Austin). However, NYC is arguably the worst place to live on a high income. In pretty much any other metro area in the US, if you make 300k you will live like a king. In NYC you are still living in an apartment, sweating the rent, taking public transit, keeping up with the Joneses and constantly surrounded by people making much more money then you. Also, you have to contend with that retired teacher down the hall whose rent controlled apartment is larger then yours and only costs $700/month.

You want to know why more middle class white people aren't moving to coop city? That's why.

Middle class whites don't feel comfortable in non-white neighborhoods. Like it or not, that's the way it is.

When I was single and made around $60k/year, I was always liquid. Now I am married with kids and our combined income is $200k+ and I am cash poor. Go figure.

Who said anything about middle class whites? Anyway, if you don't think middle class whites are willing to move into non-white areas, then I'm just gonna take a wild guess that you don't live anywhere near NYC. Or have visited here much in the last 30 years. Or read that many many newspapers. Because lol.

It isn't just NYC. With the exception of university every city I've lived in $65k would be tough. You wouldn't be poor but you would have to make a lot of subpar choices that would cause a major hit to quality of life so that you can save money.

Given the plural on kids I don't find this at all surprising.

Excuse me for asking this, but what's the advantage to having a doorman?

You sound like a sharp guy, so I am going to assume that in this statement "NYC" = something in midtown. For other areas, it would be totally nonsensical. Plenty of people in the outer boroughs live a great life while making nowhere near $300k, or even $300k combined, and still have access to Manhattan.

it was probably more for safety 30 years ago, but now it's just a little bit safety and also the convenience of having someone to hold deliveries(groceries and mail). They can also take care of little things if there's no super in the building.

"having a doorman" is code for significantly nicer building

Kids don't have to be expensive.
That 250k number that came out last week is ludicrous. (Says the guy with no kids, but many nieces/nephews)

1) I never said that.

2) Manhattan != Bronx. DUCY?

Have fun winning your strawman argument!

They can barely fill the place because it is built on infill swampland next to I-95 in the Bronx, and there are multiple qualifications to be able to live there. The maintenance charges alone are ~$700+.

Really? That was $250K over 18 years. Pretty sure if/when I have a kid it's going to cost me a multiple of that.

Not sure what "number that came out last week" you're referring to, but I can't see many people in America spending < $250K over the non-adult lifetime of their child.

Oddly, some of us at work were recently discussing having kids/not, and that happened to be exactly the number I pulled out of the air.

I asked some of the parents, "wouldn't it be easier to just set $250,000 on fire, and not have to deal with a screaming child?"

lol daycare in nyc is ~20k/yr

You don't need these, if you're concerned about healthy. Limit the meat you buy and alternate it with seafood.

Also, you don't need vitamin pills at all, if you're eating meats, fruits (fresh and dried), vegetables, and grains.

1 bottle of cologne lasts me approximately 10 years.

lol.

Could explain the Cologne purchase. Lack of confidence due to being under endowed.

ROFL. if middle class white people were afraid to move to non-white neighborhoods, you'd still be able to get a 3br in Bed Stuy for $900/mo.

Gentrification doesn't start with middle class families moving into poor all black or hispanic neighborhoods. It starts with young people without kids (most of them, but not all, white) who can't afford anyplace else moving in. They are generally the artsy alternative types who don't mind risking a higher crime rate or dealing with a rundown apt if the location is close to where they'd really want to be (if prices were no object).

Only after those new residents have established themselves and attracted new businesses, more effective policing, and (to be honest) even more white faces will run of the mill middle class whites even consider the neighborhood.

I repeat, the white middle class (especially those with kids) will not move into a 90% minority neighborhood, especially one surrounded by an even bigger all-minority neighborhood and that is far away from what would be considered a desirable part of town.

For instance, Williamsburg became attractive to young non-affluent whites (many artsy types or people just starting careers) as they got priced out of Manhattan. Then the changing character of the area attracted middle class whites who drove up prices.

Bed-Stuy didn't start becoming attractive to young whites until those young whites got priced out of Williamsburg. And it didn't start becoming attractive to middle class whites until enough young whites had moved in to change the character of the area. Even then, the middle class whites are likely only going to consider the parts of Bed-Sty that have the lowest minority population (which will be the parts closest to other, more desirable neighborhoods).

never noticed the $12/mo of mouthwash on OP's list. Thats like 2-3 of the largest bottles of moughwash every month. Olive oil/cologne will always be the best.