This is exactly what happened.

Now I want OP to stay with her just for my amusement, but no hard feelings if you leave her OP, mkay?

This is very insightful, I am impressed! I do believe that you have summed up her thinking very well. OP, you should read this carefully...

In case it hasn't registered yet, I will say it again.

G T F O of that relationship!!!

You have no moral obligation, and I am starting to get the sense that you have some self esteem issue as well if you think (at an unconscious level) that this is the best kind of relationship that you deserve. Do you honestly think that this is as good as it gets for you in terms of having a gf?

YES breaking up now IS going to hurt, but guess what, the longer you delay it the more it is going to hurt and the more damage it is going to do to you. You are a poker player ffs, you should get that you have two plays, hurt some now or hurt a lot more later on with additional damage that might be done to you. GET OUT!

You guys are too judgmental, maybe the GF had it right all along and the OP just needs to get better and accept her kind, healing ways and become immersed in the art of plate fu.

Manipulation. As has been previously said, BPDs are excellent at lying and manipulating to make everyone believe you are the bad guy & she's an angel. Exactly what my ex-wife would do - focus on things I did that had zero to do with why we were there while simultaneously minimizing her role or her mental/violence issues.

You need to make it clear that you aren't there for COUPLES THERAPY. You are there for instense therapy for her BPD. That's it. If that is truly the reason you went (which it seems that way so far in the thread), than you should have stopped her mid-sentence and made that clear.


More manipulation and minimizing her issues. This is classic. She's an adult, it is NEVER ok for her to throw a plate at you.

Let me guess - during the drive home, you were either lectured about how to not bring up those things with the therapist again or about your issues (whatever nonsense she brought up during the session)? She's slowly breaking you down bro. Little by little, she'll mold you into what she wants.

You've been with her 4 months. You have no obligation. I would say try to break it off gracefully & explain that you can still be friends and you'll be there for her/support her, etc - but that simply isn't possible for these kinds of people. I understand feeling guilty/bad/whatever, but are you willing to waste your life on the small chance that she'll be able to manage this disorder? I don't think you realize the magnitude of what you're getting into. My ex-wife (together 15+, married 12, 2 kids) was in therapy and on medication (when she took it) and it was still a NIGHTMARE. You wouldn't even believe the stories I have. It's hard to get away and see how bad things are when you're fully entrenched. 4 months is not fully entrenched. Get out now.

In my experience, this behavior can happen at the flip of a switch from nothing even immediately after doing something they "enjoy". Example: I spent a few hours at a pumpkin patch with wife & kiddos, had a great time - zero issues, kids behavior was great, etc. Get in the car, driving home (2 lane road, 50mph), lunatic grabs the wheel and tries to pull it off the road and we almost hit head on with another vehicle. After that she's punched me while driving and both kids in the back. I can't even remember now what she was pissed about after she calmed down and told me, but it wasn't anything from that day. My point is that filling her time with "enjoyable activities" won't help, if that's what you're suggesting - not that it's even practical anyway.

This was not true in my case. We are both very intelligent people that come from intelligent and successful families with a great support structure. It didn't matter. All that mattered was her emotion. Nothing changed, it never got better for long durations - over time, it became worse.

That all sounds great & everything, but I really don't think you have any idea what you're talking about. OP - doesn't this seem like a lot of work for someone you've been with for 4 months? "Deeply loved" TruthSayer? Really? It's been 4 months.

This is exactly right. Manipulation. After a while, you'll just agree to these crazy feelings she has, because it's easier than arguing. And once you have kids, etc - it's easier than leaving and starting over.

I've read through this post, and here's what I have to add:

Years ago I dated a guy who I believe had this very problem. Only he didn't go to a therapist, and I could never figure out what exactly his issue(s) were. The one thing that tied all of his craziness up in a sweet little bow, was that he blamed everything...EVERYTHING...on other people. He was failing at work? The boss hated him. The car died? It was his ex-wife's fault because she got the nicer car in their divorce. This man blamed everything that ever happened to him on other people.

And he was a master at manipulation. No matter what I did or said, it was the wrong thing. Even if I did exactly as he told/asked me to do. I was a very independent woman when I met him. As our relationship progressed, I began to question my own judgment and sanity. He started using the "If you really love me, you'll do this for me" argument any time I balked at his requests...many of which were unreasonable or just plain unattainable. I think he may have had a narcissism issue as well.

Just imagine yourself questioning every little thing you do. Every day. Will it please your partner? Upset them so much that they'll go off the deep end? My relationship was exactly like the book title. I was walking on eggshells. Even during the good times, he could snap at a moment's notice. Looking back, it was the most horrific relationship I've ever had. It never got better. The harder I tried to make things work, the worse it got. The relationship ended when he dumped me for another woman. In turn, he did all the same things to her.

Get out now.

Everything in me wants to rage at the OP for what an idiot he is but honestly it's one of those things that you just gotta learn on your own, i think.

