Well I know by now you don't realize why you're wrong either (you are) or why you're not very convincing (you're not, so yeah), but I was just curious why you're asking about how people are posting now. Sounds like an excuse to just make an extra post yourself, saying what you've already said.

I'll tell you why I'm repeating myself - it's so the noob lurkers don't start to get the impression you're right, just because you've made more posts. (There is a tendency toward that sort of thinking in humans.)

Successful teaching/coaching has very little to do with the kind of success you're talking about. Poker is *not* different from any other endeavor in this respect. There are so many examples of this (successful practitioners being poor teachers, and unsuccessful practitioners being good teachers), that I kind of giggle at your failure to understand it. (success being a relative thing of course) I mean, so many that I feel silly even trying to point them out.

Hey Guys,

I am actively trying to get the book into the hands of more well respected players on this site so that the information is vetted and can stand on its own.

Although I have my own opinions on whether a "good coach" must be a big volume player etc, I also am very sensitive to the fact that this is a hot topic right now on 2+2 with so many US players turning to coaching and making videos now that the options for playing are limited. I hope that eventually the talk will turn to the quality of information rather than my playing history as the book becomes more widely distributed.

Also, there are some very specific financial reasons for why I do not have a more substantial playing history. I didn't really want to get into it publicly but I am happy to field questions on it privately if SiQ or others want to PM me. Needless to say, not everything is as it appears on the surface but I am not comfortable talking about it more since the situation is ongoing.

Regards,
zero

The problem is that players who are not very good will give poor advice without even realising it. The problem with not playing the games coached is that the coach will become out of touch and will not know how the games play out and which strategies no longer work. The latter becomes true of previously good players/coaches/poker books as well.

I appreciate your efforts. This board can definitely make you run the gauntlet at times.

I don't know if you're results alone are the issue. I think the problem is it's very difficult for US-based players to play SNG's profitably since Black Friday.

You're charging a significant amount of money for the book. I can appreciate the time and effort that went into the project including recording the videos.

I think the combination of the price, and that you are a relatively unknown makes people question the investment in the book. I mentioned Blackrain before. His book is gotten excellent reviews here. Here's the thing, at 20 bucks a US-based player can take a flyer on the book and earn the money back quickly. But if you're US-based to make a large enough deposit to make the investment in your book worthwhile it definitely is a risk that you will never see your money again. As you well know many of us are owed significant money from Fulltilt. I am not going to just deposit on merge for example, knowing that I will probably never see the money again. Add the friction of the cost of your book for example you're making a large investment into something that is basically like subscribing to a game like Farmville and buying the special vegetable.

So the problem is you may have an excellent book but much of the profit potential for US player is removed so it makes it like a how-to book for a hobby not like past poker coaching as a potential significant income source. Which brings the hundred dollar list price and $69 introductory special into question.

I am also concerned that this is experimental pricing. In a few months just like the several hundred dollar e-books It's very possible the price will go down significantly. With the current US situation and that good sng strategy is not fresh and new. ICM end game and tight play early can take you a long way, I don't think that being an early adopter of your book is necessarily a wise decision.

actually had a free evening but the link you sent me via email isn't working. have the two spreadsheets you sent.




spike, ffs im not definitively saying someone is or isn't a good coach - I'm saying that if you sell coaching or coaching material you should have a track record of beating the games or at the very least real evidence of your coaching working for others (graphs, testimonials from known/respected players). if we don't request that then anyone can make all kinds of claims and sell coaching/materials and saturate the market and basically rob customers.

you strike me as one of those guys who just likes to argue and imagine they are always right, but i'm actually a successful coach who also beats the games so maybe we can pretend i know more than you about this subject just this one time. just for ****s and giggles.

I'll ship you a new link and an updated password. You will likely need to download the new file if was not a .zip since the old .exe file was disabled.

Regards,
zero

I'm not sure exactly what's going on, but I would never, ever, ever run an executable that presumably contains a book and other files. That's just stupid. Why would you use a file format that is ideal for passing along viruses and trojan?

No need to stress - just download it and then scan it with your virus checker, before opening, if you are worried. Simple.

My version had no virus.

Because, as Pagination said, you can easily scan it and see there is not virus in it. The thought of me (or anyone else who cared about their reputation on 2+2) passing out a virus in a for-pay product is laughable. I'd have to hide out with Howard Lederer and would probably make approximately one book sale before there was a 1000 post thread about it.

