Ask me about being an airline pilot or flying in general
05-25-2021
, 10:11 AM
Re: your UFO story...yeah, but are you reputable? 
No idea what caused me to think of this when waking up this morning. Is it possible for an aircraft to lose communication entirely? If so, how would that be handled?
Seems like you'd want to get down as soon as possible. At the same time, without communication with ATC, one couldn't necessarily safely get into the landing pattern, I imagine.
My guess is this is a academic question, that it never happens. Communications are probably right after engine power in terms of priority andd being redudant.
No idea what caused me to think of this when waking up this morning. Is it possible for an aircraft to lose communication entirely? If so, how would that be handled?
Seems like you'd want to get down as soon as possible. At the same time, without communication with ATC, one couldn't necessarily safely get into the landing pattern, I imagine.
My guess is this is a academic question, that it never happens. Communications are probably right after engine power in terms of priority andd being redudant.
05-25-2021
, 10:40 AM
Quote:
Re: your UFO story...yeah, but are you reputable?
No idea what caused me to think of this when waking up this morning. Is it possible for an aircraft to lose communication entirely? If so, how would that be handled?
Seems like you'd want to get down as soon as possible. At the same time, without communication with ATC, one couldn't necessarily safely get into the landing pattern, I imagine.
My guess is this is a academic question, that it never happens. Communications are probably right after engine power in terms of priority and being redundant.
No idea what caused me to think of this when waking up this morning. Is it possible for an aircraft to lose communication entirely? If so, how would that be handled?
Seems like you'd want to get down as soon as possible. At the same time, without communication with ATC, one couldn't necessarily safely get into the landing pattern, I imagine.
My guess is this is a academic question, that it never happens. Communications are probably right after engine power in terms of priority and being redundant.
Beyond that, there are procedures outlined in the AIM (Aeronautical Information Manual, formerly known as the Airman's Information Manual).
You can click on the link above to see the entire discussion, but I'll excerpt a few here. Here is what you should do if you're in VFR conditions (aka VMC):
Quote:
If the failure occurs in VFR conditions, or if VFR conditions are encountered after the failure, each pilot must continue the flight under VFR and land as soon as practicable.
NOTE-
This procedure also applies when two‐way radio failure occurs while operating in Class A airspace. The primary objective of this provision in 14 CFR Section 91.185 is to preclude extended IFR operation by these aircraft within the ATC system. Pilots should recognize that operation under these conditions may unnecessarily as well as adversely affect other users of the airspace, since ATC may be required to reroute or delay other users in order to protect the failure aircraft. However, it is not intended that the requirement to “land as soon as practicable” be construed to mean “as soon as possible.” Pilots retain the prerogative of exercising their best judgment and are not required to land at an unauthorized airport, at an airport unsuitable for the type of aircraft flown, or to land only minutes short of their intended destination.
NOTE-
This procedure also applies when two‐way radio failure occurs while operating in Class A airspace. The primary objective of this provision in 14 CFR Section 91.185 is to preclude extended IFR operation by these aircraft within the ATC system. Pilots should recognize that operation under these conditions may unnecessarily as well as adversely affect other users of the airspace, since ATC may be required to reroute or delay other users in order to protect the failure aircraft. However, it is not intended that the requirement to “land as soon as practicable” be construed to mean “as soon as possible.” Pilots retain the prerogative of exercising their best judgment and are not required to land at an unauthorized airport, at an airport unsuitable for the type of aircraft flown, or to land only minutes short of their intended destination.
And this is what you should do if the failure occurs while in IFR conditions (aka IMC):
Quote:
If the failure occurs in IFR conditions, or if subparagraph 2 above cannot be complied with, each pilot must continue the flight according to the following:
Route
By the route assigned in the last ATC clearance received;
If being radar vectored, by the direct route from the point of radio failure to the fix, route, or airway specified in the vector clearance;
In the absence of an assigned route, by the route that ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance; or
In the absence of an assigned route or a route that ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance by the route filed in the flight plan.
Altitude. At the HIGHEST of the following altitudes or flight levels FOR THE ROUTE SEGMENT BEING FLOWN:
The altitude or flight level assigned in the last ATC clearance received;
The minimum altitude (converted, if appropriate, to minimum flight level as prescribed in 14 CFR Section 91.121(c)) for IFR operations; or
The altitude or flight level ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance.
NOTE-
The intent of the rule is that a pilot who has experienced two‐way radio failure should select the appropriate altitude for the particular route segment being flown and make the necessary altitude adjustments for subsequent route segments. If the pilot received an “expect further clearance” containing a higher altitude to expect at a specified time or fix, maintain the highest of the following altitudes until that time/fix:
(1) the last assigned altitude; or
(2) the minimum altitude/flight level for IFR operations.
Upon reaching the time/fix specified, the pilot should commence climbing to the altitude advised to expect. If the radio failure occurs after the time/fix specified, the altitude to be expected is not applicable and the pilot should maintain an altitude consistent with 1 or 2 above. If the pilot receives an “expect further clearance” containing a lower altitude, the pilot should maintain the highest of 1 or 2 above until that time/fix specified in subparagraph (c) Leave clearance limit, below.
EXAMPLE-
A pilot experiencing two‐way radio failure at an assigned altitude of 7,000 feet is cleared along a direct route which will require a climb to a minimum IFR altitude of 9,000 feet, should climb to reach 9,000 feet at the time or place where it becomes necessary (see 14 CFR Section 91.177(b)). Later while proceeding along an airway with an MEA of 5,000 feet, the pilot would descend to 7,000 feet (the last assigned altitude), because that altitude is higher than the MEA.