I mean she's probably several degrees hotter than what he is used to so that isn't helping things. But no amount of common sense advice is going to help him at this point. He's ensnared. These types of people are very good at what they do and i'm sure OP was a perfect mark or she wouldn't have bothered.

I feel the same way, but to his credit, in his last post he did seem to understand he needs to get out or at least that he should get out. He just doesn't have the strength to get out. That was my impression anyway. I hope as he reads this thread and about BPD that he'll become more and more aware of just how ****ed up the situation is and eventually build up the courage to gtfo. I hope that's very soon.

I don't think it is responsible to diagnose a man with BPD just because he was a little nutty and manipulative. Maybe he had Asperger's syndrome?

****ed up people tend to stick together.

I have been doing a lot of thinking, and I can't help but feel that a lot of you are right and that there is a high chance that I have some sort of PD as well.

Growing up, I was an only child, was not abused, but neglected as a kid, and my Dad always seemed dissapointed that I wasn't growing up to be an intellectual like he was, and my Mum wanted a girl, and has even said to me that if she could rewind time, she "probably would have had an abortion". My primary caretaker up until I was 11, was my Grandma. Up until Year 9, I was only 5'1", and had severe confidence issues because of that, and was severely bullied because of it. About midway through that year, I had a quick growth spurt over a short period of time, and by the end of the year was 5'8"-(my current height). This gave me a lot more confidence, and the taunts got less and less because of it.


I started playing bass. Started hanging out with more people, and some mates and I formed a pop-punk cover band-(we were terrible) doing Blink-182 and Green Day tracks. It gave me lots of confidence though as we were playing house-parties for other students, an it boosted my cred so to speak.
I met a girl who I really liked around this time when I was 15, and so I officially had my first girlfriend, but then at the age of 16 and a half, my steady girlfriend of a year and a half told me she was pregnant. I was completely shocked, but I said I would support her with whatever decision she made, in the end she had an abortion, and she wasn't the same after that, and decided that it wasn't going to work anymore, and broke it off with me.


Pretty much since then in the dating scene, I have been in completely passionless relationships, and this has been dating many diferent kinds of women. I was cheated on by two different girlfriends over 1 year when I was 18, which definately affected me. I moved in on my own to my late Grandmas house which I inherited. I started grinding online, getting drunk and high, mainly completely alone. Really, to this day, I only really have two close friends-(one of them my gf now absolutely hates, and I am worried she will want me to kick him out of my life if I continue the relationship).


About 6 months later, I realised that I had let myself go a bit, but was ready to start dating again, so I started going to the gym a lot, got into shape, and started going on more dates, but again, I never had a connection to anyone I dated, and the couple of women who I thought there could be something there, well, they saw my lifestyle, and they pretty much wrote me off as a loser that wasn't worth any more of their time. One hung around for a while, but she was only there because I was easy to boss around and get things from, and I was lonely and horny and dumb. Things she exploited. When I moved on from her, I started drinking more, and I felt depressed a lot. The more monotony and repetitive-(grind, drink, repeat) pattern settled in, the more depressed I got. Then I met my gf of today at the gym, and there was an instant connection that I hadn't really ever felt. The more I got to know her, the more attracted to her I was, we both had very simmilar interests, we had the same music tastes, we both had crap childhoods, we both were considered rejects as far as society is concerned, we had the best sex ever, she accepted me for who I was and vice versa, and I felt truly happy for the first time in like 6 years and it just felt right.

This is why I am so hesitant to break it off. I don't want to go back to that total monotonous slump with no real happiness in my life at all, and I don't know how I can break up with someone that-(I know it's only been 4 months, but I havent felt this way ever) I love...

I am thinking I might see a therapist on my own-(a seperate one without telling my gf), and talk some things out with him/her.

This is abuse.

This is abuse.

This may have been abuse.

OP,

god almighty, you are both walking clinical psych dissertations.

WAG: you are attracted to her because she accepted you for who you are.

Make no mistake: she does not accept you for who you are.

Re your seeing a therapist: good idea, but don't hide it from her. And do not see the same guy that she's seeing or even someone in the same group practice. And you guys really shouldn't be accompanying each other to one's therapy session--you've seen how that will go.

I'm not sure if you have a PD, but you clearly have some issues. It's good that you're going to deal with it. As Cry Me A River pointed out, those things are all emotionally abusive. You're still very young, so it's good that you are tackling these things now.

OP,
I commend you for starting this thread and being brave to open up about yourself. That being said, there are reasons(unhealthy ones) the two of you are together and they are quite clear to those of us looking from the outside. By posting this thread, you realize this is not a good situation but are looking for some sort of justification to stay in it. There is none. You need to take care of yourself first and foremost. Once you are ok, then you can start worrying about relationships with other people. You know what you have to do. Good luck.

P.S. Don't confuse drama with passion. For the most part, life is boring. Boring is good. Crazy, not so much.