How is that profitable?

zero

I'm a limit player, but I watched the Sng ABC series on DragTheBar for some light relief. I have to say the standard of teaching was excellent. The series very well prepared, structured and delivered. As somebody that has studied/practiced teaching outside of poker I found that it was actually up to the mark in terms of delivery, which was a welcome surprise.

I actually have a PhD in a technical field and had at one point considered going into teaching because I really enjoy it. I am very proud that the ABC SNG series has garnered so much praise. As someone who has sat through a lot of bad lectures/classes, I also really appreciate your comment and thank you for it.

Regards,
zero

So I spoke to Greg tonight, seems like a nice enough guy, and I finally got the PDF and gave it a read tonight.
Fair warning I didn't read every single paragraph and mostly skimmed through and stopped at what I thought were the more critical portions - a lot of the material is very basic and I don't really have that much free time… OK, I do, but I'd rather spend it on more important things like watching the new 30rock feeding the homeless.


The book seems like it is laid out and written pretty well which isn't surprising since Greg seems like a pretty smart/articulate guy and I already figured he'd be good at teaching in general.
From what I see it mostly serves as an intro to SnGs, it covers a lot of basic terms and scenarios for SnGs - info that is readily available for free on the internet but to be fair just compiling the info and laying it out so well is worth something.

I guess I'll break down the book into the 3 sections I would divide the book into; intro/early play, mid-late/pivot points, and heads up.


Intro / Early:
I think it's good as an intro to SnGs, goes over a lot of basics about ICM, pot-odds, ICM-tax, etc. in detail which is really well written out.
some of the hand examples and advice seem too general, don't take into account villain tendencies and really just seem to promote a very cookie-cutter style of play - it mentions deviation but doesn't actually get into it at all. The post-flop play mentioned is not especially good.
I think a brand new player would get use out of this, but it would obviously leave him with a lot of need for improvement if he wants to beat anything but low stakes.


Mid-Late / Pivot Points:
Mid and late are broken up into two sections in this book but I think effectively it can work as one chapter.
The basic idea behind "pivot points" isn't anything new, imo. Figure out what you think the average "tight/loose/random" player types will be shoving/calling in your opinion and memorize the response ranges to those in the most common situations - use this as a base upon which you'll have to adjust in different dynamics. The difference is when I teach this I call it "try to figure out what you think different player type's ranges are in different spots and then memorize what the response is so you have a base to adjust from" and you call it "pivot points".
I also get the feeling that this method makes that "base" range (or pivot point) you come up with way too important, neglecting a bit the importance of how sensitive ranges are to changes in some game dynamics.
When I coach I try to stress the importance of learning how different factors make changes in a base range, like when the guy shoving into you for your effective 9bb stack has a 10bb stack himself, or a 20bb stack - or when someone over-values calling shoves with weaker Ax hands or Kx hands - it helps to get students to a point of being able to intuitively make adjustments in game more efficiently and understand why XX turns into a fold, instead of just knowing that it does. I don't think your method completely prohibits the student from getting to that point, but I do think it can serve as a crutch that slows them down.

In all fairness most of my students are guys who are struggling at mid-stakes+ and find me to help them break through so they can play higher - I do have experience coaching greener players but it's more limited… This may be a better way to introduce novice players to ICM over telling them to just review a ton and memorize but it's probably not optimal long term.


Heads Up:
worst section of the book by far. mostly mentions of nash ranges which is just silly especially considering this book should be mostly aimed at low-stakes novices.
playing hunl against probably the worst group of hunl players in the nlhe world (low-stakes stt players) and using a nash system is horrible.



In closing I think the book is very well written and laid out. It covers a lot of the basics quite well. I think a lot of this book would be useful for novice players to low-stakes sngs.
the "pivot points" isn't really anything new or ground-breaking - the way the book lays it out may be useful for introducing new players to push/fold/re-steal but I'm not entirely convinced it's an optimal method - not going to be extremely useful for intermediate players.
This book will likely turn a breakeven/losing player into a winner in small stakes, but I doubt will be very useful beyond that.


