Hey I was just watching the show Mayday. It was the episode where the Boeing 777 crashed short of the runway at Heathrow and I noticed there is something hanging off of the vertical stabilizer of the plane. What the heck is it? A bird?

Check 3:10-3:20. http://youtu.be/oRshFR71d8Q

Here slo mo of me filming my tv screen. http://youtu.be/GHDNjKwQmrE

Also I didn't mean to imply that the plane I am referring to was the one that crashed. The one I am referring to is just some footage of a plane they used in the show.

did the pilot screwed up this landing? would "average" pilot crash the plane in this situation?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfB4...eature=related

Looks like a pretty standard crosswind landing.

Hardly standard. This is an extreme crosswind, and gusty by the looks of it. If you were grading it, you'd have to say that he crossed the runway threshold a little high (the goal is 50') and when he aligned the nose to the runway (using left rudder), he failed to roll in sufficient right aileron to maintain his position over the centerline. (Of course, it's also possible the wind gusts significantly increased right at this point, pushing him downwind.)

Realizing that a safe landing was doubtful, the pilot made the excellent decision to go around, which he appeared to do safely. The worst he could do is try to force the plane on the ground when things are going wrong. I'd give the pilot high marks for good judgment on the go-around and I'd reserve any judgment on his flying skills since I wasn't there and I don't know exactly what he was dealing with.

To be honest, I'm just not sure. My gut feeling is that it's probably dealt with on a case-by-case basis. If I think of it tomorrow when I'm home from this trip, I'll check with the local FSDO.

I see what you're talking about and I don't know what it is, but I know it's not a standard thing on any airplane. It kind of looks like a small drogue chute or drag device, but for what purpose I can't imagine. Maybe it's some kind of sensor used during flight testing and provides test data. (That's strictly a wild guess.)

Judging by the condition of some paint jobs I've seen, they can last for many years...pretty much as long as the company wants to put up with it. It's a very expensive process, so the decision to change the company livery is not a small one. Not the least of the expense is the down time for the plane (it doesn't make money sitting in the paint shop).

Ooops I didnt' watch the whole video.

Nice analysis as always. I am surprised you were not familiar with that case yet though? The pilot was actually a she and the incident made news fairly widely at the time

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...539373,00.html

Actually, the he was a she and IIRC the crew wanted a different runway but ATC initially refused the request. The pilot (FO was PF) attempted the landing but went around and ATC relented and opened up a different runway with less crosswind and the aircraft made an uneventful landing. I think there was some discussion between the company and ATC after the event though.

I should add that the story made the news in Europe but probably didn't make it across the pond (I'm in the UK)


Oops... I see I'm partly duplicating the post above.

There are a bunch of clips of extreme crosswind landings on YouTube but I don't remember ever reading a news story about any of them.

Of course, now that I read that it was a woman pilot it all makes sense, amirite?

Just kidding. Serlously, just kidding about that (couldn't resist it).

Funnily enough, it occurred to me only yesterday to ask you how many women there are around in the commercial pilot world in the USA (especially at your level, flying 757s/767s and bigger). I hear quite a few female voices flying for UK regional airlines, also for Air France and Lufthansa but don't hear too many female American voices on this side of the pond (don't hear too many flying for British Airways either).

If I may be so bold to ask,

1) What is your opinion on the head of the FAA doing it and should they be held to a much higher standard than other pilots?

2) What do you think the punishment should be for DUI?

On another note/question, one of my best friends has a private plane and he had a minor stroke last month (partial paralysis on one side.) He is older (I think 62), and he is absolutely devastated that he lost his license for one year (at least that is what he told me.) Part of me really thinks he should be done for life, but of course I would never tell him that. Die hard pilot. What are your thoughts on post-stroke victims flying?

When I was a pax on the UA IAD/BRU run twice a month several years ago (dang, it was 14) I smiled when I saw a grey haired male Capt and a hammer female FO. I smiled at how times had changed. Since then I have had the pleasure of meeting quite a few F16/15 and A10 female pilots and I can tell you that they are focused.

Oh I've got no issue with their ability. Just curious as to how many make it to that level of their chosen profession and whether there's any appreciable difference in numbers (pro rata) between the USA and Europe.

According to this CNN article that I found:

Those are pretty small numbers and my perception is that the percentages haven't changed much over the past decade. I did notice a surge of women pilots in the 90s, but it seems to have stabilized. I'm not sure why that is; maybe a sociologist could give us some insight into it.

Where I have noticed an increase in female representation, and this may just be a perception too, is on the other end of the radio. I seem to talk to as many women controllers as men these days. I'm sure males are still in the majority there too, but it's changed a lot over the last couple of decades.

I'm not sure if any of this should be a cause for concern. I know there are some people who want to see every work force reflect society, i.e. every profession should have percentages of females, males, blacks, whites, latinos, asians, etc, etc that exactly reflect the percentages of those groups in the population. (Please excuse me if any of those terms are not the currently accepted pc terms.) The goal is to avoid discrimination, but it can be hard to achieve these goals if the applicant pool makes it impossible to do. And the fact is that fewer women pursue flying as an avocation or a vocation.

A California judge's decision in the early 90s required United airlines to step up their hiring of females and minorities to more closely reflect the U.S. population and this made it a great time for women and minorities to apply. They were definitely given priority in the hiring process, with some women being hired with very low flight time (much lower than would be required of a male applicant). If you could fog a mirror and had two X chromosomes, United wanted you. I know several qualified women pilots who purposely avoided United, seeking employment elsewhere, because they didn't wanted to be tainted with that broad brush (i.e. to have other pilots think that they got the job just because they were a woman).