OP may need to deal with depression as much as anything else. Also, his depression definitely makes him super vulnerable to her.

OP - good idea seeing a professional about your own issues.

Now for my UNEDUCATED opinion merely based on what you said above. You sound like a fairly intelligent guy who didn't have the best relationship with his parents. You sounded like a pretty normal kid in high school who got bullied a bit, but then that changed. You were provided a situation (getting grandmother's house) where you could play poker and drink/get high with little financial consequence. This led to a pretty common occurrence among grinders which is losing contact with a lot of your social network. This in turn led to a bit of depression (although from what you have said just sounds situational). You dated a few people but no one really clicked for you (very common) until this girl.

Thing is OP - you realized you were letting yourself go and you got up and did something about it. You started going to the gym and went on dates. So you have the ability to change the way you are living. Unfortunately, this didn't end all that well for you and you ended up back in the same rut.

My advice is this: Playing poker for a living doesn't sound like it is for you. It seems like it makes you isolate yourself from those around you which can breed depression, slothfulness etc.

Most importantly is you will find someone else if you choose not to stay with this girl. This girl isn't the only person in the entire world that will make you happy. Just think of the odds of that being the case.

The other thing I'd like to point out is these feelings you have for this girl WILL change over time no matter what happens here. It is still early in the relationship for you. Things are thrilling in the early stages of a relationship, butterflies etc etc. Everything is new. After a few years though this starts to change. Not necessarily for the worse, sometimes for the better and that is how you know you have found the right girl long term.

Early on in a relationship it is often about sex, primal attraction, excitement. Not to say you don't have feelings of companionship and other things as well. But it is later in a relationship where things start to change. You can still enjoy sex, find your partner attractive etc but these are no longer the most important things. What's more important is the way they make you feel emotionally. If you are given great news, they are the person you are most excited to share it with. If something good happens you are just as happy as had it happened to you. They become easily your best friend and most important person in your life. You can tell them anything and they'll be accepting of you no matter what. Now imagine that person has BPD. Can you be sure they really care about that promotion you got at work? What if you can't tell them something in confidence in fear they'll throw it back in your face during one of your heated one way exchanges? Maybe they'll do it in public. Being in a relationship with someone with BPD may make sense when you analyze the important things in a new relationship, but you better think long and hard about whether or not they'll be able to satisfy those requirements once the butterflies are gone.

Michael, you are probably not going to like hearing this but the mindset you describe above will prevent you from having any successful relationship. What I mean is that you are using a relationship as a mean to evade some issues that you have to resolve first. It sounds cliche but you can't love or have a successful relationship until you learn to be cool with yourself and your life. A relationship should enrich an already happy existence as a single man, not to fill a void.

I commend you for having the courage of making the first step of creating this thread and seeking help, stay on that path, break it off with this girl and work on yourself. You don't owe her **** and you and your happiness should be your highest priority right now. You are still young and I can guarantee you, once you get to the point where you love your life and yourself being single, you will have no trouble meeting a girl that will truly make you happy.

Find someone you can talk to individually, even if you decide to continue couples therapy with your g/f.

As others have stated, it seems like you have things you could work on that will improve YOU, which is really all you can control. Once you are more comfortable with yourself, you might find that it's easier to develop the connection you really want with someone who is also healthy (or at least healthier).

I don't say this in a disparaging way, but you're still pretty young. It's not at all unusual to be struggling a bit right now to figure out who you are, who you want to be, and how to deal with crap from your past. Give yourself a break, talk to someone who can help give you some skills to improve yourself mentally, and see how things look on the other side.

He was more than "a little" nutty and manipulative. This guy had me cut off contact with my family and friends. He convinced me that no one...NO ONE...cared about me more than him. He had me believing that it was just us two against the world. And oh, the promises he made to me. He broke every last one of them, but blamed it all on me or other people. Between the promises, the lies, and the overall crappy treatment, this guy was some piece of work. But he happily went through life not taking any responsibility for any of his behaviors. Perhaps it is the wrong diagnosis for him. But I'm telling you that he had something terribly wrong with him, and it sounds an awful lot like BPD. I wouldn't wish that type of relationship on my worst enemy. You don't know if you're coming or going with that person. Their whole demeanor can change on a dime, and they never want to come out and say that anything they say or do is their fault.

Have you read about NPD? It might fit better. Did he think very highly of himself? Did he exaggerate and embellish his own achievements? Did he think everyone was jealous of him?

OP, how exactly did you meet this girl at the gym?

OP,

You don't seem like you're particularly well equipped to handle things when she decides you are her enemy and the worst person in the world and gets back at you by ****ing one of your friends and turning him against you after realizing he is her soulmate and the most wonderful person in the world.

which of his two friends do you think will win (?) this lottery?

It's good that you are thinking about you and where you need to be.. this girl stepping on your psyche isn't going to help you get over the past.

Lotta made up statistics ITT. Paging Dids!