Overall I'm not very surprised. The way the book is laid out is impressive, the content is so-so-ish.
Like I've said; Greg seems smart, articulate and good at teaching - but he's not extremely experienced and learning from Moshman isn't enough to make up for it (I personally don't even think Moshman is particularly good at poker/sngs).




Greg,
I know you wanted me to check out some of the bubble-factor adjustments and nuances you added but I've been rambling for a long time and I'm about to pass out - I'll try to re-read most of the book tomorrow and read into those parts more and give you my input and maybe see if I misread anything the first go.
FWIW I think your skill at laying this all out is impressive.

If you do this you deserve to be infected. There is absolutely no valid reason for any book to be in executable format.

You might not be familiar with anti-virus technology. They don't magically detect everything everywhere under every condition. There's a reason those virus definitions need to be up to date, and there's a reason people can still get infected even if they are up to date and protected.

I can think of many, many ways to make an infection profitable while preserving plausible deniability. AV products don't detect everything, new viruses come out all the time, and there is absolutely, positively no good reason, ever, for an e-book to be an executable format. That is so ******ed from a security standpoint that I can't believe you would be doing it. It's just out and out ridiculous.

There is no good published material to beat high stakes anything.



From all the people that are claiming you can be a good coach and not a good player-
none of these people are ever good players and bad coaches.......
I think you can be a good player and a bad coach but not a bad player and a good
coach!!!

With respect, your post is sensationalist scaremongering. Do you REALLY think a commercial entity would infect its product? Why? What benefit would this provide?

The file can only be downloaded from the author's server, and the only way it would ever be infected is if someone hacked the server and replaced the file with an infected one.

Or, if a "friend" unscrupulously emails you an amended and infected file. Not that you would be able to access the content, of course, because you would need to purchase it from the author for it to be activated.

You are clearly terrified of .exe files. The irony is, of course, is that if you downloaded a virus programme (Norton etc), it would be an .exe file.

Best not open it, eh...?

Thanks for this review - I think we needed a highly respected player to post his thoughts!

A quick question re: the above point you make (and I am learning myself, so forgive me if I am wrong), but isn't the above example re:10bb/20bb shoving range dealt with (not explicitly) in the ICM discussions within the book?

Ie, the 20bb shoving range could be wider than the 10bb shove range, as chips are worth less the more you have, thus 20bb can shove wider etc etc? Obviously, this is an example in a vacuum and doesn't take account of bubble/table dynamic etc etc.

This is just tin foil hat stuff. I am using a DRM protection software that has been on the market for about 6 years called hyprlock.pdf.

Basically it tries to ensure integrity of a locked .pdf file by wrapping the file in a program so that rather than having to supply the password directly to the .pdf, you supply an activation code and the software transparently passes the password to the .pdf. As I understand it this is one of the few ways to protect from the drm being stripped since if a user has the real .pdf password they can hack the permissions password.

The program also allows me to dynamically turn licenses on and off so that I can offer a refund and ensure that the user "returns" the product.

To me the benefits of using this software (better protection and being able to provide refunds) make up for the downside of users being suspicious of the .exe format.

That is why I chose it. Just like everything else with this book I have had to make a lot of judgement calls with very little experience on selling and marketing an ebook. However, I have not had a lot of users state that they would love to buy the book but are afraid of the format. If that is the case I will re-evaluate how the process works.

Regards,
zero

SiQ,

Thanks for taking the time to write a review. I would like to open a productive discussion on a few of the topics you brought up. I hope you don't view it as argumentative. That is not the intention.

This is probably the biggest compromise I had to make with the book. I chose to emphasize the Pivot Points rather than low blind play, because I believe pivot points are the area in literature that is not really covered in current books on the market. There are actually a lot of good references that cover low blind play in SNG's, so I chose not to expand this section beyond what I believe is a really interesting tool for avoiding tough pot commitment situations.

By focusing on the 1-3bet strategy, players who are still learning the game, will start by thinking more about how you play low blinds in terms of how many bets you want to commit to the pot. This is a really important concept because players learning the game are not thinking ahead in a hand. I agree that there are a lot of very game specific situations I have left out, but I think that if players use this as a foundation for starting to vary their post flop play they are going to be able to pick up the other stuff along the way. To balance this I did discuss how to mix up your play from this strategy, as well as talked about opening up your game early to get people thinking outside of the box and beyond this basic framework.