I remember during the mid-90s when United was in a hiring boom, they hired most of the women pilots we had at ACA, even the FOs. Meanwhile, most males couldn't even get their foot in the door for an interview.

If any of this sounds like I have something against women pilots, I don't. Not in the least. I welcome anyone to this profession. But I don't think it's a job where we want to use quota considerations in the hiring process.

Sorry, my bad...I wasn't meaning to imply that you were questioning abilities. I was just geezing at how things had changed...for good, I might add. I'd like for my daughter/granddaughter be able to do anything that they are really qualified to do. Thanks to you also for your contributions to this thread.

It's unfortunate for Mr. Babbitt, but he is held to a higher standard because of his position. He's got to lead by example and I think his resignation was the right move for him.

I assume you're talking about an airline pilot here (not Mr. Babbitt's case). I think it's got to be on a case-by-case basis. There are degrees of DUI. I'd hate to see one night's bad judgment, resulting in a little too much drinking and being caught at a sobriety checkpoint with the minimum BAC for DUI, lead to the loss of one's job. Repeat offenses or DUI resulting in severe injury or loss of life, would be more serious, of course.

It may be harder than he thinks to get his medical back. I think the one year may be a minimum time. He'll have some hoops to jump through at the end of the year to satisfy the FAA's doctors. But if the FAA is satisfied, I'm satisfied. They're pretty conservative in their approach to medical issues, so if they say he's ok to resume flying that's good enough for me.

Well, we could get pretty seriously off topic here but women do have distractions (like producing and raising a family) that makes it hard for them to have the single-mindedness that's necessary for them to become a senior pilot. Many/most women just want to be the best mother they can be and that's probably a DNA thing but as I say, we're in danger of seriously digressing here. I suppose the ideal is for everyone, regardless of sex or background to have no artificial impediment to achieving their ambitions.

Anyway, about this flying business....

FWIW, Mayday! (Canada) or Air Crash Investigation (U.S.) is a really well done Canadian program now in its 11th season. At this point they have pretty much covered all of the major accidents from the last 20 years, as well as some that are less well known. They rely heavily on the relevant investigating body for information, as well as aviation consultants, and (when possible obviously) surviving passengers and crew.

The episodes are widely available on Youtube, and air on Nat'l Geographic occasionally.

I also think if you watch some of the episodes covering older incidents, you really get a sense of how much safer air travel is today, even than it was a few decades ago. It really is a shame to learn about some of the weather-related incidents that occurred in the 80s, before there was a better understanding of best-practice in deicing.

I don't think this has been asked yet, but my question is about the meals. I assume you get BusinessElite meals when on TATL -- what do you think of the food? What sort of difference is there with domestic trips in terms of quantity and quality? Has either sort of service gotten better or worse over the years?

The reason I ask is because it seems like there's a disappearing middle class in commercial aviation so I'm wondering if you've noticed that in the meals.

You are correct: we get a Business Elite meal on trans-Atlantic flights. The FA will give us the menu during our pre-flight preparations and we'll list our choices in order of preference. Some FAs (the minority) make sure the pilots get their first choice; others serve the pax and FAs first and we get whatever is leftover. It's not a big deal, just means I get the pasta instead of the beef.

The food is ok but it's the same menu for each calendar month, so it gets old quickly. I haven't noticed any decline in the meal quality since I began international flying five years ago, but I know that it's nowhere near where it once was. In the old days, PanAm used to served Chateaubriand and the service was elegant by comparison to today.

On domestic trips, we get a meal for flights blocked at five hours or more. Thus, on my Vegas trips I get a meal going out but not on the return flight to NY. The meals on domestic trips aren't horrible, but they don't seem as good as the international trips and I often decline them, bringing my own food.

from the spiegel.de report about the crosswind landing above: "A young co-pilot (24) steered the Airbus A320 that almost crashed on Saturday while trying to land in heavy wind. The more experienced 39-year-old pilot then took over to abort the landing and take off again."
they explicitly state that pilot / co-pilot have the same training and perform the same tasks etc. (so they got it correct from what i learned in here).
my question is this: how often does it happen that the more experienced person in the cockpit does the landing even though it was originally planned otherwise if the circumstances are really bad? does this change if the co-pilot is as experienced as you are (or in contrast really young as the one in the article)? etc.

Almost never, unless the PF (pilot flying) actually speaks up and asks the other guy to take over. I'm trying to think if I've ever witnessed this and can't think of an instance. Back when I was a flight instructor/check airman for ACA, there were times with new hires where I would tell them that I'd be glad to take it if they were feeling overwhelmed (e.g. in very gusty conditions) and it may have happened a few times, but I can't honestly think of a specific case.

There may also be cases where the Captain decides to take over because of a lack of confidence in the FO. Again, I can't think of an instance that I've witnessed, but I'm sure this has happened. I have had times (again, as a flight instructor with a new hire) where I've done this pre-emptively, i.e. decided to take the leg because the winds and weather at the destination were pretty bad. It's easier to do this beforehand, rather than take over in flight...kind of face saving.

Yes, we're all trained to the same standards, but there's something to be said for familiarity and comfort with the airplane. After a while, a plane becomes like an old shoe and the flying/energy management becomes second nature. This isn't necessarily true when flying a new type. A lot more conscious thought has to go into the mechanics of flying it.