I refuse to put eggs or butter in my bread so that eliminates any pullman recipe I've ever seen. I think lid off pullman isn't that unusual--you can even buy them on amazon without lids. It gives way prettier breads than my shallower loaf pans. Here's my bread crush's



Will see how the interior turns out and maybe try lid on next time. Doing the final rise at room temp is a game changer.

Color looks amazing. At the very least it's going to make some killer grilled cheeses.
Just imagine if you fortified it with some egg and butter ;-)

Seems like when I try rando enriched doughs online they always come out a little dry.

Do egg and butter substitutes react differently? Have you tried them?

It's not really a "bread" but I have a banana bread recipe that uses coconut oil instead of butter. Comes out super moist.
I've done plenty of brioche recipes that are just too greasy but I think it's more my terrible technique rather than the recipe.
Surprised they come out dry for you.
Over baking?

Gregorio,
How much bread a week are you doing? Do you mind giving an overview of your starter maintenance? I'm always on the fence to make a starter and the starter maintenance is always the thing that sways me away from doing it. If I did one loaf a week that would be a lot for me.

When I keep my starter in the fridge I take it out the day before I'm going to make some dough and feed it 1:1:1 with about 5g each starter:flour:water in the morning and afternoon, and then feed it about 1:3:3 overnight. I build the levain the next day and make enough extra so I have 10-15g left over that I feed and then put back in the fridge.

I bake about 3 times a week and usually keep my starter out for half the week feeding twice a day and then put it in the fridge and take a break for a few days. It can easily go a week in the fridge without feeding and become really active again within a day after taking it out. I don't notice any difference between the first time I bake after taking it out of the fridge and when I bake after I've been leaving it out and feeding it for half the week. You could probably just feed it twice instead of three times before building the levain.

Cool, thanks.
I like the part of keeping it in the fridge for 1 week with only 1 feeding ;-)

Help. This is my first attempt at baking bread. I got something pretty delicious (with butter) out of it but it ended up tasting more like fluffier mantou (dense bread?) than fluffy bread.

What do I need to do to:
Get inside fluffier?
A more solid, and preferably more brown, crust?

Looks underproofed. You doing sourdough or yeast?

I like to see it rise at least 50%. It needs to rise and get gassy to become a lighter bread.

Darker crust comes from baking longer but I've noticed underproofed dough doesnt brown as well.

It’s underbaked

I followed recipe and left it in the oven at 450 for like 40 minutes total then another 10 because it looked under baked. The crust is actually pretty hard just not browned and I am not sure if it’s because it’s underproofed. (Not really even sure what proofing means)

I just used yeast.

I used this recipe.

https://www.gimmesomeoven.com/no-knead-bread/

Proofing = rise. Your recipe calls for The amount of time you need to let the dough rise depends on the temperature of the dough.* Your recipe has two very inexact instructions (actually 3. Cups are a terrible measurement. Always use recipes that are in grams): room temperature, and 12 to 18 hours. If your room temperature is 70F it will take substantially longer to rise than if it is 76F.** So if your dough temp was 72 and you let it rise for 12 hours it will probably be under-proofed. If dough temp was 78 and you let it rise for 18 hours it will probably by over-proofed. Figuring out when a dough is properly proofed is the biggest challenge in baking.

Bro says let it rise 50%. With yeast breads I let it rise at least double. But I also have nfi when it's actually risen double because that it tough to eyeball. I know when I keep my sourdough dough around 74F (I take dough temp every 1/2hr to hour) it will be fully proofed after about 6:45, and I don't try to judge what percentage it's risen, I just know from having tried various different times and ending up with lots of over- and under-proofed loaves. My first recipe called for a 4 hour proof. It was terribly under-proofed. Someone (bro?) told me to push it longer. 5 hours was still under-proofed. It finally turned out okay at 6 hours.

IMO it is much better to err on the side of over-proofing. An over-proofed dough will not hold its shape very well, but it will turn out fine inside and be delicious. An under-proofed dough will be gummy inside and have a very uneven crumb. If you use a loaf pan and over-proof, not problem at all, because the pan holds the shape for you.

*It also depends on the amount of yeast—more yeast, less time to rise, hence the "Faster (2-Hour) No Knead Bread" also on the page you linked—but it's easy to control how much yeast you use, whereas dough temp is a much more finicky variable.

**I like to proof my dough at 74F, so in the winter I struggle to keep the dough that warm, and in the summer I struggle to keep it that cool.

I proofed for 12 hours and my AC is set to 72F. lol. gregorio nailed it?

Think I didn't let it rise enough so it got oven spring that I try to avoid in a pan loaf. Hope it's not under-fermented inside.

Ugh I'm out of practice. Think I didn't let it proof enough. Crumb much more dense than I wanted but like Grizy, even below average homemade bread is still damn tasty once you toast and butter it.

Are you baking in a Dutch oven?

Yes.

Are you not doing these in the pullman or just not using the lid?

Today's loaf turned out great. Really happy with the color. I'm just using the same recipe I used for my batards (80/15/5 white/ww/rye, but with AP instead of BF, and only 70% hydration). Leave it in fridge overnight before shaping. Then shape in the morning and put in pullman and let rise for 6 hours or so.

Did one in a pullman without the lid and the other in a basic, wider loaf pan.

LOL

Amazing!

Got the pullman figured out





80AP : 15WW : 5 rye at 70% hydration. Left is 450g flour, right is 500g. Bulk ferment and then fridge overnight before shaping and putting in to pans the next day and letting it fully rise before baking.

Defrosted my last pullman loaf yesterday and was thinking if you were still going down the path.

Looks awesome!

Going to start a pastrami brine.
Anyone have a good recipe for NY deli rye?

I use this with a few changes

http://breadbasketcase.blogspot.com/...bread.html?m=1

I use a little more rye, and change to proportions to fit it in my pullman no lid (see link for other instructions):

Sponge
95 grams bread flour
95 grams rye flour (using orig recipe proportions it would be 104.5 BF and 85.5 rye)
7/16 teaspoon instant yeast
1/2 tablespoon sugar
1 tablespoon (20g) molasses (can sub with sugar)
1/2 tablespoon (10.5 grams) barley malt syrup [I sub with 1 tbsp barley malt powder, but I'm sure it fine without it]
323 water, at room temperature

Flour Mixture
310 grams bread flour
1/2 teaspoon instant yeast
1.5 - 2 tablespoons caraway seeds (or none if you don't like them)
1 + 3/8 teaspoon salt

Dough and Baking [ I leave all this out]
1/2 tablespoon (0.25 ounces, 6.7 grams) vegetable oil
about 2 teaspoons (about 0.5 ounces, 16 grams) cornmeal for sprinkling

Oh, that recipe leaves out most important part. From actual bread bible recipe:

For the best flavor development, in Step 2, instead of

Try
When I do this, after I take it out of fridge and mix, the "Let the dough rise" step takes me about an hour or two longer than in the recipe since it takes a while to come up to room temp, so more like 3-4 hours instead of 1.5-2