Maybe this concept is new and maybe it is not, but it is certainly in my opinion new to the current literature. When I was learning SNG's I watched a lot of videos and read all of the available books and this simply was not the way people were openly teaching them at the time. Most of the current resources still focus on using SNG wizard to analyze specific situations after the fact rather than to build a base strategy for play which can be adjusted on the fly.

One of the things I hope is emphasized in the book is that pivot points are picked specifically to be stable. If a pivot doesn't work pretty well in a repeatable way then it is a range that is not useful. There are some points like the magic range that simply do not ever change much regardless of situation.

There is also another point about adjusting ranges based on the game dynamics that pivots make much easier. By having a complete set of them it actually sets end points that can be used. For example say you are deciding to call a shove and based on the position and effective stack of the player shoving you determine the correct pivot point. Now based on the game specific situation you decide you need to call looser. The pivots have been chosen so that each point also is surrounded by other points that act as a end point for adjustment. Simply going to the next looser pivot in many cases gives a very good approximation of "how much" to adjust. Typically players learning the game overadjust. I think this system makes adjusting to game specific situations actually much easier to teach.

This is something that we can probably just agree to disagree on. I don't really know for certain and I don't think you are taking a strong stance on it either so its probably not worth arguing about, but I believe that my system actually speeds up the ability to learn to make intuitive adjustments.

I will have to disagree with you here as well. I think if a player is not willing to re-evaluate their game as they move through the stakes and adjust this method then they will undoubtedly fail. However, one of the focuses of the videos to focus on how the system adapts and what new thought processes are necessary to move up.

The point of the mid stakes videos is to demonstrate that this is possible and point out how the decision making process is adapted but is still grounded in the fundamental principles that I discuss in the book.

I will consider expanding this portion of the book based on this comment. I have a bit of experience in HUSNG but was trying to keep things simple. There is likely some room to expand here.
Thanks again for the review. I think it was fair and appreciate your taking the time.

Regards,
Greg

I think discussing the book would be valuable for everyone taking the time to come into the thread, other then the posters that only want to troll the author.

I would think to be complete you would cover sage, nash or chubukov and the advantages and disadvantages of each for end game play. Also if there is a time to play more exploitively HU. Rather then only using Game theory/ICM based play.

It is one thing to teach a player how to cash by playing tight early and then using ICM late to cash to become modestly profitable. Compared to finishing well HU once you cash. Here you can transform modestly profitabl player into a very profitable player. Players understand ICM at the bubble pretty well these days. Sure then don't always shove optimally, but most players understand the basic concept here.

If you can get HU and the blinds are not at auto shove levels this is where I see the biggest weakness in opponents, thus opportunity for profit in Sng's.

We are back to price. At $30 bucks I can see room for a SNG system for new players in the current poker economy that includes the book, video's and charts based on SiQ's review. But at $100 even at $69 I would expect this book would be a treatise on SNG play, moving through various levels beginner to advanced.

By not completely covering sage, nash or chubukov and discussing more exploitive play does concern me.

I think you are misinterpreting what SiQ's comment was (or maybe I am). I think it related specifically to wanting to see more information for how to play exploitatively when Nash is not appropriate, and that he does not feel it is appropriate to use Nash at the low stakes. I have been thinking about this for a bit but will respond in a separate post. My book covers a lot of information about when and when not to use Nash outside of HU, but when it gets to HU it mostly just covers how to implement Nash. My assumption was that once players understand how to implement nash, adjusting for player types (similar to all other points in the tournament) would be a breeze. This is also covered in at least one of the video's HU sections where I talk about adjusting to the specific player.

Covering Sage however is not necessary. in the book have completely covered an alternative method to memorize Nash equilibrium which I believe is easier to implement. So covering Sage would be redundant.

Whether I should have covered Chubikov, or focused on using it rather than Nash is up for debate. However since you said OR, I think your comment implied that not covering all of these topics is necessary. I can assure you that I did not ignore them, and did at least cover 2 out of the three you mentioned completely.

I am pretty much done arguing over the cost. We can all sit around and try to decide together whether 200pgs, or 300pgs, or some topic, or whatever would make the book worth more. I think it is worth what I am selling it for. I am so confidant of that fact that I have offered a money back guarantee to ensure that anyone who does not feel that they got their money's worth can get a refund.

