first star wars movie where i just got bored midway thru and bailed early. Lando was good, love me some chewie, han was ok but felt like a different personality/character than Ford's take. Villain was a joke, other characters were lol.

Story was dumb. zero surprises. Disney needs to shake things up imo. Glad it bombed as maybe they'll actually do something unique now in future stand alones

Fyp.

Wrt RotJ, my enthusiasm for the film has cooled over time, but on reflection it's still a top 5 movie - there is just no legitimate way the prequals or new trilogy films are better, although I think you can perhaps make the case that the standalones are better.

ANH
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RotJ
R1
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AotC/TPM
TLJ

Star wars is pretty overrated now but Disney is currently better at producing films than George Lucas could, no doubt. If Lucas was still in charge we would be waiting 5 years for the next disappointment.

It has turned into a turn and churn franchise but that is still better than what Lucas gave us with episodes 1-3.

I still hope kennedy get fired, it s unbelievable that disney cannot find someone competent to run the franchise.

When they look at the invoice will they even consider her incompetent?

TLJ seems more hated than the prequel turds, Solo seem to have a bad start so far.
Right now star wars universe is transformers level of bad imo.

Just saw Solo. It was OK. The guy who plays Han Solo isn't terrible but he has a smile like an insurance salesman. Nobody really rises to the level of likeable. As a result the film feels a bit lacking in heart, lifeless. It's a perfectly OK film though. "Competent" is the word that comes to mind. I think they did a good job at situating the film obviously within the Star Wars universe, yet not being too constrained by it. The Empire and the Rebellion recede into the distance and we get a smaller story, which is nice. I feel like this could have risen to the level of "good" merely with the addition of charismatic actors. Neither Han Solo Guy nor Emilia Clarke are capable of carrying the movie. Donald Glover is great and the film has more of a sparkle to it when he's on screen, but he can't carry it by himself.

Discussion (and I can see both sides of the argument, and am undecided myself):

Would Kevin Smith being in charge be a good or a bad thing?

Problem : Too much fan service not enough character development

Solution : Put kevin smith in charge??

If you're wishcasting just hope that simon pegg gets put in charge. He crushed the star trek film he wrote and then you might get edgar wright to direct one which would be pretty awesome.

EXTREMELY UNPOPULAR OPINION:

They should've just let Lucas keep making them

This is not the problem. On the contrary.

THIS is the problem:

As long as he doesn't direct himself it would be a net positive compared to Kennedy who must be a pain in the ass to work with.

I don't think "too much fan service" is bad, it's more a matter of "the right kind of fan service". Low-effort stuff like the dumb five second R2/3PO cameo in R1 is a good example of something that can just go by the wayside. Whereas something like the inclusion of Red/Gold leader into the Scarif space battle, from that same movie, doesn't quite scream "Look what we did!" as much and comes off much cooler IMO.

I think Smith would have a good handle on which is which, at least.

PSA: David Cronenberg still alive and working.

They need to get more unique writer/director combos so the stand alones have a unique feel/personality to them. So far all the new Star Wars films are super bland and could all be the same movie. The biggest road block is KK is unwilling to take any risks like KFeige would at Marvel would with Thor/GOTG/BP.

I don't think The Last Jedi was that bad especially when TFA was so derivative. I'd rather watch Rian Johnson's next trilogy then another JJ Abram's re-hash.

I don't think KK will ever do anything unique like an R-rated Star Wars or a bold write/director choice, and they have major problems in China...so its likely we just get more of the same till one of these films massively under performs and they bring in someone new to oversee them.

Also they really need to up the villain quality.

At least we will get EW as Kenobi in a future stand alone which has some hope given his acting chops...and it will likely have a Clint Eastwood man with no name spaghetti space western story line

Yea competent is a fair assesment, which is why I liked it, apart from a bit of weak ending, their were no moments of sheer disappointment like there were in TFA and the TLJ. I think both both those films had higher highs as someone said, but jfc did they have lower lows, and low lows out do high highs imo.



Han was the first Disney Wars film that showed you just a tiny glimpse of how off the charts amazing sauce awesome a film set in the SW universe could be if it was handled with maturity, intelligence and real creativity.

The thing with TLJ is, I dont get how anyone cant utterly hate on that film for the sheer just does not work of the central plot line, e.g. the space ship chase. Its impossible to watch that film without the jarring stupidity of that plot line poking its fingers straight into your eyes, its impossible to look past, whatever else happens in the film is largely irrelevant but anyway is pretty much on a level with that plot device.