A pilot experiencing two‐way radio failure while being progressively descended to lower altitudes to begin an approach is assigned 2,700 feet until crossing the VOR and then cleared for the approach. The MOCA along the airway is 2,700 feet and MEA is 4,000 feet. The aircraft is within 22 NM of the VOR. The pilot should remain at 2,700 feet until crossing the VOR because that altitude is the minimum IFR altitude for the route segment being flown.
The MEA between a and b:
5,000 feet. The MEA between b and c: 5,000 feet. The MEA between c and d: 11,000 feet. The MEA between d and e: 7,000 feet. A pilot had been cleared via a, b, c, d, to e. While flying between a and b the assigned altitude was 6,000 feet and the pilot was told to expect a clearance to 8,000 feet at b. Prior to receiving the higher altitude assignment, the pilot experienced two‐way failure. The pilot would maintain 6,000 to b, then climb to 8,000 feet (the altitude advised to expect). The pilot would maintain 8,000 feet, then climb to 11,000 at c, or prior to c if necessary to comply with an MCA at c. (14 CFR Section 91.177(b).) Upon reaching d, the pilot would descend to 8,000 feet (even though the MEA was 7,000 feet), as 8,000 was the highest of the altitude situations stated in the rule (14 CFR Section 91.185).
Route
By the route assigned in the last ATC clearance received;
If being radar vectored, by the direct route from the point of radio failure to the fix, route, or airway specified in the vector clearance;
In the absence of an assigned route, by the route that ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance; or
In the absence of an assigned route or a route that ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance by the route filed in the flight plan.
Altitude. At the HIGHEST of the following altitudes or flight levels FOR THE ROUTE SEGMENT BEING FLOWN:
The altitude or flight level assigned in the last ATC clearance received;
The minimum altitude (converted, if appropriate, to minimum flight level as prescribed in 14 CFR Section 91.121(c)) for IFR operations; or
The altitude or flight level ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance.
NOTE-
The intent of the rule is that a pilot who has experienced two‐way radio failure should select the appropriate altitude for the particular route segment being flown and make the necessary altitude adjustments for subsequent route segments. If the pilot received an “expect further clearance” containing a higher altitude to expect at a specified time or fix, maintain the highest of the following altitudes until that time/fix:
(1) the last assigned altitude; or
(2) the minimum altitude/flight level for IFR operations.
Upon reaching the time/fix specified, the pilot should commence climbing to the altitude advised to expect. If the radio failure occurs after the time/fix specified, the altitude to be expected is not applicable and the pilot should maintain an altitude consistent with 1 or 2 above. If the pilot receives an “expect further clearance” containing a lower altitude, the pilot should maintain the highest of 1 or 2 above until that time/fix specified in subparagraph (c) Leave clearance limit, below.
EXAMPLE-
A pilot experiencing two‐way radio failure at an assigned altitude of 7,000 feet is cleared along a direct route which will require a climb to a minimum IFR altitude of 9,000 feet, should climb to reach 9,000 feet at the time or place where it becomes necessary (see 14 CFR Section 91.177(b)). Later while proceeding along an airway with an MEA of 5,000 feet, the pilot would descend to 7,000 feet (the last assigned altitude), because that altitude is higher than the MEA.
A pilot experiencing two‐way radio failure while being progressively descended to lower altitudes to begin an approach is assigned 2,700 feet until crossing the VOR and then cleared for the approach. The MOCA along the airway is 2,700 feet and MEA is 4,000 feet. The aircraft is within 22 NM of the VOR. The pilot should remain at 2,700 feet until crossing the VOR because that altitude is the minimum IFR altitude for the route segment being flown.
The MEA between a and b:
5,000 feet. The MEA between b and c: 5,000 feet. The MEA between c and d: 11,000 feet. The MEA between d and e: 7,000 feet. A pilot had been cleared via a, b, c, d, to e. While flying between a and b the assigned altitude was 6,000 feet and the pilot was told to expect a clearance to 8,000 feet at b. Prior to receiving the higher altitude assignment, the pilot experienced two‐way failure. The pilot would maintain 6,000 to b, then climb to 8,000 feet (the altitude advised to expect). The pilot would maintain 8,000 feet, then climb to 11,000 at c, or prior to c if necessary to comply with an MCA at c. (14 CFR Section 91.177(b).) Upon reaching d, the pilot would descend to 8,000 feet (even though the MEA was 7,000 feet), as 8,000 was the highest of the altitude situations stated in the rule (14 CFR Section 91.185).
06-06-2021
, 12:32 PM
) Yes, when flying through turbulent air we often slow down for a slightly more comfortable ride. It's like driving a car on a washboard road. Slow speeds aren't necessarily comfortable, but high speeds can be bone-jarring.What I was thinking when I answered that one is that you are in the approach phase for a longer time, due to vectors and slower speeds, and therefore exposed to the low-altitude bumps longer.
Especially at this time of year, there is often a top to the haze layer of anywhere from 4000 to 10,000 feet. You can see it when there are scattered, puffy cumulus clouds down low. They usually top out right at that level. Below those clouds, it's bumpier and on climbout (especially in GA planes) you'll notice that the ride smooths out once you climb above the cloud level.