So far, I have gotten great feedback from a lot of people who have purchased the book, and I have not received 1 request for a refund yet. Its not like every person must purchase every poker book. If someone is more comfortable getting started with an $8 copy of SNG Strategy, then I would happily point them to the amazon link for it. (or 2+2 website)

All I can say is that at this price point, people seem to be buying and liking it. Oh and BTW, I do consider this book to be a treatise as you mentioned on how to learn SNG's and move up through the ranks. I think it is the closest thing out there with respect to that on the market. Whether you think it delivers or fails is open to interpretation.

Regards,
zero

The current SNG climate is a tough one. Being one of the top winners at mid-high stakes (to the extent that higher games even run now) clearly requires skills that extend beyond the focus of this book, such as a deep understanding of post-flop play. I think Greg would be the first to acknowledge this.

For a beginning or intermediate player though, a resource that breaks down all the basics in a clear and well-written way can be invaluable. Learning basic strategies for post-flop play, how to approach the push/fold segment of the game, make the right bubble adjustments, etc. This is what the course is designed to accomplish, and I believe succeeds at very well.

Also while it’s easy to block your stats (and plenty of coaches do that), Greg has always been completely upfront about his play history. He’s a full-time engineer/researcher who has gone out of his way to find time to play and coach. I think having a 5% ROI in 9-mans is pretty solid, particularly when a lot of those games are super-turbo where edges are much thinner.

Wp sir

Collin nice to see you posting in the thread.

The current SNG climate is a tough one Collin. When your book came out you could be a very profitable player playing SNG's.

Unless you travel to the WSOP and become a satty specialist I question any US based player being able to play sng's as more than a hobby. Unless you are a non-us based player I question the investment in this book.

Zero says he is done talking pricing, but the problem is it's very difficult for US-based players to play SNG's profitably since Black Friday.

He is charging a significant amount of money for the book. I can appreciate the time and effort that went into the project including recording the videos. I think the combination of the price, with a relatively unknown author makes me question the investment in the book.

I mentioned Blackrain before. His book is gotten excellent reviews here. Here's the thing, at 20 bucks a US-based player can take a flyer on the book and earn the money back quickly. But, if you're US-based to make a large enough online deposit to make the investment in this book worthwhile playing sng's it is definitely is a risk that you will never see your money again.

As you well know, many of us are owed significant money from Fulltilt. I will not just deposit on merge; for example, knowing that I will probably never see the money again. Add the friction of the cost of this book for example you're making a large investment into something that is like subscribing to a game like Farmville and buying the special vegetable. I bet you could crush play money sng's using this system. Great but that brings the hundred dollar list price and $69 introductory special into question here.

Collin your book and video's on Stox were some of the best SNG information I had exposer to. It fascinates me the criticism your book takes from time to time on this board. Only Sheets sng stuff on PXF was as good. I am curious your reaction to this post in 2012 not the 2008 poker world.

I don't know if you play sngs much these days but the $15s on PS are quite tough. Greg's standard is ok for the $7 games. Your own book seems to cover the areas you mention.

Yes he is relatively inexperienced and not very good. Is that any basis for passing on his "expertise" with $100 an hour coaching and $100 books ? I'd be LOOKING for coaching if my play was only at that level. I've seen his vids and his post flop play, use of hud and hand reading was not very good. I don't blame him for this there is no substitute for experience.

Zerosum79 didn't win at all in the superturbos and didn't win at the $22s. He did quite well in the games up to $11 until 2010 on Full Tilt but those games were very soft in 2009 and earlier.


Greg is doubtless a clever and charming individual who can present himself and his work in a pleasant and well organised way but is that any good if the work is lacking in good content due to a lack of technical knowledge ? At the end of the day he wants $100 a time for his technical know how.

I'll be curious to see what Collin has to say about your post as well.

You do realize that a lot of the reasons why Collin got friction when coming out with his book was because he was a relatively unknown author and player right?

HB - I will make you a deal. I will sell you a copy at $20. I will allow you to own the book with the same money back guarantee as anyone else who purchases the book. All I ask is that after you are done reading it and studying it:

a) You post an honest review including addressing what you think it is actually worth to a US and Non US player.
b) If you like it, ship me what ever additional amount of money you think it might have been worth to a US player. If that is $0 additional, than ship me nothing. If you think it was worth less than $20, I will refund your money.

Regards,
zero