There was so much that was extremely dumb about TLJ. It lost me almost immediately, when Dameron was scolded for successfully destroying a huge capital ship with loss of a few dozen light craft. That'd be like losing a few dozen fighter planes while sinking an American supercarrier; if that's not a successful trade the Rebels might as well pack it in right there. That's even ignoring the idiotic turgidness of the bombers themselves. But that's the worldview of this movie, where bravery and initiative is slapped down and unquestioning obedience to rigid authority is demanded. If they wanted to set that situation up, fine. Show us an actual Pyrrhic victory, not a clearly favorable exchange. So dumb.

He loves Star Wars, which is more than you can say about the "Kill it if you have to" crowd. But yeah, he's a super fan boy, which is why I'm on the fence on this hypothetical scenario. I still can't see how he'd do worse than them, though.

Kennedy goes so far back in Hollywood she has like, J Edgar Hoover level of power.

She probably has video of Bob Iger being spit roasted by a couple of Hell's Angels.

She stays.

I remember watching his review of one of the new ones on Youtube. It's 90 minutes long or something ridiculous like that (I watched maybe 10 of those) and he starts by saying how he liked the film. Then he immediately goes into little details that he liked. Something along the lines of (paraphrasing) "In the beginning they showed me something I hadn't seen before in a Star Wars film, and I thought that was good"

This picking out details he liked was very telling that he hated the thing, but is just overall way too invested in his fandom to ever truly **** on a Star Wars movie.

So yeah, he's a fringe case, plus we would maybe have to endure Ben Affleck as the new Jedi or something.

I wasn't under the illusion that a thread on 2p2 would convince Hollywood to put Kevin Smith in charge. We're all well aware that she's here to stay. We're discussing hypotheticals.

Rofl. He hated it.

Personally, I think it's more important that my son and his ilk like these movies than Star Wars nerds aficionados. The biggest curse you could put on Star Wars is to try to make it Important. Kevin Smith directing would be an absolute disaster.

I posted it at the time but the writers have pretty clearly exclusively learned about the world from movies, that entire sequence made no ****ing sense.

I'm not talking about the "magnetic bombs" thing or the "open to space but not vacuum?!?!" or "why is the Resistance a rag tag group of dip****s while the Rebellion was a professional military", but just as a film, within the context.

What they were trying to do is establish that Poe is a wildcard who gets results and also vaguely remind the audience of The Empire Strikes Back, but because of raw ****ing incompetence they made it seem like the plan all along was to have Poe BE a wildcard who gets results? Then Leia randomly looses her nerve and wants him to withdraw, but it's too late for that. Was she supposed to come off like a coward?

Even just within the movie, they should've introduced Dern THEN and also had her be right. Because as is the movie sets up 2 different Poe vs. lady boss conflicts, which maens movie sends some real mixed messages about when you should disobey orders


1) Poe leads his first mutiny against Leia and the movie says it was a success. I think. If it was supposed to be a failure then that's even more confusing. Poe suffers no apparent personal or professional consequences for this. Rose's sacrifices her life to complete her mission.
LESSON LEARNED: Sometimes you need to risk it all for the greater good.

2) Poe leads his second mutiny against Dern's character because she's keeping her plan a secret from some large percentage of the crew for.... reasons. The movie presents Dern's plan as good even though it seems terrible and works out poorly? Like even if it went perfectly according to plan they'd just be stuck on that rock with a First Order fleet in orbit.
LESSON LEARNED: Your superiors know better than you, trust the process, play it safe

The movie then returns to those themes with:

3) Dern staying behind when Leia thought she was going with them to kamikaze the bad guys in a geometrically unlikely sequence that also seems inconsistent with how hyperspace is otherwise presented as teleportation. But she saves the ****ing day by taking out most of the enemy ships
LESSON LEARNED: On further review, noble sacrifice is great, take risks, do what must be done even if it costs you your life

4) Rose and Finn and a bunch of redshirts go on what is straight up a suicide mission to buy time for the rest of their doomed outpost. At the last minute before Finn succeeds Rose stops him with a strategy that tbh seemed like it had a pretty good chance of killing them both? Jesus this was an incompetently plotted movie and I'm not entirely sure how they didn't immediately get squashed by an AT-AT, but they do survive and then Jedi Deus ex Machina everything.
LESSON LEARNED: Actually nevermind, if you get sent on a suicide mission **** that **** because what if some wizards come along and make everything better? You'd feel real dumb for being dead.


To the extent you can synthesize those, bravery and initiative aren't just bad, actual ****ing cowardice is celebrated. Rose sabotages the attack run! Literally destroys the 2 rebel speeders in the best position to stop the laser drill. **** Darth Jar-Jar my new fan theory is that Rose is an Imperial spy.